[Adi]

Warsaw Pact.

Soviet version of NATO, ok more political interference from Moscow.  And while even in Russia there was a questionable distinction between civilian and military aspects of government it was there and it was technically for the most part a civilian government.

Hey! Poland was in Warsaw Pact obviously and it's military part of economy wasn't all we had here. It was rather a margin. (sry for Off-topic)

[-Norbert-]

For those who are too concerned about a campaign in a single system having "too free" subspace jumping, take a look at "Sol: A history".
In the backstory of that campaign (a very good campaign if you ask me), the Lucifers explostion not only close the nodes themselfs, but it destabilized subspace over the entire system. This resulted in intrasystem jumps being only possible over short distances (and while it wasn't specifically mentioned as far as I remember, I'd imagine it would also reduce the accuracy).
So to get from Earth to Pluto, you had to make a number of small "subspace-hops".... at the beginning anyway. As the campaign progresses, subspace stabilizes slowly untill it's back to normal by the end of the campaign.

[Al-Rik]

dont know of any countries where there is or has been training like this at school level, there are child soldier in some African regions but that is not done through the schools there by my understanding

The German Democratic Republic has had "Wehreunterricht" (Defence Education) in the curriculum. Including two weeks of a military camp at the age of 16.

They fought a 14 Year War against the alien Vasudans, and were almost whipped out by the even more alien Shivans.

Neither of which has been an issue in over a generation at the time of FS2. Neither of which was expected, at the end of FS1, to be an issue within the lifetime of a fighter pilot who had just entered the service a few months ago.

Hatred against Vasudans was an issue in Freespace 2. Remember the NTF Rebellion ?

And all militaristic systems must become sooner or later totalitarian to justify the spending on weapons and reduced personal freedom.

Statement unsupported by evidence; statement furthermore indicates a fundamental misunderstanding of why the Sol government will probably be qualified as militaristic.
The goals of the military and the goals of the state will, in all likelihood, be indistinguishable, hence a militaristic government, but those actual goals are to control the production and usage of space-based military hardware, particular fighter and ship hulls, which is not an aggressive goal nor one that necessarily requires the revoking of personal freedoms or anything else you're proposing.

A militaristic system places the needs of the military over the needs of their population.
If you want an example, take the North Korean Songun Ideology.

Fighters and Ship hulls need resources. From base materials to work force and money. If you relocate the resources from less important productions to re arming, this will have an effect to personal freedom and personal consume.
If every citizen is working 48 hours a week instead 44 or 40 and donates the earnings (by higher taxes) for re arming the GTA can build more ships. Won't you hesitate to work longer to support the rearming afford citizen ?
The longer work hours free also more workers for the defence industry.

And think of all the resources that goods to the unneeded consume goods. All those new cars, new cell phones, fancy vacations... do you need them really, citizen ?
Won't you agree that those resources are better used for the rearming ?

[headdie]

dont know of any countries where there is or has been training like this at school level, there are child soldier in some African regions but that is not done through the schools there by my understanding

The German Democratic Republic has had "Wehreunterricht" (Defence Education) in the curriculum. Including two weeks of a military camp at the age of 16.

from what I can tell (and can a German please correct me if I an wrong) but Wehrunterricht was applicable to 15-16 year olds which is not all that shocking when you consider the UK has a full time college for those wanting to enter military service between the end of compulsory education 16 and the legal minimum of 18 (though compulsory education is soon to be 18 here)

They fought a 14 Year War against the alien Vasudans, and were almost whipped out by the even more alien Shivans.

Neither of which has been an issue in over a generation at the time of FS2. Neither of which was expected, at the end of FS1, to be an issue within the lifetime of a fighter pilot who had just entered the service a few months ago.

Hatred against Vasudans was an issue in Freespace 2. Remember the NTF Rebellion ?

and yet the NTF started 30 years after the events of FS1.  there will be tension yes but national hostility is not a guarantee.

And all militaristic systems must become sooner or later totalitarian to justify the spending on weapons and reduced personal freedom.

