Author Topic: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its relea... Its released!  (Read 42476 times)

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Offline An4ximandros

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
Finished it.
Spoiler:
The ending section was awesome. I loved the little details like one of the security guards being pissed off at you for what was going on. Oh and having two Agrunts teleport in my face as I was about to jump into the portal was an awesome dick move, having them desperately trying to shove me away from the portal... awesome.
Now awaiting the Xen chapters! :D

 

Offline MatthTheGeek

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
The crouch jumping thing is hilariously ****. Someone did some calculations and worked out that the normal jump is so ineffective that it can't accomplish anything ordinary walking won't. So in effect all they've done is rebind 'jump' to 'ctrl-space'.
Haters gotta hate.
People are stupid, therefore anything popular is at best suspicious.

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666maslo666: Releasing a finished product is not a good thing! It is a modern fad.

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Axem: when you put it like that, i sound like an insane person

bigchunk1: it's not retarded it's american!
bigchunk1: ...

batwota: steele's maneuvering for the coup de gras
MatthTheGeek: you mispelled grâce
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Offline The E

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
In Black Mesa (and HL before it), jumping is a skill test. Can you press space-Ctrl fast enough to make the jump?

I am really glad this mechanic died out. Because it only adds frustration to gameplay sections that are already very frustrating; platforming in an FPS is an iffy proposition at best, making it extra stupid by ****ing up the controls is just bad design imho.
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Offline Ravenholme

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
I was raised on Half Life, so crouch jumping is second nature to me. I never have a problem doing it, and find myself attempting it in games which don't support it.
Full Auto - I've got a bullet here with your name on it, and I'm going to keep firing until I find out which one it is.

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Offline MatthTheGeek

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
I was raised on Half Life, so crouch jumping is second nature to me. I never have a problem doing it, and find myself attempting it in games which don't support it.
Good to know I'm not the only one who does that :p
People are stupid, therefore anything popular is at best suspicious.

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666maslo666: Releasing a finished product is not a good thing! It is a modern fad.

SpardaSon21: it seems like you exist in a permanent state of half-joking misanthropy

Axem: when you put it like that, i sound like an insane person

bigchunk1: it's not retarded it's american!
bigchunk1: ...

batwota: steele's maneuvering for the coup de gras
MatthTheGeek: you mispelled grâce
Awaesaar: grace
batwota: oh right :P
Darius: ah!
Darius: yes, i like that
MatthTheGeek: the way you just spelled it it means fat
Awaesaar: +accent I forgot how to keyboard
MatthTheGeek: or grease
Darius: the killing fat!
Axem: jabba does the coup de gras
MatthTheGeek: XD
Axem: bring me solo and a cookie

 

Offline Ravenholme

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
I was raised on Half Life, so crouch jumping is second nature to me. I never have a problem doing it, and find myself attempting it in games which don't support it.
Good to know I'm not the only one who does that :p

Maybe we should form a support group - "Crouch-Jumpers Anonymous."
Full Auto - I've got a bullet here with your name on it, and I'm going to keep firing until I find out which one it is.

<The_E>   Several sex-based solutions come to mind
<The_E>   Errr
<The_E>   *sexp

  

Offline MatthTheGeek

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
Why anonymous ? We should be proud of it ! I know I am.
People are stupid, therefore anything popular is at best suspicious.

Mod management tools     -     Wiki stuff!     -     Help us help you

666maslo666: Releasing a finished product is not a good thing! It is a modern fad.

SpardaSon21: it seems like you exist in a permanent state of half-joking misanthropy

Axem: when you put it like that, i sound like an insane person

bigchunk1: it's not retarded it's american!
bigchunk1: ...

batwota: steele's maneuvering for the coup de gras
MatthTheGeek: you mispelled grâce
Awaesaar: grace
batwota: oh right :P
Darius: ah!
Darius: yes, i like that
MatthTheGeek: the way you just spelled it it means fat
Awaesaar: +accent I forgot how to keyboard
MatthTheGeek: or grease
Darius: the killing fat!
Axem: jabba does the coup de gras
MatthTheGeek: XD
Axem: bring me solo and a cookie

 

Offline Colonol Dekker

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
Quote from: MatthTheGeek link=topic=81836.msg1638955#msg1638955
Good to know I'm not the only one who does that :p

+1

Why anonymous ? We should be proud of it ! I know I am.


