[mobcdmoc3]

Alright, so I’m another six missions into continuing the campaign I released a while ago, and I’d like to request someone’s help getting a model ingame. I know there’s a few questions that are bound to come flying my way, I came prepared.

Is is campaign-essential?

Yes, and no. For the most part, this model would be there in order to more easily create the technological atmosphere of the story and for aesthetic appeal, making it a non-critical asset. So no, it’s not absolutely imperative that I get my hands on it.

On the other hand, seeing one of my ships brought to life would be literally a dream come true, next to putting together the campaign I’m working on to life. It’s one of those unrequited dreams that I’d like to see enter this world. I’m stuck watching this same scene playing over and over in my head, but frustrated to see that I can’t bring it to life the way I’d like.

Why not use an already-existing model?

As much as I’d like to, I couldn’t find any fighter remotely similar to the Esarai’s TF Gefjon, aside from the TF Kvasir, which is already being used in BP. I’m shying away from using it because I don’t want to use something that’s already in a mainstream campaign, out of fear of criticism for using it ‘because BP did’ or something else on those lines. Don’t get me wrong, I have the greatest respect and admiration for the Kvasir/Atalanta and BP, but I suppose I’m more passive/afraid when it comes to using someone’s already well-known work.

On a personal side, seeing a model I originally drew would really in a sense, make me feel as if I had made the campaign my own. Like adding a personal touch, like a signature.

Why not learn how to model myself?

Perhaps had I tried picking up 3D modeling instead of building a campaign I wouldn’t be standing here with this request, but I had to make a choice when I got out of school: learn how to tell a story you’ve already got planned out via FRED, or learn to build a model. After slightly over a month, I cranked out the Resurgence demo – I had the chance to stop right there and start modeling, but I didn’t, out of my desire to finish what I had started.

To be plain, it’d take me an enormous amount of time and effort to put together a campaign on top of learning how to do modeling/texturing/pof’ing. At the current rate, I should be done with the campaign in several months. Put on my hands the task of modeling by myself, thus giving me the opportunity to perfect it to every single degree possible, and that could easily turn into another few months with school on top, which may eventually turn into something I give up on. Call me out on laziness if you must, but this simply a skill that’s out of reach to me right now.

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The concept art is in a link below. It’s not the most detailed, but it gets the point across. For the sake of keeping this post as short as can be, I won’t be providing specifics to the model unless someone willing to do it contacts me via PM. If it takes more than the concept art and my word for what I’ve done so far, I’ll gladly submit what I’ve got so far for review, or more concept arts.

http://www.mediafire.com/view/?myvnpj1pt315jld

I’ll also be happy to answer more questions, if that’s what it takes. Thanks for your time.

[Droid803]

The thing about Esarai's ships is not just the modelling, but a lot of it is in the texturing that makes them unique (the panel regions with 45-degree angles).

Btw, did you look at the Skjoldr? It's also by Esarai. (here: http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=71652.0).

It's not listed on the wiki, so you might have missed it (?)

Also, don't worry about someone else having used it. Because then you can't use anything that's good... (for the record the TF Gefjon is in DE )

...and I wouldn't mind modelling that for you and UVMapping it too (so as long as I get to use it too uehehe), but I can't pull off Esarai-style textures. If you can find someone to cover that I'll make it.

[mobcdmoc3]

Btw, did you look at the Skjoldr? It's also by Esarai. (here: http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=71652.0).

It's not listed on the wiki, so you might have missed it (?)

Wow I totally forgot about that thread. I first saw it in a thread named 'congregate the works of this board' or something. Thanks for pointing that one out. I'll probably take a look at that one tonight.

I must've missed the Gefjon being in DE then. Now I've got another excuse to replay it.

I'm not even looking for an exact replica of his textures (even though it'd be pretty awesome). I'm more interested in keeping the color scheme and I suppose, the general 'feel' of the ship. I guess the best way to explain that is that you can sorta feel that the Kvasir and the Gefjon are in the same 'family.' That's what I'm seeking.

Your interest is very welcome, Droid. (And if you made the model, I'd give you every right in the world to do whatever you wanted with it. ;P)

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But with what Droid said before - Is there anybody out there willing to give a texturing replication a shot?

[BlasterNT]

From my studies of esarai's textures, technically they shouldn't be too difficult.  Excuse me if it sounds like I'm being presumptuous, but a lot of the styling looks like textures overlays, drop shadows, and outlines that can all be done with presets in Photoshop.  The beauty of course is in the attention to detail, and as Droid mentioned, the shape of the various cutouts that give an incredibly futuristic feel, but it seems like you've got the shapes basically down in your concept. 

