[headdie]

tbh though, I think we are going through a period of naval evolution.  In the current political climate there is little need for the traditional battle group as advanced nation vs advanced nation is unlikely due to both the economic implications and domestic political implications, making smaller deployments against low tech threats just as effective as a CBG with numerous frigates, destroyers and subs while allowing greater flexibility in deployment.

Also the UK and Europe is entering a phase of close co-operation in order to save cost while maintaining effectiveness, for example French and UK forces have on and off spent most of this year on joint training ops of one level or another in order to better facilitate future joint operations.

I am reading a book about how this is exactly what people were saying before WWI :tinfoil:

lol, unfortunately I am not well enough read up to get into that discussion

[Black Wolf]

tbh though, I think we are going through a period of naval evolution.  In the current political climate there is little need for the traditional battle group as advanced nation vs advanced nation is unlikely due to both the economic implications and domestic political implications, making smaller deployments against low tech threats just as effective as a CBG with numerous frigates, destroyers and subs while allowing greater flexibility in deployment.

Also the UK and Europe is entering a phase of close co-operation in order to save cost while maintaining effectiveness, for example French and UK forces have on and off spent most of this year on joint training ops of one level or another in order to better facilitate future joint operations.

I am reading a book about how this is exactly what people were saying before WWI :tinfoil:

The world is so different now though that the comparison isn't even relevant, especially amongst G20 nations that would proabbyl fit the "advanced" descriptor. Even ignoring the interconnectivity of global trade and information (which is probably (conservatively) hundreds of times stronger than it was 100 years ago), which would be the biggest barrier, we still have to consider
- the decline of the concept of a colonial empire, and the loss of the moral acceptibility of wars of conquest generally,
- the decline of the role of the military in public life across pretty much all major nations,
 - the decrease from 6 to 1 "great powers" (I don't think China quite counts just yet - 1.5 might be more accurate, or in a pinch 2 if you were willing to count Chna and Russia as half each),
 - the existence of NATO, the EU, the UN and other international organizations (they might not seem like they do much, but membership in supernational organizations has been statistically correlated to decreased warfighting (though admittedly not quite causally AFAIK)),
 - the decline in violence generally across western society (and, slower, in the east as well (outside of the muslim world))
 - and, of course, the bomb.

WWI really, really isn't a modern precedent.

[Dragon]

The fact that Invincibles launched only STOVL aircraft doesn't mean they couldn't launch normal ones.

Actually, it does. Without arrestor gear or catapults, launching conventional aircraft is kinda impossible when your flight deck is only 168 meters long.

Wait, it doesn't have arrestor gear? Strange, I was sure it had it. Catapults aren't needed for launching aircraft though (STOBAR aircraft can do with just a ramp).

[General Battuta]

tbh though, I think we are going through a period of naval evolution.  In the current political climate there is little need for the traditional battle group as advanced nation vs advanced nation is unlikely due to both the economic implications and domestic political implications, making smaller deployments against low tech threats just as effective as a CBG with numerous frigates, destroyers and subs while allowing greater flexibility in deployment.

Also the UK and Europe is entering a phase of close co-operation in order to save cost while maintaining effectiveness, for example French and UK forces have on and off spent most of this year on joint training ops of one level or another in order to better facilitate future joint operations.

I am reading a book about how this is exactly what people were saying before WWI :tinfoil:

The world is so different now though that the comparison isn't even relevant, especially amongst G20 nations that would proabbyl fit the "advanced" descriptor. Even ignoring the interconnectivity of global trade and information (which is probably (conservatively) hundreds of times stronger than it was 100 years ago), which would be the biggest barrier, we still have to consider
- the decline of the concept of a colonial empire, and the loss of the moral acceptibility of wars of conquest generally,
- the decline of the role of the military in public life across pretty much all major nations,
 - the decrease from 6 to 1 "great powers" (I don't think China quite counts just yet - 1.5 might be more accurate, or in a pinch 2 if you were willing to count Chna and Russia as half each),
 - the existence of NATO, the EU, the UN and other international organizations (they might not seem like they do much, but membership in supernational organizations has been statistically correlated to decreased warfighting (though admittedly not quite causally AFAIK)),
 - the decline in violence generally across western society (and, slower, in the east as well (outside of the muslim world))
 - and, of course, the bomb.

WWI really, really isn't a modern precedent.

This is a detailed counterargument to an argument the book doesn't make; but given that I don't buy the argument it makes either I don't know what to say beyond 'yes'
:

[Flipside]

Just can't help thinking it looks like the UK's Lego reserve has finally been put to use...

[headdie]

Just can't help thinking it looks like the UK's Lego reserve has finally been put to use...

this has barely scratched the surface lol

[deathfun]

Not going to lie, everytime I saw LHD on the previous page, I kept seeing "LSD" instead
Things got really confusing at that point


Either way, seeing a Carrier being constructed is actually pretty cool. Are they going to periodically update this stuff? Creating some sort of time lapse?

[Klaustrophobia]

here's a time lapse of the bow on the new Gerald Ford class under construction.

google CVN-78 and you'll find a lot more stuff, including the installation of the island.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=iAfAatm3A-s

[Nemesis6]

I don't get it... you can photograph the construction of state of the art warships, but if you take photos of the Gherkin, you're a potential terrorist. Odd people, those brits!

[Suongadon]

I don't get it... you can photograph the construction of state of the art warships, but if you take photos of the Gherkin, you're a potential terrorist. Odd people, those brits!

Uh... these aren't 'some guy on the street' taking pictures, they're officially released w/ permission of the Ministry of Defense.

[Klaustrophobia]

unless they are planning on throwing a tarp over the whole damn thing while at sea, there wouldn't be much point in classifying anything externally visible.  any sekret innard bits that might happen to be visible at any point during construction will be covered.

[headdie]

IIRC the length, beam and draft are publicly released info anyway.