:nod:
Maybe we should form a support group - "Crouch-Jumpers Anonymous."


Facebook it and sign me up.


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Offline General Battuta

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
I was raised on Half Life, so crouch jumping is second nature to me. I never have a problem doing it, and find myself attempting it in games which don't support it.

Crouch jumping is a pretty cool mechanic. In HL1 you could jump with space, which was often useful, and sometimes you had to judge that a leap was particularly tricky, and use a crouch jump instead.

There is in effect no crouch jump in Black Mesa, since you never get to make this decision; you just have to press ctrl-space to do an ordinary jump. Much less interesting.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2012, 06:45:22 am by General Battuta »

 

Offline deathfun

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
I prefer the "Climb" mechanic

...Because it actually makes physical sense
Get it?
Physical sense?
Physical?
I'm laughing by myself aren't I...
"No"

 

Offline Crybertrance

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
I was raised on Half Life, so crouch jumping is second nature to me. I never have a problem doing it, and find myself attempting it in games which don't support it.

+1

Good to know I'm not the only one who does that :p

Me too  ;)

Maybe we should form a support group - "Crouch-Jumpers Anonymous."

Aye!

Crouch jumping is a pretty cool mechanic. In HL1 you could jump with space, which was often useful, and sometimes you had to judge that a leap was particularly tricky, and use a crouch jump instead.

There is in effect no crouch jump in Black Mesa, since you never get to make this decision; you just have to press ctrl-space to do an ordinary jump. Much less interesting.

I dont know how you play, but I've done many "normal" jumps (a little sprint before that, sure) in BM. And you still have to analyse the gap before deciding weather to do a crouch-jump or not...



EDIT- Just set a tweak to enable slower (toggle key) walking (because the 'walking' in BM (or HL, HL2 (episodes), etc. is actually running). And by God does it improve immersion....especially in the first two chapters.
<21:08:30>   Hartzaden fires a slammer at Cybertrance
<21:09:13>   Crybertrance pops flares, but wonders how Hartzaden acquired aspect lock on a stealth fighter... :\
<21:11:58>   *** The_E joined #bp [email protected]
21:11:58   +++ ChanServ has given op to The_E
<21:12:58>   Hartzaden continues to paint crybertrance and feeding the info to a wing of gunships
<21:14:07>   Crybertrance sends emergency "IM GETING MY ASS KICKED HERE!!!!eleventy NEED HELPZZZZ" to 3rd fleet command
<21:14:50>   Hartzaden jamms the transmission.
<21:14:51>   The_E explodes the sun

 

Offline redsniper

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
Yeah, I don't mind crouch-jumping and had not problem with it in HL1. It's just that in black mesa it seems like you have to crouch-jump to get on top of anything, and the normal jump is basically useless. Normal jump was enough to hop over desks and stuff in HL1, IIRC.
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Offline Polpolion

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
Tbh I always used to crouch jump exclusively anyway in HL1 and only stopped because it's not a thing in so many games. I actually don't think it's a big deal here in bms unless your controls are set up so it's difficult to crouch jump, in which case your controls are wrong.

 

Offline Crybertrance

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
Tbh I always used to crouch jump exclusively anyway in HL1 and only stopped because it's not a thing in so many games. I actually don't think it's a big deal here in bms unless your controls are set up so it's difficult to crouch jump, in which case your controls are wrong.

Yeah exactly... :rolleyes:
<21:08:30>   Hartzaden fires a slammer at Cybertrance
<21:09:13>   Crybertrance pops flares, but wonders how Hartzaden acquired aspect lock on a stealth fighter... :\
<21:11:58>   *** The_E joined #bp [email protected]
21:11:58   +++ ChanServ has given op to The_E
<21:12:58>   Hartzaden continues to paint crybertrance and feeding the info to a wing of gunships
<21:14:07>   Crybertrance sends emergency "IM GETING MY ASS KICKED HERE!!!!eleventy NEED HELPZZZZ" to 3rd fleet command
<21:14:50>   Hartzaden jamms the transmission.
<21:14:51>   The_E explodes the sun

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
Tbh I always used to crouch jump exclusively anyway in HL1 and only stopped because it's not a thing in so many games. I actually don't think it's a big deal here in bms unless your controls are set up so it's difficult to crouch jump, in which case your controls are wrong.

