Author Topic: dont think about bad furture (Read 14827 times)

Phantom Hoover · **Reply #40 on:** July 11, 2013, 02:50:01 pm

kids
kids

you're both terrible, stop fighting

haloboy100 · **Reply #41 on:** July 11, 2013, 02:51:16 pm

I wouldn't call this "fighting". I'd say this is nothing compared to what typically happens around here.

Quote from: Lorric on July 11, 2013, 02:44:25 pm

I've only got your word for that. I'm not saying it's wrong, but for me, any reality TV or retelling of a true story is treated completely differently to fiction. Fiction for instance I may root for a compelling villain (yes, I know that villain is ultimately going down, but still), but never if it was real. I might want a fictional serial killer for instance to elude the police and carry on killing because I like where it's taking the story, like seing it test the police characters, even like letting the villain build up my pseudo-hate for them, but real life, never.

There's plenty of evidence to back up what I said, but unlike how I feel a lot of people on this forum are inclined, I'm here to talk, not argue. and your point is valid and sound.

People love to try to romanticize life because of movies, though, in an innate attempt to blurr the line between reality and fiction. I can swerve this thought back towards the thread's point (if there is one...) that this is the reason people develop fantasy illusions of happiness in life when they may be none to have.

When the War of the Worlds radio special was first broadcasted, lots of people mistook it for an actual news reel stating that aliens were invading. Reiterating my point, the only way people decide that the news is real as opposed to movies is because they are told so.

Lorric · **Reply #42 on:** July 11, 2013, 03:01:52 pm

Quote from: haloboy100 on July 11, 2013, 02:51:16 pm

I wouldn't call this "fighting". I'd say this is nothing compared to what typically happens around here.
Quote from: Lorric on July 11, 2013, 02:44:25 pm
I've only got your word for that. I'm not saying it's wrong, but for me, any reality TV or retelling of a true story is treated completely differently to fiction. Fiction for instance I may root for a compelling villain (yes, I know that villain is ultimately going down, but still), but never if it was real. I might want a fictional serial killer forinstance to elude the police and carry on killing because I like where it's taking the story, like seing it test the police characters, even like letting the villain build up my pseudo-hate for them, but real life, never.
There's plenty of evidence to back up what I said, but unlike how I feel a lot of people on this forum are inclined, I'm here to talk, not argue. and your point is valid and sound.

People love to try to romanticize life because of movies, though, in an innate attempt to blurr the line between reality and fiction. I can swerve this thought back towards the thread's point (if there is one...) that his is the reason people develop fantasy illusions of happiness in life.

When the War of the Worlds radio special was first broadcasted, lots of people mistook it for an actual news reel stating that aliens were invading. Reiterating my point, the only way people decide that the news is real as opposed to movies is because they are told so.

I agree with a lot of what you say. I'm here to talk, not fight, I believe you when you say you're the same, and I also feel the same way you do about the forum.

I've never seen anyone really treat real and fiction on TV the same, but I've never analyzed people like that either. But you're making me think about my mother, who gets angry with me when I root for a villain, or want something to happen to a protagonist to test them. She treats it as if it is real. I've always never understood it.

Me, I tend to be able to tell, but I'm certainly not immune. There is a difference between real and not real. You can tell when something that's been created has been created compared to something that's real and just being shot on scene. Sure, if someone wanted to, they could recreate that feel, but in general I can see a clear difference between the two.

haloboy100 · **Reply #43 on:** July 11, 2013, 03:10:43 pm

Quote from: Lorric on July 11, 2013, 03:01:52 pm

I've never seen anyone really treat real and fiction on TV the same, but I've never analyzed people like that either. But you're making me think about my mother, who gets angry with me when I root for a villain, or want something to happen to a protagonist to test them. She treats it as if it is real. I've always never understood it.

Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. Our culture romanticizes things a lot more than you think - if you pay attention, you can notice that, subconsciously, people dwell on ideas taught in movies (that you will always win no matter how hard you try! The bad guy always loses! Bullies always pay!); take the american dream, for example. Even though America was definitely a profitable land of opportunity when the concept of the American Dream was relevant, it turned out for a very significant amount of people to be disappointing, or for some an outright lie. Advertisements fundamentally work on this romantic image; a quick example that comes to me is the "zoom zoom" commercial series, where you see the cars being driven on a pretty cliffside faces in an attempt to sell them, despite the fact that the average user of that vehicle would probably never experience that while driving.

Lorric · **Reply #44 on:** July 11, 2013, 03:22:26 pm

I can kind of understand it, but I can't really relate to it. Advertisements for instance, I see right through them. I honestly am completely immune to such things. The fluff in adverts, I know the messages movies portray are not how the real World works. I can't imagine what it would do to a mind that was susceptible to such things. I haven't taught myself to resist such things, I've been naturally immune to them my entire life. The example about the cars is one I particularly scoff at. I know the formula must work or they wouldn't do it, but it seems the height of idiocy to me that they don't advertise the cars by giving you a tour of the vehicle and a quick breakdown on performance stats and why it's better to buy than other cars in it's class. Again, I know they must advertise the way they do for a reason and that it must work, but to my brain, it's absolutely retarded! Car adverts rank up at the very top for me for "stupid" adverts. Only perfume ads for me are worse. I've always laughed at them, the only way you know you like one is to smell it.

haloboy100 · **Reply #45 on:** July 11, 2013, 03:30:51 pm

Yup, but as intuitively odd as it may strike you, you are a minority - and you can never disprove the possibility that you are influenced in a way you cannot forsee without knowing it.
That discussion regresses (at least IMO) into epistemological arguments, which I could (and have) write tons of papers about, but I don't want to get into that on an internet forum.

