[watsisname]

BS.

More BS.

Perhaps unfair for me to reply to this now that this is in GenDisc, but I'll say it anyway: 
If your ability to respond to an argument is limited to saying "BS" without any form of elaboration or supporting statements, then you probably should not post a response at all.

[deathfun]

I press reply and only to find myself on the seventh page...

Read thread, same post would've ensued
Only difference being is MP, you based an earlier argument on the assumption that because people use 'rape' in it's slang meaning, they're lessening it's severity in doing so. Simply because they use a slang meaning for it, doesn't necessarily denote that the word has lost it's official significance.

(Little segment for memory refresh "It's taking a word that has a horrific meaning and repurposing it to lessen the actual nature of the acts it denotatively describes, marginalizing a victimized population even further.")

I joke about suicide all the time, what does that make me?

Sidenote: Laughed at Nuke's little tidbits

[General Battuta]

I press reply and only to find myself on the seventh page...

Read thread, same post would've ensued
Only difference being is MP, you based an earlier argument on the assumption that because people use 'rape' in it's slang meaning, they're lessening it's severity in doing so. Simply because they use a slang meaning for it, doesn't necessarily denote that the word has lost it's official significance.

(Little segment for memory refresh "It's taking a word that has a horrific meaning and repurposing it to lessen the actual nature of the acts it denotatively describes, marginalizing a victimized population even further.")

I joke about suicide all the time, what does that make me?

Sidenote: Laughed at Nuke's little tidbits

Hopefully now you at least have a better understanding of how people around you feel when you act that way.

Suicide is a tragic act, but it's not one with a large culture of permissivity...though it, too is definitely socially contagious, and if you joke about it all the time: are you okay? You've made remarks about feeling socially isolated and alone.

[MP-Ryan]

Only difference being is MP, you based an earlier argument on the assumption that because people use 'rape' in it's slang meaning, they're lessening it's severity in doing so. Simply because they use a slang meaning for it, doesn't necessarily denote that the word has lost it's official significance.

Meaning comes from denotation and connotation.  The denotation may not change, but you repeat something frequently enough in a different context and its connotation will.  E.g. the contextual connotative meaning of "That's gay" is now widely known as "That's stupid."

Interesting that you mention humour.  Humour may trivialize an issue, but it's also a disarmament technique to get people thinking about a contentious or difficult topic.  Humour exists around all kinds of taboo subjects, and some of the best comics in the business knowingly use this.  Nothing wrong with that; rather, it's actually a pretty effective way of getting around the social taboos of talking about sensitive topics.

[Nuke]

i cannot in good conscience commit suicide without an accompanying body count that is at least equivalent to or greater than the casualties of hiroshima. if i cannot carry out my grand mission of the nuclear destruction of the human race, i must at least inspire others to do so.

[MP-Ryan]

i cannot in good conscience commit suicide without an accompanying body count that is at least equivalent to or greater than the casualties of hiroshima. if i cannot carry out my grand mission of the nuclear destruction of the human race, i must at least inspire others to do so.

Sounds like you, sir, need to start a cult.

[watsisname]

It's not nearly insane enough, needs some kind of lore involving comet-trailing ancient alien spaceships and kool aid.

[pecenipicek]

It's not nearly insane enough, needs some kind of lore involving comet-trailing ancient alien spaceships and kool aid.

well... you've seen nuke's pictures, havent you?

[deathfun]

and if you joke about it all the time: are you okay? You've made remarks about feeling socially isolated and alone.

I'm fine

Hopefully now you at least have a better understanding of how people around you feel when you act that way.

See, I already have this understanding. Difference being is I still have no issue with it's use. "We got raped" is just another slang meaning. I don't care much for it
However, someone saying "I want to rape his child" compels me to track his IP and murder him

The act as opposed to the hyperbole. This is where a line is drawn, and I'm going out on a limb saying people know this

Meaning comes from denotation and connotation.  The denotation may not change, but you repeat something frequently enough in a different context and its connotation will.  E.g. the contextual connotative meaning of "That's gay" is now widely known as "That's stupid."

