[CT27]

I get that the TEI was designed to create craft to be able to fight better against the Shivans.  However, I also saw in reading some FS Wiki articles that there were 'waves' of this project.  I wasn't able to find a definite article on the wiki about this, could someone briefly explain the differences in the 'waves' of the TEI for me please?

[General Battuta]

Broadly speaking, Wave 1 fighter projects were designed to provide cheap, numerous, strategically sustainable spaceframes to counter massed Shivan bomber attack, while the warships opened up the fleet's new anti-juggernaut doctrine. Wave 2 projects are more expensive, high-performance craft with correspondingly more significant strategic overhead, and many of them have been adapted for the particulars of the Sol Theater.

[MatthTheGeek]

Yes. Wave 1 is pre-AoA and Wave 2 is post-AoA, in term of deployment if not in term of conception. Which means that Wave 2 had time to be adapted to the Sol theater's tactical requirements.

[SpardaSon21]

Wave 2 fighters are also greatly superior to their FS2 counterparts, while being cheaper and quicker to build and easier to maintain than UEF fighters.  If the GTVA manages to capture Sol reasonably intact, after retooling the factories will be able to churn out tons of Nyxes and Dracos compared to how quickly they build Uriels and Kentaurois.

[crizza]

If the GTVA is able to win the war and won't use UEF tech...then they deserve to get toasted by the shivans^^

[SpardaSon21]

They won't use UEF tech because it would be a logistical nightmare that would quickly lose all coherency during a Shivan invasion.  Just look at how the UEF is faring with just one solar system of ships to support and zero node bottlenecks: complete logistical collapse in six months.

[crizza]

Bull****, for example their long range torpedos, nothing wirks better then blasting at a Jug with them and jumping away the moment you get yourselve jumped at, sure, SSMs work just fine.
Or the Uriel with its railgun, there are aspects of UEF technologie wich would be stupid of not using.

[-Norbert-]

Aren't we talking about the GTVA using UEF technology, rather than them using the current UEF designs without any changes?

But even using current UEF ships might have merrit for the GTAV, if they are used in a defensive role, close to the bases. And the UEF fighters, gunships and bombers might work very well against shivans too.

[MatthTheGeek]

The main issue is that the UEF crafts tend to work very well in conditions where supply lines are safe and secure, like they were when they only had the Gefs to fight. In a full-scale war against the Shivans, supplies are probably the first thing that will come lacking, VERY fast. And system-wide evacuations can and will happen like at Capella, so you want your ships as independent and mobile as possible to counteract that.

[SpardaSon21]

There's also the fact that weapons like the Archer, Redeemer, and Vajra can only be mounted in massive flying targets that will get surrounded by and shredded by the swarms of Shivan fighters.  The Uriel, Durga, and Vajradhara are 38m, 37m, and 56m long respectively, and all of them handle like space bricks.

[Aesaar]

If there's one UEF bomber the GTVA would be interested in, it's probably the Lapith.  Redeemers and a Sledgehammer in a fairly agile hull (still less secondary space than a Nyx, amusingly enough).  The doctrine behind the Uriel is sound, and I could see the GTVA making a fighter-bomber along those lines. 

The Durga and Vajradhara, however, are basically just better Ursas, and I'm not sure there's a place for them in GTVA fleet doctrine anymore.  Some could be kept on to replace the few Ursas still in the fleet, but I don't think they'd be all that useful.

[crizza]

For a fleetbomber, the GTVA would be better of with the Stheno against the shivans...
But then...a GTVA Uriel variant would be interesting to se.

[Mars]

Remember - UEF fighters are inefficient, high performance fuel-hogs that can't handle engagements extended over time and space nearly as well as GTVA fighters can.

[crizza]

I'm not talking about a Kent or Uriel covering a Destroyer for hours.
It's more like taking the best of both worlds and no one can tell me, that the Feds are better in every aspect.

[CT27]

So, in very general terms (for fighter craft at least):

Wave 1 is a space Zerg rush and Wave 2 goes back to quality over quantity?

[General Battuta]

Wave 1 is space T-55s, Wave 2 is space T-80s.

Or in Starcraft terms, Wave 1 is mass marines, Wave 2 is hahahah terran only needs marines

[Beskargam]

need some medivacs in there

[Scotty]

Wave 1 is Marines, Wave 2 is Goliaths if Goliaths were actually worth using.

[-Norbert-]

There's also the fact that weapons like the Archer, Redeemer, and Vajra can only be mounted in massive flying targets that will get surrounded by and shredded by the swarms of Shivan fighters.  The Uriel, Durga, and Vajradhara are 38m, 37m, and 56m long respectively, and all of them handle like space bricks.

Wait a moment.
Massive swarms of cheap fighters... isn't that what the GTVA employed against the UEF in the beginning due to their new doctrine, resulting in horrible fighter-losses for the GTVA, untill they changed their tactics and got wave 2 fighters?

[Scotty]

Um, yes.

The difference, however, is that the Shivans don't give two ****s about losses (that we can determine), and they have the numbers to do that repeatedly and continuously until you die.