Lorric · **Reply #46 on:** July 11, 2013, 03:44:57 pm

Quote from: haloboy100 on July 11, 2013, 03:30:51 pm

Yup, but as intuitively odd as it may strike you, you are a minority - and you can never disprove the possibility that you are influenced in a way you cannot forsee without knowing it.
That discussion regresses (at least IMO) into epistemological arguments, which I could (and have) write tons of papers about, but I don't want to get into that on an internet forum.

I know I'm not influenced by adverts. That's testable because you know after you've bought the product and put it to use if you wanted it. I also know what you say is true, you can't tell if you're being influenced, otherwise, you wouldn't be being influenced. I'm sure movies will have some subtle influences on me.

Epistemology is a new word to me. It seems very complicated going by the wiki. And I don't know in what way you're using the word. Though if you're not going down that path anyway, I guess it's not important.

Anyway, if I am in the minority, then I guess I have a gift. If the ads are going after the majority in an effort to take their money, and I'm in the minority, I'm safe!

NGTM-1R · **Reply #47 on:** July 11, 2013, 04:01:25 pm

Quote from: Lorric on July 11, 2013, 03:44:57 pm

I know I'm not influenced by adverts. That's testable because you know after you've bought the product and put it to use if you wanted it.

No it's not. Just because you don't buy things doesn't mean you're not influenced by everything else in it.

Luis Dias · **Reply #48 on:** July 11, 2013, 04:20:08 pm

Adverts nowadays are all about selling you a way of life, an ideology of how to live, how to have friendships, love, etc., and then the product placements act almost like an afterthought inside their own ads, we think it's silly, but our brains fall for this **** more than we acknowledge.

deathfun · **Reply #49 on:** July 11, 2013, 04:32:51 pm

Quote

I want to see heroes

I want to see Batman
But we can't always get what we want

I'm also a sucker for Victoria's Secret advertisements
They get me to buy their **** everytime

haloboy100 · **Reply #50 on:** July 11, 2013, 04:52:20 pm

Quote from: Lorric on July 11, 2013, 03:44:57 pm

I know I'm not influenced by adverts. That's testable because you know after you've bought the product and put it to use if you wanted it. I also know what you say is true, you can't tell if you're being influenced, otherwise, you wouldn't be being influenced. I'm sure movies will have some subtle influences on me.

Epistemology is a new word to me. It seems very complicated going by the wiki. And I don't know in what way you're using the word. Though if you're not going down that path anyway, I guess it's not important.

Anyway, if I am in the minority, then I guess I have a gift. If the ads are going after the majority in an effort to take their money, and I'm in the minority, I'm safe!

Nope, you don't know, because the only way you can argue that you know is that you have proven it with evidence outside of the influence, to which: how do you know that that evidence is free of influence? How do you know that simply not buying the prodect renders you free of influence? Ads can influence you in a number of ways.

The approach I was referring to would be questioning how you would know you are not being influenced by something; unless you have evidence outside of the influence (which can be very difficult depending on context), you will have to question the nature of the knowledge you have, and the knowledge that lead you to that knowledge, and so on into regressus ad infinitum. You ultimately end up trying to objectively define what exactly knowledge is - hence, epistemology. The relevence this has to what we're talking about is pretty weak, but after spending a huge amound of academic time studying this I feel compelled to plug it in somewhere.
In the academic field, The Matrix is used as an elementary example of some epistemological themes; if you are in the matrix, the only way you could ever know you were not in the matrix would be to have evidence present from outside of it - and even then, how could you know that evidence isn't just another part of the matrix? For all Neo knows, he never left the matrix at all throughout the entire series; he deduced he left the matrix the same way he deduced that he was inside of it - using his senses.

Luis Dias · **Reply #51 on:** July 11, 2013, 04:54:47 pm

This is becoming outrageously off topic.

And not happy at all. I want happy in furture. Let's more happy in furture!

Axem · **Reply #52 on:** July 11, 2013, 05:14:33 pm

Somebody call for a cute parade?

Lorric · **Reply #53 on:** July 11, 2013, 05:55:37 pm

Looks like a few people have come.

Clarification: Ads can't make me buy something that I don't want. The best they can do is draw my attention to a product and if it's something I already want and didn't know about, then that's the only way the ad will successfully get me to make a buy. All this fluff has zero effect on me in regards to the purchase.

I wonder how ads would do if they were marketed at me. This is the only ad I can think of that is my kind of ad:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zR2Ox4HWaXM

They made a bunch of these, all with exactly the same theme.