Author Topic: First Ones cap ship questions  (Read 2926 times)

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Offline FUBAR-BDHR

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First Ones cap ship questions
It seems like the conversions on a few of the first ones cap ships were never really finished. 

The TS capital ship is mostly done just missing some subsystems and maybe some turret tweaks.  Are there any good reference shots on this ship taking damage in combat?  Right now just the very tips of the turrets are set to blow off which I don't think looks quite right but want to make sure it's not canon before changing it. 

The KI Lordship is  also missing subsystems but the real issue here is the floating turrets.  Is this canon or are they supposed to be attached to the ship somehow.  Are they supposed to move or be stationary?

MR Thoughtforce, TS Dark Knife, and TR Triumviron seem complete except for subsystems and of course debris.  Giving them a quick check in the lab wouldn't hurt though.

And just a reminder that B4 was never finished so if anyone wants to model that sucker feel free. 
 
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Offline wesp5

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Re: First Ones cap ship questions
The TS capital ship is mostly done just missing some subsystems and maybe some turret tweaks.  Are there any good reference shots on this ship taking damage in combat?

While I don't know what the TS stands for, I don't think we ever see First Ones ships take damage in the short time they are seen.

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The KI Lordship is  also missing subsystems but the real issue here is the floating turrets.  Is this canon or are they supposed to be attached to the ship somehow.  Are they supposed to move or be stationary?

They are not attached and are moving around the ship, see at minute 1:40 here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIpg-N_Pp-g

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MR Thoughtforce, TS Dark Knife, and TR Triumviron seem complete except for subsystems and of course debris.  Giving them a quick check in the lab wouldn't hurt though.

Are there any missions actually featuring them? I seem to remember that Into the Fire was referenced in one campaign back, no?

 

Offline starbug

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Re: First Ones cap ship questions
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While I don't know what the TS stands for, I don't think we ever see First Ones ships take damage in the short time they are seen.

TS  stands for the Thirdspace aliens, The only time we see one of their captials take damage is when the gate explodes. We never even see one of those capital ships open fire, so unless there has been other stuff released i think all the weapons on that ship are guess work, i think. No we never see the First one vessels taking damage, i watched that episode last night and we only see them come in kicking ass and destroying the Vorlon planet killer and never taking any damage.
http://www.youtube.com/user/AnubisX1

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Offline FUBAR-BDHR

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Re: First Ones cap ship questions
Got the Ts capital figured out the best I can and started looking at the others. 

Mindraiders Thoughtforce:  The only reference I can find on this is one single pic.  It appears to me as if the model is flying backwards and the pic makes it look like there is an engine flame coming out the back which is the front of our version.  Of course it's not the best pic so that could also be a beam either being fired or hitting the ship.  So the first thing we need is to decide what way this thing is supposed to be oriented.  After that I can figure out how to fix the model so the turrets and subsystems work correctly. 

The Triad Triumviron:  This one is probably the easiest to figure out.  Mainly a where the heck should it be firing from issue.  It has 3 arms with a reactor at the end of each arm and what appears to be a firing point attached to each reactor.  Right now it has 4 beam turrets located in the center of the ship where they can't even be shot at.  So we can either leave all 4 beams firing from the center of the ship or move 3 to the arms and have one main in the center.

Kirishiac Lordship:  This one is going to be a nightmare.  Those floating objects around the ship are currently set up as stationary turrets.  In the video they appear to be thrusters of some kind not weapons at all.  Either way having them rotate and be useful is going to be a pain.  Of course first we need to decide if they are thrusters, weapons, or both.
No-one ever listens to Zathras. Quite mad, they say. It is good that Zathras does not mind. He's even grown to like it. Oh yes. -Zathras

 

Offline wesp5

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Re: First Ones cap ship questions
Mindraiders Thoughtforce:  The only reference I can find on this is one single pic.  It appears to me as if the model is flying backwards and the pic makes it look like there is an engine flame coming out the back which is the front of our version.

There is a sequence which shows this ship fighting at 1:44 in the link above. The flame is indeed the back of the ship and it fires white projectiles from the center of the other side.

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Kirishiac Lordship:  This one is going to be a nightmare.  Those floating objects around the ship are currently set up as stationary turrets.  In the video they appear to be thrusters of some kind not weapons at all.  Either way having them rotate and be useful is going to be a pain.  Of course first we need to decide if they are thrusters, weapons, or both.

I think they are neither thrusters nor weapons, so we could just see them as ornaments which would probably make the whole deal easier ;).

 

Offline FUBAR-BDHR

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Re: First Ones cap ship questions
Every pic I've seen and even in the video the lordhship has yellow thruster like flames coming out of those objects.
No-one ever listens to Zathras. Quite mad, they say. It is good that Zathras does not mind. He's even grown to like it. Oh yes. -Zathras

 

Offline wesp5

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Re: First Ones cap ship questions
Every pic I've seen and even in the video the lordhship has yellow thruster like flames coming out of those objects.

This was a misunderstanding, of course it has flames come out, but I don't think it uses them to actually steer ;)!

 

Offline FUBAR-BDHR

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Re: First Ones cap ship questions
OK so it's a "thruster like" effect.  Still not sure what the heck to do.  I think they can be made to rotate with an attached effect like that but changing them from weapons would break any mission that uses that ship.  Could get around that by moving the weapons elsewhere on the hull of the ship.  I'm pretty sure weapons on rotating subobjects is still not possible.

The Triumviron isn't going to be as easy as I though.  Turns out the main weapon is fired out of the center of the tip of the 3 arms.  Problem is there is there is an energy effect going from each arm to the center.  This is going to require some kind of effect that I'm not really sure how to handle.  I think it could be modeled in as a transparent effect on some geometry but I've only ever seen that done with smoke effects. 
No-one ever listens to Zathras. Quite mad, they say. It is good that Zathras does not mind. He's even grown to like it. Oh yes. -Zathras

 

Offline wesp5

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Re: First Ones cap ship questions
OK so it's a "thruster like" effect.  Still not sure what the heck to do.  I think they can be made to rotate with an attached effect like that but changing them from weapons would break any mission that uses that ship.

Are there any missions using this ship anyway? And do they use other weapons than the main gun?

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The Triumviron isn't going to be as easy as I though.  Turns out the main weapon is fired out of the center of the tip of the 3 arms.  Problem is there is there is an energy effect going from each arm to the center.

In my enhanced effects mod I changed the Vorlon muzzle flash to include energy lines going from the center of the sprite to the corners and while the orientation isn't checked, it looks convincing in the game!

 

Offline FUBAR-BDHR

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Re: First Ones cap ship questions
Problem is this energy effect was on all the time not just while firing the weapon.  Well that is only one of the problems.  What if one reactor is destroyed should the energy effect still remain for the other 2?  And how the heck do you get it to work in the game?
No-one ever listens to Zathras. Quite mad, they say. It is good that Zathras does not mind. He's even grown to like it. Oh yes. -Zathras

 

Offline Slasher

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Re: First Ones cap ship questions
There's a ship in Between the Ashes that actually uses that transparency-with-animated-eff to simulate some kind of arc between a couple of pylons on a gas miner, so that method could be applied to get an "always on" lightshow.  I'm guessing a no-collide surface could be added to the model with the animated map.  I don't know if all that is worth the effort.