[The E]

Used the start menu on Win8 recently?

[headdie]

Heh...here I am all the way back on XP, I still haven't managed to upgrade the family machine from Vista to 7, and now apparently 8 is an utter cluster****.  Fun fun.

:brofist:

[Admiral LSD]

Used the start menu on Win8 recently?

No, why?

[Ghostavo]

While there are some issues with the user interface, for instance the hot corners implementation on multiple screens, most of the backlash seems to be the old Microsoft bashing wank.

I'd be willing to bet if either Google or Apple were launching the exact same system, people would say it was "magical" or something...

[karajorma]

As I said above (with a different context) "We've seen this all before with Vista."

[pecenipicek]

While there are some issues with the user interface, for instance the hot corners implementation on multiple screens, most of the backlash seems to be the old Microsoft bashing wank.

I'd be willing to bet if either Google or Apple were launching the exact same system, people would say it was "magical" or something...

i honestly believe that the hot corners system is downright retarded. all current implementations are just too much clutter and rather unuseable.

[Admiral LSD]

As I said above (with a different context) "We've seen this all before with Vista."

Yes, and once again we're seeing people get caught up in what others are saying instead of just using it for themselves to see what the fuss is about.

[karajorma]

Yes, but a lot of the negative comments are coming from people who HAVE used it and still hate it.

[headdie]

indeed MS has a habit of failing on about every other PC OS release (ignoring organisation orientated OS such as NT). 

DOS 6x + Win 3.1x - worked fairly well so long as you didn't multi task, but then everyone was used to one prog at a time from DOS anyway
Win 95 - (especially its initial release) was quite bad (lots of "new" features)
Win 98 - pretty good (basically 95 done right)
Win Millenium - some OEMs actually reverted to distributing 98 after a while (wasn't this the one where they tried to integrate NT into the 9X OS)
Win XP - again fairly solid
Win Vista - resource hog
Win 7 - fairly respectable OS
Win 8 - setting up for a panning

[Mika]

Interesting topic, I have been thinking the same. Microsoft has taken a huge risk with Windows 8, and given the reluctance of the corporate world, I'm not sure whether this will fly or not. More evidence on fail side is piling up from the entertainment industry side, Valve launching Steam for Linux is something of a hint.

I saw the beta version in the Spring. My first reaction was:


From what I have heard, Microsoft has implemented some changes after that, and the possibility to revert it back from the Modern UI. Haven't checked it after that, but initial impression was "Vista all over again". Though, I'm curious to hear the corporate world comments after the launch - what do I know, it might even work. Vista was indeed hilarious (but not in a good way) on meetings when it completely ****** up the laptop of an executive... Try keeping up the facade with thoughts like: "Facial muscles, don't fail me now!" and at the same time "Dude, you just launched 20 calculators!"

[Admiral LSD]

You never had to "revert" from the "Modern UI" because it was never taken away in the first place. Sure the OS boots to it after you log in, but it's never been harder than clicking a single live tile (which is clearly labelled "Desktop" so even Neanderthals should be able to work it out) to get to something you should be able to get comfortable with.

I'm still struggling to wrap my head around the idea that, with MS providing free and open public betas for at least their last 3 major OS releases (including this one), people still think they can spout off about them despite never having actually used them and therefore having no clue wtf they're on about...

[karajorma]

You do understand that it actually takes some commitment to download, install and test these "free and open public betas" right? You keep going on about them as if it's as simple as reading a page of text or something.

[Admiral LSD]

You do understand that it actually takes some commitment to download, install and test these "free and open public betas" right? You keep going on about them as if it's as simple as reading a page of text or something.

Isn't that what most people here are doing, reading pages of text and then forming an opinion without ever using the thing in question? Hell, it's how this very thread started off. My point here is that, if you're unable to make the commitment to give the thing a go, then why comment on it?

[Mika]

Also, the old saying comes to mind "Show me an idiot-proof system and I'll show you an idiot!"