Look at the Narayana for an example (NrynaUV).  I learned a bunch of great techniques from it :-). 

[Droid803]

The issue is finding the base textures for the overlays...or re-making them.
I tried (and failed), probably because I'm ******** horrible at texturing.

[Legate Damar]

I’m stuck watching this same scene playing over and over in my head, but frustrated to see that I can’t bring it to life the way I’d like.

Oh man do I know what that feels like. I feel your pain, friend.

Why not use an already-existing model?

As much as I’d like to, I couldn’t find any fighter remotely similar to the Esarai’s TF Gefjon, aside from the TF Kvasir, which is already being used in BP. I’m shying away from using it because I don’t want to use something that’s already in a mainstream campaign, out of fear of criticism for using it ‘because BP did’ or something else on those lines. Don’t get me wrong, I have the greatest respect and admiration for the Kvasir/Atalanta and BP, but I suppose I’m more passive/afraid when it comes to using someone’s already well-known work.

I have the opposite problem. The models I need are all unreleased and will probably stay that way for at least another year or more. Honestly I think you have it better than I do - the stuff I need is completely imperative for my campaign and there are no substitutes I can use.

I recommend just using the released fighters and change their names or something. Or at least use them as placeholders in your missions until your new fighter is ready.

The concept art is in a link below. It’s not the most detailed, but it gets the point across. For the sake of keeping this post as short as can be, I won’t be providing specifics to the model unless someone willing to do it contacts me via PM. If it takes more than the concept art and my word for what I’ve done so far, I’ll gladly submit what I’ve got so far for review, or more concept arts.

http://www.mediafire.com/view/?myvnpj1pt315jld

I’ll also be happy to answer more questions, if that’s what it takes. Thanks for your time.

I'm an extreme novice when it comes to modeling (I've made one fighter in Blender but I'm stuck on how to UV it - the FSF tutorial really isn't helping). I haven't even touched texturing yet.

Still, I could try to do this thing - I definitely need more practice. However anything I come up with would doubtlessly be inferior to what Droid will make, so I don't quite see the point now that he has accepted this request. Maybe next time.

[mobcdmoc3]

Yeah, I've even got music that I've got synced perfectly to the scene. I know the nebula color, exact ship placement, exactly what people are going to say. I could literally build the mission right now, but doing so would really only tease my burning desire to see the model put to work. So I can't/don't/shouldn't

See, the problem with using a model that's already released, is that I wouldn't have had any part in its creation. At the very least, I've provided a concept art - A piece of myself that would be able to go the campaign. While one could argue that I'm already pouring myself into the actual campaign aspects like the banter and gameplay, there wouldn't be any visual manifestation of myself in there. Nothing that one could 'physically' grasp.

I've got a few other concept arts lying around I'm not planning on using (yet). So if you're hurting for a base art to practice on, I'll toss you a couple.

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Seems that texturing is a lot harder than I take it for. (Not that I have a right to take it for anything to start)

[BlasterNT]

Not so much texturing, as emulating a specific style.  And when you do it the indirect, photoshop route (as it seems a lot of people on HLP do), it's a bit of a brain**** visualizing what appears where, and trying to get rid of seams, especially if you have a complex UV. 

The issue is finding the base textures for the overlays...or re-making them.
I tried (and failed), probably because I'm ******** horrible at texturing.

They seem to be fairly generic, though I suspect the patterning, and the little techy bits are made by esarai himself.  But you could probably use the tiling textures in BP to get a rough approximation-I'm looking at the uefplates and the shiphulls.  http://www.filterforge.com/filters/6005.html also seems to work as a base. 

Also, his fighters tend to not actually use base textures, like the Kvaisr-it's just a cloud pattern essentially. 

[Droid803]

Not so much texturing, as emulating a specific style.  And when you do it the indirect, photoshop route (as it seems a lot of people on HLP do), it's a bit of a brain**** visualizing what appears where, and trying to get rid of seams, especially if you have a complex UV. 

The issue is finding the base textures for the overlays...or re-making them.
I tried (and failed), probably because I'm ******** horrible at texturing.

They seem to be fairly generic, though I suspect the patterning, and the little techy bits are made by esarai himself.  But you could probably use the tiling textures in BP to get a rough approximation-I'm looking at the uefplates and the shiphulls.  http://www.filterforge.com/filters/6005.html also seems to work as a base. 