This is where your argument fails. It may be widely known, but that doesn't mean people no longer know the original meaning of it. Afterall, everyone who I've done the whole "Of course I'm happy" to roll their eyes (what they said being "You're so gay")

Where you argument doesn't fail, is if someone is taught a word without having seen it's slang evolution. An example being, a toddler. If he's taught that gay means stupid all his life... gay then means stupid

If he's taught rape means heavy loss, he's then going to think only that

Thing is though, the idiot father knows both aren't true.

[General Battuta]

'Rape' does not mean 'lose in a video game' for a lot of the people around you. It means 'something I'm scared of every day, and that I have a 25%-35% chance of experiencing, which will color the rest of my life.'

And that's what they think about every time you say it, no matter what you think you mean. Are you familiar with the phrase 'trigger warning'?

[Nuke]

rape is just one more little faucet in my mosaic of reasons why i hate humanity. as are the misuses of english vocabulary. to use the such a simple term, even metaphorically, seems to show a lack of mastery in finding the right word for the situation. some while ago i noticed the very act of going on battlenet resulted it me reverting to the maturity to that of a 13 year old. my use of the n word sky rocketed and i find myself falling into the norm of being as offensive as possible for no apparent reason. when somone lagged up the game i found while everyone was saying that people who lag were gay, instead of following the heard like the rest of the sheeple, i stated replacing my use of the term 'gay' with the term 'homosexual'. this actually offended people more! people who were already saying the same exact thing. same with rape, i replaced statements like 'you got raped!' with 'you just took it up the back side! no ky! AND YOU LIKED IT!!!' im pretty sure that offended somone, but i got a load of luls out of it too. just goes to show that a little insult creativity goes a long way.

[FireSpawn]

This thread is both entertaining AND educational. So far after reading it, my wisdom has gone up +30.

[watsisname]

'Rape' does not mean 'lose in a video game' for a lot of the people around you. It means 'something I'm scared of every day, and that I have a 25%-35% chance of experiencing, which will color the rest of my life.'

That is a very unfortunate statistic. 

[deathfun]

'Rape' does not mean 'lose in a video game' for a lot of the people around you. It means 'something I'm scared of every day, and that I have a 25%-35% chance of experiencing, which will color the rest of my life.'

And that's what they think about every time you say it, no matter what you think you mean. Are you familiar with the phrase 'trigger warning'?

This is where I drop a few things here "Social Judgment" and "Knowing your audience"
Have gamers gone around saying this in public? I don't hear someone describing "we got raped" at basketball games, soccer games, or whatever have you. I have heard people use it in paintball games though, and it isn't met with scold, but rather agreement (men and women alike)

The people at the sports games, are also the same ones who go on CoD and say "We got raped".

Your argument is based on the assumption that we don't know the difference, and go around to not like-minded people describing us getting raped at the latest sports game


If gamers did that, your statistic showing would hold basis in this argument. However, we're talking about a community of gamers yelling at eachother through games, not our local NHL game

[Mr. Vega]

It's futile to police the inappropriate use of words by means of authority. It's impossible to wade into all the shades of gray and render a black and white decision. People end up despising the admins more than the language.

Just police yourselves dammit. I know it's the internet and ostracism isn't the force it is in real life, but the only way this is going to work is if you create an exceedingly unfriendly environment to people who transgress the standard (and regardless of what people like Trashmen say, there is a reasonable standard of respect that can and should be expected, adjusted to each particular social context) and implicitly and explicitly promoting that standard, with administrative action reserved only for the most extreme cases on which there is mass agreement.

And don't use the words "offensive" or "insensitive" to justify action. People can be sensitive to or be offended by anything, regardless of its merit. Use words that imply a universal standard like respect. Gives the assholes less words to wriggle their way out of your grasp when you catch them. Call them morons if you have to. The focus has to be on their behavior, not "what we want in our community".

Now can we all get back to being friendly with each other? This isn't worth it.

burn trashman the witch!

[General Battuta]

'Rape' does not mean 'lose in a video game' for a lot of the people around you. It means 'something I'm scared of every day, and that I have a 25%-35% chance of experiencing, which will color the rest of my life.'

And that's what they think about every time you say it, no matter what you think you mean. Are you familiar with the phrase 'trigger warning'?

This is where I drop a few things here "Social Judgment" and "Knowing your audience"
Have gamers gone around saying this in public? I don't hear someone describing "we got raped" at basketball games, soccer games, or whatever have you. I have heard people use it in paintball games though, and it isn't met with scold, but rather agreement (men and women alike)

The people at the sports games, are also the same ones who go on CoD and say "We got raped".