Yeah exactly... :rolleyes:

I always quickscope in every game, so I have no problem with the 'fire' command in Black Mesa being rebound to M1+M2. It's just good design.

e: By which I mean to say that it's dumb to have a vestigial jump function that does nothing and then a 'crouch jump' which handles all jumping. Ideally you'd have a regular jump that does some stuff and a crouch jump which does even more.

In typical HLP fashion people are already building quote stacks and dropping in outraged eyerolls and insisting it's NOT A BIG DEAL because clearly a discussion about crouch jumping being a bit silly must be a discussion about how BLACK MESA IS ****ING RUINED BY CROUCH JUMPING, but actually, no, this is just a design point to calmly discuss and remark upon, not a 2/10 from eurogamer dot net. Chill.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2012, 01:02:18 pm by General Battuta »

 

Offline MatthTheGeek

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
Hey, you're the one coming back to it again and again. YOU chill ! :p

After all, it IS not a big deal.
People are stupid, therefore anything popular is at best suspicious.

Mod management tools     -     Wiki stuff!     -     Help us help you

666maslo666: Releasing a finished product is not a good thing! It is a modern fad.

SpardaSon21: it seems like you exist in a permanent state of half-joking misanthropy

Axem: when you put it like that, i sound like an insane person

bigchunk1: it's not retarded it's american!
bigchunk1: ...

batwota: steele's maneuvering for the coup de gras
MatthTheGeek: you mispelled grâce
Awaesaar: grace
batwota: oh right :P
Darius: ah!
Darius: yes, i like that
MatthTheGeek: the way you just spelled it it means fat
Awaesaar: +accent I forgot how to keyboard
MatthTheGeek: or grease
Darius: the killing fat!
Axem: jabba does the coup de gras
MatthTheGeek: XD
Axem: bring me solo and a cookie

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
I've heard a lot of *****ing about Marine DPS on Medium+. I haven't had much in the way of trouble and I'm doing my run on Hard, but from a design standpoint, I do think the Marines are a little above where they should be. There's no mid-range game at all because groups of Marines punish exposure so hard, which means the 'correct' way to solve Marine encounters is either baiting them into shotgun ambushes or using high-alpha long-range guns like the magnum and crossbow. The SMG is right out.

I think part of the problem is the near-zero reaction times on first encounter with Marines (and also with Vortigaunts). They need a little bit more time flat-footed. Fortunately this can all be handled pretty easily by editing some text files.

 

Offline An4ximandros

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
 Or stop whining about the Marine's health (that wear BODY ARMOR) and use the crapton of explosives and mines to lure them into traps.
They move in squads so... they do all the work for me after that. heheh... poor bastards.

Run. Think. Shoot. Live.

I like they tried to put the think back in after Valve dropped it.

Oh and the new Gluon gun is a crime against Xenkind.

 

Offline deathfun

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
Marines
Highly trained soldiers

Makes sense they're good at shooting you
"No"

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: You remember that mod Black Mesa? Well, its releasing in two weeks!
Or stop whining about the Marine's health (that wear BODY ARMOR) and use the crapton of explosives and mines to lure them into traps.
They move in squads so... they do all the work for me after that. heheh... poor bastards.

Go back, read what I said, think about how it relates to what you said. The problem is not my problem, since I'm not having any trouble; body armor has nothing to do with it, since body armor doesn't work the way you seem to think it does, and the problem isn't about hit points or health anyway; and explosives fall under the same category as shotgun ambushes, i.e. tactics that are easy and fun to use but shouldn't be the only viable approach.

While I personally like the balance the way it is, and will probably actually amp up marine damage a little with some modding, this is a design issue which doesn't particularly care about what I think. I worry that they accidentally cut out about two thirds of the combat space in Marine encounters, and in the process compressed their tactical freedom compared to the original, removing a lot of options. Evening out the initial spike on the DPS curve would probably help fix it.

Interestingly this is precisely the opposite problem that HL2 has, where the mid-range space is completely open because Combine soldiers and their SMGs can't hit anything. In HL2 it encouraged a lot of mobility and physics play but also incentivized shotgun rushing, which was pretty dull. Black Mesa's compressed spaces come in somewhere near high-difficulty Mass Effect 3 or Call of Duty, where you're anchored to cover and pop out briefly to use high alpha weapons. I imagine that wasn't exactly what they were going for.

e: The other place this causes trouble is during all the famous marine vs. alien fights where the marines are always winning now.  Boo!