Also, his fighters tend to not actually use base textures, like the Kvaisr-it's just a cloud pattern essentially. 

Are you volunteering to texture then?

[BlasterNT]

Welp, I could give it a shot, if you UV and model (soo bad at UVing..). 

[Legate Damar]

Yeah, I've even got music that I've got synced perfectly to the scene. I know the nebula color, exact ship placement, exactly what people are going to say. I could literally build the mission right now, but doing so would really only tease my burning desire to see the model put to work. So I can't/don't/shouldn't

I know exactly what you mean. But at least you have models that could work, so what's wrong with my idea of making the mission with placeholder ships until you get your new ship made?

See, the problem with using a model that's already released, is that I wouldn't have had any part in its creation. At the very least, I've provided a concept art - A piece of myself that would be able to go the campaign. While one could argue that I'm already pouring myself into the actual campaign aspects like the banter and gameplay, there wouldn't be any visual manifestation of myself in there. Nothing that one could 'physically' grasp.

My campaign originally called for several new models I was planning to make myself, until I found some released ones that would do just as well. Currently there's only one model I need that doesn't match up with anything anyone else has made (that I know of), but if I find a model someone else made that will work for it, I would gladly use it instead of making my own, like I'm currently planning to do.

I guess what I'm saying is I really don't understand your need to include your own models if something that already exists will work. I mean, you can make the missions, plot, interface art, tables, tech descriptions, etc. by yourself, but the campaign isn't uniquely yours if it doesn't have your own models? And not even models you made yourself, but models you are asking someone else to make for you. It's sort of like saying that I can't use music written by other people for my campaign, I would have to compose all of the music myself, or else it wouldn't be 'my campaign'. I really just don't get that, sorry.

I've got a few other concept arts lying around I'm not planning on using (yet). So if you're hurting for a base art to practice on, I'll toss you a couple.

Maybe, although I'd prefer to work on fighters/bombers first before moving on to the more complicated capships. (The model I need to make for my campaign is a capship, BTW).

Also I really don't think you should just give up on the idea of learning modding. I mean all I did was download Blender and follow the tutorial and in just a week or two I was able to make a decent-looking fighter (still working on that UV stuff, though).

[mobcdmoc3]

...and I wouldn't mind modelling that for you and UVMapping it too (so as long as I get to use it too uehehe), but I can't pull off Esarai-style textures. If you can find someone to cover that I'll make it.

Welp, I could give it a shot, if you UV and model (soo bad at UVing..). 

@Legate Damar
- I wouldn't have any problem with making the mission, if I had the model. Like I said before, making it would tease my burning desire to see it come to life in its fullest. Missing just one piece would drive me insane. So, I find it better to not start it until I know I can finish it. I really hate leaving stuff unfinished, that's all.

- Alright, it seems I got the wrong point across. The model itself is not all-important - Getting something I know I created (to some degree) and into the campaign is what I'm after. I guess I've put a little emphasis on the model because it's something that's out of reach to me, but yes, the campaign aspects are in the end, more important. So goes the saying 'the most beautiful things in the world are those you cannot have.' I can create the campaign, but not a model (yet)

- I've got a couple fighters I've got no plans on using - So if you want to give them a go, you're welcome to it.

- Never said I gave up on it - I just chose to teach myself how to make a campaign/story first

[Droid803]

Alright, before I start modelling this, do you have a "front view", or should I just make up whatever?

[mobcdmoc3]

I never got around to drawing any other view due to my lacking ability and lack of time to do so.

Further details will be PM'd...

[Legate Damar]

I just realized I couldn't even get someone else to model my ideas for me since I can't draw for ****...

[An4ximandros]

You gotta start drawing then legate, if you got an pc tablet I recommend GIMP (it's free) if not, you better get some papers and pencils, it's a long ass road (I know from experience! )

[BlasterNT]

Wait... do you not use reference pictures?  How do you model something without drawing it first?

[An4ximandros]

You... model it?

About half the stuff I did as practice a long time ago was done on the fly in a modeling app.

You don't need a drawing to model, they do help get proportions right however.

[Droid803]

Wait... do you not use reference pictures?  How do you model something without drawing it first?

You... model it?

That.
References can be as much of a hindrance than a help.
Sometimes it's better to just freeform and see what happens. (sometimes that's a huge waste of time though)

[Legate Damar]

I generally have a clear image of what it will look like in my head before I start. Same is true of the ship I need to make, SDn Mortis.

Problem is it's slightly asymmetrical.