Nope, did not notice that button there. I do recall massive tiles on one screen that were supposed to make things easier, and then scrolling on the horizontal direction and you got different screens for different purposes, whatever those purposes were. Seemed really complicated to me. Reminds me of a Nokia personnel who mentioned once that he isn't even sure if it is a smart idea to try to get the mobile phone UI to match desktop PC's.

By the way, have I mentioned that I have witnessed an open rebellion towards a software company that hinted of changing the old UI to Ribbon UI? After the flood of angry emails of "Do that and we'll jump ships!" they never mentioned this again. Basically it became a very pre-emptive strike by the users of that software. This is the corporate world reluctance towards change, which is very natural thing for human beings themselves. I'm supposed to be productive in the company, and most of that productivity comes from not learning new UI's all the time. Let's see how Windows 8 fares in the real world first, it will be interesting no matter what the outcome.

[Flipside]

You do understand that it actually takes some commitment to download, install and test these "free and open public betas" right? You keep going on about them as if it's as simple as reading a page of text or something.

Isn't that what most people here are doing, reading pages of text and then forming an opinion without ever using the thing in question? Hell, it's how this very thread started off. My point here is that, if you're unable to make the commitment to give the thing a go, then why comment on it?

In order to install and test Windows 8, I' have to repartition my drive, register with Microsoft, install the new system and pray to high heaven it does nothing to damage the already installed OS. Considering the amount of information that would require restoring if it went wrong, coupled with the amount of time it would take to install in the first place, it's not something I would wish to do, so instead I read reports from people who are technically knowledgeable and have used it. When one person calls an OS 'bad' it can be taken with a pinch of salt, when large numbers say it, you have to pay attention.

This is why I never installed ME, because of bad reviews, I didn't need to use it, simply to hear the horror stories from those who had.


Personally, I see no need to upgrade from 7. It was slightly annoying when I first got it, but since then, I've found it to be a very reliable, stable and easy-to-use system most of the time.

From what I've seen and read, Windows 8 looks like what happens when you try to turn a high-spec PC into a mobile phone. Whilst I prefer Windows over Linux purely for the reason that I like the 'hand-holding' when it comes to new hardware (mostly because I'm lazy and like plug and play), I think putting too much cotton wool between the user and the system-layer of the PC itself can serve to have the opposite effect with regards to getting a machine to run at potential.

Yes, I like the fact my PC is a lot more powerful than a mobile phone, and this isn't a Special Sports Day, so I'm a bit scared with the whole 'here's an OS that means you are all equal!' mentality.

[mjn.mixael]

I don't know why Admiral LSD is raising his shield and sword for MS over Windows 8... but see here's the deal...

Winkey -> type first few letters of application I want to run -> Enter

Possibly the best and most often used function in my Win7 (non touch screen mind you) rig. I don't want any damned tiles with my Winkey. I want seamless search....

To name one of my issues with Win8.

Win8 = Win7 - everythingthatisgoodanduseful + bad ideas

[Admiral LSD]

In order to install and test Windows 8, I' have to repartition my drive, register with Microsoft, install the new system and pray to high heaven it does nothing to damage the already installed OS. Considering the amount of information that would require restoring if it went wrong, coupled with the amount of time it would take to install in the first place, it's not something I would wish to do, so instead I read reports from people who are technically knowledgeable and have used it. When one person calls an OS 'bad' it can be taken with a pinch of salt, when large numbers say it, you have to pay attention.

This is why I never installed ME, because of bad reviews, I didn't need to use it, simply to hear the horror stories from those who had.


Personally, I see no need to upgrade from 7. It was slightly annoying when I first got it, but since then, I've found it to be a very reliable, stable and easy-to-use system most of the time.

From what I've seen and read, Windows 8 looks like what happens when you try to turn a high-spec PC into a mobile phone. Whilst I prefer Windows over Linux purely for the reason that I like the 'hand-holding' when it comes to new hardware (mostly because I'm lazy and like plug and play), I think putting too much cotton wool between the user and the system-layer of the PC itself can serve to have the opposite effect with regards to getting a machine to run at potential.

