[TrashMan]

Just because Mass Effect 3's style of ending narrative is new and unconventional doesn't mean it's good.  Why do you defend such awful writing?  I don't even care about the ultimate outcome of the galaxy; the ending is like they hired Gainax to produce it.

Didn't say it was good. But you see, here we have a disconnect about what exactly about the ending sucks.

The final outcomes? Nope.
Death of crewmates? Nope.
Plot holes ane inconsistencies? Yes. (the colored shockwave delivery falls under this)

Ultimatively it's how it is.
I hated it. I hated the new Star Trek movie. There are so many great things that went astray in various movies/books/series it fills me with barely contained rage, to the point of dispair.
ME is not the first promising franchise "ruined". Won't be the last.
But ultimatively, all those things are just entertainint provided to us. We really can't make demands and can't force ourselves into the creative process. We can only suck it up and move on. Or pretend that episode/plot/sequel never happened. Or write fanfic that's better.

[Spicious]

[newman]

But ultimatively, all those things are just entertainint provided to us. We really can't make demands and can't force ourselves into the creative process. We can only suck it up and move on.

In most cases, sure. But when a vast majority of the audience - seems to be about 90% - is thoroughly disappointed with the exact same feature of the product, and you have a medium that is easily changed / updated / fixed, I don't see a problem if they choose to do it. If the mistakes are so glaringly obvious, why not at least try to effect change? It's not like they gave us these games. When you take the prices of all 3 games, included all the paid DLC, we come to a hefty sum per user. Of course they should have creative control over their own product, but when 90% of your paying community absolutely hates the same thing about that product, then maybe it's time to use that creative control to improve it.

[General Battuta]

its pretty much assured that a new ending DLC is coming. due to the fact that the real ending script was leaked before ME3 was suposed to come out. so bioware nuked the leaked ending made a temp one, but because they had a date released this one. its quite obvious from the current ending that sheppard was indoctrinated ever since he got hit by harbinger.

We all wanted to believe this, but it's pretty clear by now that BioWare never had that in mind.

As for the whole 'art' thing, a lot of great art had its ending revised after the fact. Blade Runner had an awful ending in its theatrical release; it was revised. Cat on a Hot Tin Roof had its ending revised due to audience feedback after its first performance. And creative endeavors often take a lot of fan input. A video game called Mass Effect 2 was written to incorporate a ton of fan suggestions.

[Spoon]

Found this interesting post from Arinn Dembo:

*snip*

Oh the irony
Quoting someone from a game development team that released their game, for full price, in a state that isn't even worth calling beta. Not exactly an authority on the subject.

Also, you can adress two different points in the same post. No need to double or triple post. (Ya'd figure someone with over 10k posts on this forum would know this by now)

[Jeff Vader]

I'm not gonna take part in this discussion in any way (haven't played this at all yet), but

(Ya'd figure someone with over 10k posts on this forum would know this by now)

You can acquire over 10k posts quicker if you double/triple-post.

[Herra Tohtori]

And creative endeavors often take a lot of fan input.

SHIVAN SUPER LASER SHOOT

[TrashMan]

But ultimatively, all those things are just entertainint provided to us. We really can't make demands and can't force ourselves into the creative process. We can only suck it up and move on.

In most cases, sure. But when a vast majority of the audience - seems to be about 90%

Sauce?

- is thoroughly disappointed with the exact same feature of the product, and you have a medium that is easily changed / updated / fixed, I don't see a problem if they choose to do it. If the mistakes are so glaringly obvious, why not at least try to effect change? It's not like they gave us these games. When you take the prices of all 3 games, included all the paid DLC, we come to a hefty sum per user. Of course they should have creative control over their own product, but when 90% of your paying community absolutely hates the same thing about that product, then maybe it's time to use that creative control to improve it.

IF they choose to do it. Again, difference between mistakes and opppinions. The notion that the percieved mistakes HAVE to be fixed. The notion that because you paid for it, you HAVE to enjoy every bit of it.
Part of the fanbase is practicly trynig to force/push/coerce Bio into changing it. Which is both sad and funny.

[TrashMan]

A video game called Mass Effect 2 was written to incorporate a ton of fan suggestions.

Too bad it still sucks story-wise.

[TrashMan]

Found this interesting post from Arinn Dembo:

*snip*

Oh the irony
Quoting someone from a game development team that released their game, for full price, in a state that isn't even worth calling beta. Not exactly an authority on the subject.

More authority than you ever have..being a writer and such. And working in the industry.
And given Kerberos support for their games, your remark becomes even more ironic.


Oh, and I go trough posts one-by-one. Easier to keep track off.

[The E]

Trashman, stop multiple-posting. You make yourself look like an idiot who wants ALL the attention.

[Mikes]

Bioware "choice" these days = Would you like to do your TPS reports a) with a smile b) with an angry face c) Tell me what TPS reports are before I decide.

[Mongoose]

What I find really hilarious about that Shakespeare comparison is that Will was writing those plays for the sole purpose of getting performed by his troupe.  Y'know, to make money.  If he wrote an ending that most of his audience hated, and he felt like he could have improved the reaction by changing it, he would have done so in a heartbeat.

[Dark RevenantX]

A tragic end to ME3 would be fine if it was well-written, not full of holes, made sense, and was properly explained.

Shakespeare tragedies are (generally) all of the above, which makes them great.  I don't see any of us complaining about Mordin's death because, even though it's a tragic ending to his character, it was meaningful and emotionally engaging.

[General Battuta]

Yeah, if the game's ending were just a retread of Tuchanka (shep you have to go into the catalyst core/send a henchman into the catalyst core but whoever goes in will die, i have been and always will be your friend) I think people would've been satiated. There'd be grumbling about it, but no volcanic outrage.

[TrashMan]

Trashman, stop multiple-posting. You make yourself look like an idiot who wants ALL the attention.

Single-post or multi-post. What's the difference? None..except for hte visual one.

In heated thread that move fast, by the time oyu consolidate 2-3 answers into one post, the convo has already moved far away.

[The E]

Trashman, the discussion only seems to be moving fast because of your habit of multiposting.

[Ravenholme]

I can't believe I only JUST noticed the typo in the title of the thread >.<

[The E]

It's not a typo. It's a reference to the last moments of Emily Wong.

[NGTM-1R]

http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/16663664.jpg

Dropping my usual Watsonian explanation when it comes to Holmes for awhile, let's address why this was a stupid thing to post, because it demonstrates our point and not yours.

Sherlock Holmes took a header over Reichenbach Falls not because of any compelling story reasons or **** like that, but because Conan Doyle was throwing a hissy fit.

Conan Doyle later went back and changed it so Holmes survived, acknowledging in the process that he had placed his personal distaste for and disillusionment with the character ahead of the concerns of his art, his pocketbook, and the internal logic of the stories.

As Bioware has placed their desired ending above the concerns of their art, their pocketbook, and the internal logic of their stories.