[Grizzly]

Hello folks.

I have been looking at joysticks lately, and since I want to return to flightsimming in a good way, I have decided to take a look at different sets available.

And bloody hell. Seriously. Have those companies never heard of midrange market? There is a HUUGE gap between joysticks that cost 30 euros and are quite cool, and joysticks which set you back 250 euros - it looks like there is nothing in between, which is seriously distressing.

Anyway, I have been looking around, and I saw two viable choices for my flight simming:
The Saitek X-52 systems (various variants, both Pro and non-pro HOTAS, Combat or normal rudders, sold seperately).
The Logitech G940 (which is an all-in set).

The Logitech G940 has Force Feedback, which gives it an edge in prop sims (which I do a lot). However, I have never used Force Feedback in a joystick before, and I am certain that I can live without it. I worry about reliability. I won't be using these sets all that much, and I don't have an awfull lot of money, so I want something that lasts. Preferably something like 10 years.
WIth that in mind, should I get the Saitek or the Logitech?

[Dragon]

CH Products.
Really, it's an obscure third option few people know about, but those who do have a set of their controllers (read: me and Nuke) swear by their reliability and flexibility. They all come with a special control manager vastly superior to stuff like PPJoy and the like. They're also built like a rock and bristling with buttons. None of them have force feedback, and they're best for people with big hands, but that's about it when it comes to flaws. Try looking into them.

[Grizzly]

I have big hands (and positively huge feet), and do not care about Force Feedback (although it would be a great bonus, I fear the reduced reliability).

Unfortunately, the CH product line is not for sale in the Netherlands (Which is why this topic exists in the first place ). Unless I can find a company that ships those things abroad, I will have to settle with either Saitek or Logitech.

[Dragon]

It's safe to buy a used set. They're not for sale in Poland, either, I've gotten my set that way. Check E-bay, Amazon and if everything fails, I think that the store at CH site should offer shipping their stuff abroad (though it'd be rather costly).

[Nuke]

ch pewns

[redsniper]

ch pewns

Second.

[Grizzly]

It's safe to buy a used set.

.

People sell their CH sets? .

Are the rudders still good if you have a size 51/UK size 15/US size 16 shoe?
Or should I get the Saitek rudders and combine it with CH joystick + throttle?

I am personally inclining more towards the Saitek right now as their HOTAS also has a twist rudder. Does CH products offer this?

EDIT: oops.

[Nuke]

it doesn't. but i dont miss it either.

[Mongoose]

That's the thing that's always given me pause about eventually looking into CH products, too.  I've never made any claims on having foot-eye coordination.

And while I'm thinking about it, how do Thrustmaster's offerings hold up?

[Nuke]

pedals aren't too bad. i always found that the twist handle was a bad idea. really its hard to do any fine control with a twist handle, and the force of which often throws off your x,y control as well. the only thing i dont like about the ch pedals is the spring tension on the rudder axis is a little high. so what i end up doing most of the time is combining the toe breaks into a single axis and using that instead. there are only a couple sims that that use toe breaks anyway, and in most games i prefer the break pedals.

ive always wanted to try out thrustmaster. the warthog is very impressive on paper. i especially like the metal construction. i think the price is equivalent to a full ch setup. ch gives you the option to buy it a piece at a time instead of one huge purchase. i figure i will get one when my ch gear breaks down, but i dont see that happening any time soon. especially since ch sells replacement parts.

[Grizzly]

I finally managed to find a company that ships CH products to the Netherlands! Whilst browsing trough the (belgian) site, I looked up the pedals. This is how CH products advertises their pedals:

RUGGED DESIGN: Feet strong. Feet smash things. PRO PEDALS built with potentiometers rated to two million cycles. Feet smash PRO PEDALS many times, PRO PEDALS still work. Feet like PRO PEDALS.

Yep. I am sold.

[Dragon]

That's CH for you. Built like a rock, with strong springs and zillions of buttons. They don't use twist handles of FF, but IMHO, that's for the better, since FF makes a stick less resilient and twist handles aren't generally used in actual aircraft. Personally, I've never had a problem with spring tension on the pedals, but I guess that's a matter of preference. Also, toe brakes can double as car pedals in almost all driving games (barring hardcore sims which have the clutch pedal implemented), and the stick isn't bad for driving either (though their flight yoke would most likely do better). They do take a while to get used to when switching to them, but once you do that, you'll never want to use anything else.

[Grizzly]

Oh god oh god oh god. I think I am getting ahead of myself - 100 euros for just a stick, 300 euros for the entire package? oh god oh god.

The thing is that my trusty thrustmaster T flight stick X has hold out for several years and cost only 30 euros - only now I am seeing problems. I really do wonder if 300 euros is what I want to spend on flight hardware... Mabye I should just go for the much cheaper X-52 instead and call it a day for now. Upgrade to CH once that one breaks down or something.

Aargh. These things are just waay to difficult for me :|. So much money!

[Dragon]

I think that you'd actually save money by going for CH. 300 euros once, and you're pretty much set for the rest of your flightsimming career. And your children probably too. I've paid a functional equivalent of 500 euros for mine. 500 zloty, actually. Going by exchange rates, it's 125 euros (it was an used set), but the "buying power" of Zloty in Poland is about the same as of euro in, say, Germany or France (though I have no idea about the Netherlands). It's a very simplified model, of course, but in general, I consider 300 euro for the whole set to be a decent deal. They're simply worth it. I've never heard of a broken CH stick, but the topic of a broken Saitek pops up from time to time.

[Nuke]

ive gone through no fewer than 2 saitek hotas sticks. they didnt last very long. i dont think i got more than two years out of either of them. im on 5+ years with my ch gear.

[Grizzly]

Hmm. The problem is mainly a psychological one. Saitek's X-52 offers a complete control package for 100 euros, whilst for CH products I need to dish out roughtly 250 (seperate rudder pedals). The problem is that I have NO idea on how long I will actually play flight sims. If I grow disinterested in them after half a year of playing, i'd rather have bought the cheaper Saitek one. On the other hand, I will probably glady shelf my Saitek knowing that I got good utility out of it and replace it with a CH stick later down the line.

That is, if CH doesn't go bankrupt because everyone who wants their sticks already has them.

[Nuke]

ch doesn't go bankrupt because they also manufacture extremely high end industrial joysticks.

you are probibly better off with an intermediate stick if you are not sure how far into the simulation genre you decide to go.

[nickd0121]

Personally I just bought an AV8R-01 from Saitek, pretty sure it's in the lower range and is a little bit different from my old Saitek Cyborg but works pretty well (esp. since I don't have a gigantic deadzone anymore). I particularly enjoy the rotate feature, as I've always found using the keyboard to rotate annoying.
It has two throttles that can be switched into one, but I'm not sure if Freespace can use a throttle? Also has like a thousand buttons on the bottom that don't have a use right now.

[Mongoose]

Yes, FS can use a throttle; for your usual back-and-forth throttle lever, you'd want to use the "Absolute Throttle Axis" bind in the control config.  I'm not sure how it'd handle the two-part throttle on that stick, but I'd think at least one of them should work.

[nickd0121]

Thanks Mongoose, not really good with configuring stuff