Your argument is based on the assumption that we don't know the difference, and go around to not like-minded people describing us getting raped at the latest sports game

How do you know who around you is a rape survivor, or the friend or loved one of a rape survivor? Is there a badge you can spot that I'm missing?

Looking solely at the problem of triggering - how are you sure you're not?

It's futile to police the inappropriate use of words by means of authority. It's impossible to wade into all the shades of gray and render a black and white decision. People end up despising the admins more than the language.

I don't think anyone's suggested any forum of forum police here. People have just said 'if you do this, you are probably an asshole' - which is exactly what you're suggesting.

Now can we all get back to being friendly with each other? This isn't worth it.

Really? I (and many others) think this has been a great thread and a great discussion. You can always improve it by heading to your forums ignore list and adding TrashMan to it, so you only have to view his posts when you want to.

[deathfun]

Just police yourselves dammit.

This is where my aforementioned "Social Judgment" comes in
I'm also not the one who used that word. It was the shrink I was told to go see after I did several not so great things in school
You know, along the lines of using rape, murder, in a public sense

How do you know who around you is a rape survivor, or the friend or loved one of a rape survivor? Is there a badge you can spot that I'm missing?

Looking solely at the problem of triggering - how are you sure you're not?

You can tell if it triggered something in someone's mind. Rape isn't exactly something you can mention without a victim becoming emotional about it, whether it be submission, or anger. No rape victim would come at you with open arms laughing about the experience if you just trivialized it in front of them

[Spoon]

A lot of the problems with trivializing rape lie in the fact that there is no universal condemnation of the act. Rape is used as punishment (particularly for gay women) or as recreation. Women are considered to 'deserve' rape if they dress provocatively, get drunk, or flirt. Some people believe that a married woman cannot be raped by her husband. On American college campuses, fraternities pass around tips on how to date rape women, since it's not really rape if they're stoned or smashed and can't say no, right?

I at least like to believe that the vast majority of 1st world countries condemn rape, just like you'd condemn any other kind of felony.
The fact that such 'rape cultures' exists on college campuses is very much disturbing though.

Women are considered to 'deserve' rape if they dress provocatively

While I certainly don't think that they deserve it, I do think there's a certain amount of 'she had it coming' in these cases. In the same way that if you walk on the streets dressed like a doctor, bystanders to an accident scene will very likely come to you to ask for help. Or if you walk into a cage filled with lions, with several pieces of juicy meat strapped to you.
Again, I'm not saying that dressing like a whore means that you *should* be raped. Just in the same way that leaving the door to you house unlocked shouldn't mean that burglars get a free card to strip you of all your possessions. It's all about increasing the risk to yourself. Some things are smart to do and some things are not.

They live comfortable lives:
This is more of a personal judgment, but I get the feeling that insensitive individuals who have not experienced trauma in their lives have an inability to understand how damaging trauma can be. It is much easier to make statements about how rape isn't a big deal etc. if they themselves have not felt the pain of broken trust or a violent act. I suppose it's not their fault they live comfortable lives, but that should come with a level of humility, therefore requiring either an inquisitive nature or a level of sensitivity.

I will admit to being guilty of this.

(also lol: Warning - while you were typing 10 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
By the time of reading these posts, 3 more have been posted. Rape is such a popular subject!)

[Mr. Vega]

I'm not talking about this forum per se. Just the general heavy handed tactics to stomp this stuff out that goes on everywhere.

[Mr. Vega]

While I certainly don't think that they deserve it, I do think there's a certain amount of 'she had it coming' in these cases. In the same way that if you walk on the streets dressed like a doctor, bystanders to an accident scene will very likely come to you to ask for help. Or if you walk into a cage filled with lions, with several pieces of juicy meat strapped to you.
Again, I'm not saying that dressing like a whore means that you *should* be raped. Just in the same way that leaving the door to you house unlocked shouldn't mean that burglars get a free card to strip you of all your possessions. It's all about increasing the risk to yourself. Some things are smart to do and some things are not.

You can debate the intent of the women's choice of clothing, but it is irrelevant. Other people don't get to decide what a short skirt means to her.