Statement unsupported by evidence; statement furthermore indicates a fundamental misunderstanding of why the Sol government will probably be qualified as militaristic.
The goals of the military and the goals of the state will, in all likelihood, be indistinguishable, hence a militaristic government, but those actual goals are to control the production and usage of space-based military hardware, particular fighter and ship hulls, which is not an aggressive goal nor one that necessarily requires the revoking of personal freedoms or anything else you're proposing.

A militaristic system places the needs of the military over the needs of their population.
If you want an example, take the North Korean Songun Ideology.

can you please define a "militaristic system" because I am still at a loss what you mean.

Fighters and Ship hulls need resources. From base materials to work force and money. If you relocate the resources from less important productions to re arming, this will have an effect to personal freedom and personal consume.

At the point of the node collapse the GTA had been at war for 14 years so flat out military production will probably been the case for over a decade, matters have gotten to the point that "luxury" is not something the average citizen thinks much about.  Next how does military spending effect civil liberties

If every citizen is working 48 hours a week instead 44 or 40

why is working hours going up compared to what would have been needed for a wartime economy anyway?

and donates the earnings (by higher taxes) for re arming the GTA can build more ships. Won't you hesitate to work longer to support the rearming afford citizen ?
The longer work hours free also more workers for the defence industry.

And think of all the resources that goods to the unneeded consume goods. All those new cars, new cell phones, fancy vacations... do you need them really, citizen ?
Won't you agree that those resources are better used for the rearming ?

14 years of patriotism takes a lot to undo away especially when there is now a new crisis to build upon it.  also dissent comes from the realisation that things can be better.  In the world today oppressive governments have the problem that there is a wider world which is impossible to shut out meaning that the population will at some levels always be exposed to more liberal nations.  The Unique situation in Sol is that there is no other societies for its members to be exposed to leaving the only source inspiration to be fiction which to to the fact that is is not real is a weak inspiration.

[Al-Rik]

from what I can tell (and can a German please correct me if I an wrong) but Wehrunterricht was applicable to 15-16 year olds which is not all that shocking when you consider the UK has a full time college for those wanting to enter military service between the end of compulsory education 16 and the legal minimum of 18 (though compulsory education is soon to be 18 here)

And those in GB what don't want to enter military service have also attend to this college ?

The Wehrunterricht was mandatory for every Teenager in the GDR, while this British college was specifically for Teenagers what want to enter later the military service.

can you please define a "militaristic system" because I am still at a loss what you mean.

A system that gives the needs of the military a higher priority than the needs of the population.
In most cases it also promotes military virtues as virtues for each citizen.

why is working hours going up compared to what would have been needed for a wartime economy anyway?

The question is why the GTA should change from wartime economy to a peace time economy after the collapse of the jump node.
If the closing of the jump node has catastrophic side effects, keeping the war time economy "for the duration of the crisis" sounds not to be a bad idea.

14 years of patriotism takes a lot to undo away especially when there is now a new crisis to build upon it.  also dissent comes from the realisation that things can be better.  In the world today oppressive governments have the problem that there is a wider world which is impossible to shut out meaning that the population will at some levels always be exposed to more liberal nations.  The Unique situation in Sol is that there is no other societies for its members to be exposed to leaving the only source inspiration to be fiction which to to the fact that is is not real is a weak inspiration.

I have the same opinion, that's the reason why i think that Sol won't end up in a complete Anarchy or warring factions.

[-Norbert-]

from what I can tell (and can a German please correct me if I an wrong) but Wehrunterricht was applicable to 15-16 year olds which is not all that shocking when you consider the UK has a full time college for those wanting to enter military service between the end of compulsory education 16 and the legal minimum of 18 (though compulsory education is soon to be 18 here)

And those in GB what don't want to enter military service have also attend to this college ?

The Wehrunterricht was mandatory for every Teenager in the GDR, while this British college was specifically for Teenagers what want to enter later the military service.

