Author Topic: Something bugging me about "Fallen Angel"  (Read 5365 times)

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Offline Scotty

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Re: Something bugging me about "Fallen Angel"
Given that we have, in either universe of BP canon, never seen more than one Lucifer per universe, it could be very much a unique ship.  In that case, the escorts don't matter when compared to its safety, and when the escorts are beaten it withdraws to avoid a useless push.  The Lucifer becomes, in effect, the gold-standard when the currency being exchanged is effective combat capability.  As soon as the Orestes battlegroup over draws its line of credit (makes a tactical error of significance), the Lucifer comes to collect.

The engagement the Lucifer actually fights is probably the worst one it could have asked for; head-on into the Orestes and escorts' fire, giving them time to reorient for maximum effectiveness and deploy extra fightercraft, doing all possible work with its own beams rather than offloading any responsibility to bombers, and with no other ships to provide a damage sump.

Aside from, you know, the Demon that's also participating in the fight.  I'd hardly call a second destroyer "no other ships", and given what we see in "Curse of Prescience", that positioning would have led rather quickly to the Orestes and battlegroup's total defeat in a matter of minutes had the Vishnans not intervened.

All of which leaves aside the possibility that the Lucifer didn't pick that particular fight.  There isn't a set turn order to combat, especially not on the scale we see throughout AoA.  Just because the Lucifer initiated the first engagement, or the first two, or the first eight doesn't mean the Orestes can't turn the tables.

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: Something bugging me about "Fallen Angel"
Doesn't the Orestes actually provide some pretty clear information on this

 

Offline rubixcube

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Re: Something bugging me about "Fallen Angel"
Yes, I believe Orestes control states they were "boxed in by the Lucifer"
Stuff

 
Re: Something bugging me about "Fallen Angel"
i love how the orestes, a chimera and a bellerophon were able to hold off at least two destroyers, tons of fighters and god knows what else, after having spent days without any support whatsoever beyond a single anemoi

Well they better be able to, given that they're fighting ships they were specifically designed to outmatch, and they have the support of 'a single Anemoi' which is a huge amount of logistics.

If they couldn't that would indicate Tev fleet doctrine has completely failed.


Well....uh...they couldn't. Sam's whole quest to save the Orestes and her ships and all. 'Without your timely intervention, our destruction would have surely been likely.' Either Adm. Bei or Orestes Control said that, IIRC. So...yeah. Given that the SD Hyde was destroyed in the opening seconds of the engagement (before the Orestes had even taken any real damage), it's kind of shocking if the Lucifer truly would have won against a relatively fresh Raynor, a Bellerophon, a Chimera, and a Hyperion.
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Offline Klaustrophobia

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Re: Something bugging me about "Fallen Angel"
the TEI ships are meant to be playing offense, not defense.  the gtva is running from the shivans in AoA.
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Offline General Battuta

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Re: Something bugging me about "Fallen Angel"
i love how the orestes, a chimera and a bellerophon were able to hold off at least two destroyers, tons of fighters and god knows what else, after having spent days without any support whatsoever beyond a single anemoi

Well they better be able to, given that they're fighting ships they were specifically designed to outmatch, and they have the support of 'a single Anemoi' which is a huge amount of logistics.

If they couldn't that would indicate Tev fleet doctrine has completely failed.


Well....uh...they couldn't. Sam's whole quest to save the Orestes and her ships and all. 'Without your timely intervention, our destruction would have surely been likely.' Either Adm. Bei or Orestes Control said that, IIRC. So...yeah. Given that the SD Hyde was destroyed in the opening seconds of the engagement (before the Orestes had even taken any real damage), it's kind of shocking if the Lucifer truly would have won against a relatively fresh Raynor, a Bellerophon, a Chimera, and a Hyperion.

You're completely ignoring the context of the engagement, and even what's been said in this thread. Think about it some more, try again.