Yes, I like the fact my PC is a lot more powerful than a mobile phone, and this isn't a Special Sports Day, so I'm a bit scared with the whole 'here's an OS that means you are all equal!' mentality.

See, this is just it. If you don't want to or can't test the thing, that's fine, but thinking you're somehow qualified to condemn it nonetheless is what's bothering me.

Nope, did not notice that button there. I do recall massive tiles on one screen that were supposed to make things easier, and then scrolling on the horizontal direction and you got different screens for different purposes, whatever those purposes were. Seemed really complicated to me. Reminds me of a Nokia personnel who mentioned once that he isn't even sure if it is a smart idea to try to get the mobile phone UI to match desktop PC's.

Bottom left hand corner:



That isn't actually the spot it defaults to, it starts off a little closer to the top of that column of tiles, but somewhere along the line it shifted down a few spots and I'm not entirely sure why. It quite possibly happened when I was getting the video driver sorted out and the screen resolution was changing all over the place. Point is, it's there and it's not entirely hard to find or even figure out what it does.

I don't know why Admiral LSD is raising his shield and sword for MS over Windows 8... but see here's the deal...

...because, unlike most everyone else in this thread, I've actually used it (using it right now actually) for more than about 5 minutes and therefore know enough to say with some certainty it's not nearly as bad as people are making it out to be.

[Mika]

Actually, that screenshot pretty much tells the story. I can now see why I didn't see it, and it took me about 25 seconds to locate it now. I had to carefully look at every friggin' icon to find it. Others would be welcome to post their time to find the desktop button results from that too.

Besides what does Desktop have in common with Wikipedia, or XBox Live Games? And why isn't it a separate icon at one of the edges of the screen?

[The E]

it's not nearly as bad as people are making it out to be.

Neither is Vista. That does not mean that, when compared to the preceding version, it suddenly becomes better. Is Win8 usable? Yes. It's fast, it's slim.
Is Win8 better than 7? No. The choices MS made when designing the Metro UI are too much, too soon. Hell, if Win8 on the desktop had been just a reskin of Win7 with a lot of under-the-hood changes, noone would have complained. But noooo, MS had to abandon the basic simplicity of the Windows Desktop UI because someone thought that full-screen menus are the **** now.

[Admiral LSD]

Actually, that screenshot pretty much tells the story. I can now see why I didn't see it, and it took me about 25 seconds to locate it now. I had to carefully look at every friggin' icon to find it. Others would be welcome to post their time to find the desktop button results from that too.

You're free to move them around as you see fit. As I said, it's usually a lot higher than that, I have no idea how it wound up down there. Also notice how the background tracks whatever wallpaper you're using (see the desktop screenshot I posted on the first page) which helps you spot it too. Also, you can call up the desktop app using the standard search built into the screen. Even way back with the developer preview (which was a hell of a lot worse than either the consumer or release previews), it was no trouble at all finding the desktop tile. I will admit, however, that my particular wallpaper obscures the label just a tiny bit.

Besides what does Desktop have in common with Wikipedia, or XBox Live Games? And why isn't it a separate icon at one of the edges of the screen?

Most of the icons one has on their desktop typically don't have that much in common, yet we throw them together in the one place anyway, so I can't see how that's even a valid question...

Neither is Vista. That does not mean that, when compared to the preceding version, it suddenly becomes better. Is Win8 usable? Yes. It's fast, it's slim.
Is Win8 better than 7? No. The choices MS made when designing the Metro UI are too much, too soon. Hell, if Win8 on the desktop had been just a reskin of Win7 with a lot of under-the-hood changes, noone would have complained. But noooo, MS had to abandon the basic simplicity of the Windows Desktop UI because someone thought that full-screen menus are the **** now.

See, this would be a valid criticism if the desktop had been completely removed, but it hasn't. It's still there. Seriously, if you can just bring yourselves to get the **** over Metro it really does become "just a reskin of Win7 with a lot of under-the-hood changes", but that's something you simply can't get a handle on without actually using it.