Here in Austria every able male citizen has to go though some kind of service period. For some people that means civil service (driving ambulene, caring for the old, ect.), but for most men that means six month of military service. Civil service is hard to get into, pays less and lasts longer than the military service.
While my country is currently in the process of abolishing this system in favour or a professional military, at the moment it is still in place.
The only people exempted from this are those that are judged unsuitable due to medical reasons and women (but only in so far that they are not obligated to serve, but can do so voluntarily).

Despite that, Austria is definatly not a militaristic country... quite the contrary. As far as fighting power goes, our military is pretty much laughable, though our pioneer corps is respected for their expertise in helping out in catastrophy recovery and such (according to the news anyway). Furthermore we have absolute neutrality as part of our countries constitution and thus we haven't entered any war since this was put in place at the end of WW2 (except as part of the rebuilding and keeping the peace AFTER the fighting stopped, but that pretty much all over the world).

So obligatoy military service is definatly not an indicator of wether a country/faction is militaristic or not.
Either way I'd be more worried about how totalitarian and mercyless a faction is, than not how militaristic. Even if the military is in charge of a faction, they can still be benevolent rulers (unlikely as that may be), especially if that particular military is controlled not by a single overall commander, but by an admirality council or something similar.

[headdie]

from what I can tell (and can a German please correct me if I an wrong) but Wehrunterricht was applicable to 15-16 year olds which is not all that shocking when you consider the UK has a full time college for those wanting to enter military service between the end of compulsory education 16 and the legal minimum of 18 (though compulsory education is soon to be 18 here)

And those in GB what don't want to enter military service have also attend to this college ?

The Wehrunterricht was mandatory for every Teenager in the GDR, while this British college was specifically for Teenagers what want to enter later the military service.

and military service was compulsory until 1960.  So far you have only come up with the one example where the government has made it a mandatory thing that children are taught in a school, and even then it was abolished after a fairly short period of time IIRC.

can you please define a "militaristic system" because I am still at a loss what you mean.

A system that gives the needs of the military a higher priority than the needs of the population.
In most cases it also promotes military virtues as virtues for each citizen.

and yet that does not in itself cause a problem, A strong military means lots of government spending to pay the soldiers and construct/maintain facilities and equipment.  the soldier's pay goes into the civilian economy because even if every meal is provided by the military the soldiers still buy "luxury" items such as fashionable/performance cars,go on holiday, treat loved ones when they are on leave.  the construction and maintenance helps the civilian economy because the bulk of construction/maintenance work for both facilities and equipment is done by civilian contractors though there is usually an exception for weapons which are maintained by military personnel using civilian made parts.

why is working hours going up compared to what would have been needed for a wartime economy anyway?

The question is why the GTA should change from wartime economy to a peace time economy after the collapse of the jump node.
If the closing of the jump node has catastrophic side effects, keeping the war time economy "for the duration of the crisis" sounds not to be a bad idea.

so I ask again why are working hours changing?

14 years of patriotism takes a lot to undo away especially when there is now a new crisis to build upon it.  also dissent comes from the realisation that things can be better.  In the world today oppressive governments have the problem that there is a wider world which is impossible to shut out meaning that the population will at some levels always be exposed to more liberal nations.  The Unique situation in Sol is that there is no other societies for its members to be exposed to leaving the only source inspiration to be fiction which to to the fact that is is not real is a weak inspiration.

I have the same opinion, that's the reason why i think that Sol won't end up in a complete Anarchy or warring factions.

This is where a little imagination comes in and where a story writer has a lot of room to play with, for example

Q. What is the state of remaining exploitable resources in the system?
A. We have no canon info, if the story writer describes a situation where most of Sol's resources which are exploitable with the technology setting there could be shortages in the average person's ability to obtain essential items which will cause discontent

Q. How has the node collapse effected travel in sol?
A. We have no canon info, if the big players were heavily reliant on inter system travel then they will be in trouble, if they collapse then there will be difficulty in moving people and materials where they need to be

I mentioned fiction as a weak motivator but if that work of fiction inspires the right person then they could be motivated to try and change things.  and I could go on and there are strong arguments for both sides of the coin.