[An4ximandros]

http://gaminrealm.com/2013/08/22/xbox360-xbox-one-81-features-locked-away-without-xbox-live-gold/
http://playeressence.com/xbox-live-gold-has-81-features-locked-behind-it-for-xbox-one/

Well please, take all the free stuff I can get in your previous console and on the competition and make me pay as well as making me pay for access to the ability to pay for the not-free stuff.

[Nuke]

lol, console peasants.

[Mikes]

There are probably way too many people (the majority of their fanbase and all the computer illiterates as well as the moms and dads who get it for little Jimmy after he whines for 3 months straight) that will just pay for it without a second thought for this to be a bad move for MS.

The people who would get mad enough about this to not buy an XBOne/Live are likely the minority or the people who were not even in the market for a console anyways.

[Black Wolf]

There are probably way too many people (the majority of their fanbase and all the computer illiterates as well as the moms and dads who get it for little Jimmy after he whines for 3 months straight) that will just pay for it without a second thought for this to be a bad move for MS.

The people who would get mad enough about this to not buy an XBOne/Live are likely the minority or the people who were not even in the market for a console anyways.

You think so? The idea of gamers - including console gamers - as 12 year old kids who rely on their parent incomes is massively outdated these days. The average age for a gamer is 32 in Australia, only very slightly younger that the average of the entire population. In other words, while it skews young, the gamer demographic is almost representative of the community as a whole. And remember, the average member of the community might not be as computer literate as the average PC Gamer is, but they are at least somewhat aware of the significance of lifetime cost vs up front cost - it might not be something that is generally thought about in games or consoles (at least, not as much as, for example, houses or cars) but the concept is there, and I think it does a bit of a disservice to people to just assume that it isn't.

And don't forget, almost nobody buys anything worth more than a few bucks without looking up reviews for it online first. If people are choosing between the XBox and the PS4, they're going to look up reviews, and - especially if they're looking at generic electronics sites as opposed to gaming specific ones - reviewers are going to mention any ongoing costs. This really could hurt Microsoft, if Sony are clever enough to exploit it.

[Mikes]

There are probably way too many people (the majority of their fanbase and all the computer illiterates as well as the moms and dads who get it for little Jimmy after he whines for 3 months straight) that will just pay for it without a second thought for this to be a bad move for MS.

The people who would get mad enough about this to not buy an XBOne/Live are likely the minority or the people who were not even in the market for a console anyways.

You think so? The idea of gamers - including console gamers - as 12 year old kids who rely on their parent incomes is massively outdated these days. The average age for a gamer is 32 in Australia, only very slightly younger that the average of the entire population. In other words, while it skews young, the gamer demographic is almost representative of the community as a whole. And remember, the average member of the community might not be as computer literate as the average PC Gamer is, but they are at least somewhat aware of the significance of lifetime cost vs up front cost - it might not be something that is generally thought about in games or consoles (at least, not as much as, for example, houses or cars) but the concept is there, and I think it does a bit of a disservice to people to just assume that it isn't.

And don't forget, almost nobody buys anything worth more than a few bucks without looking up reviews for it online first. If people are choosing between the XBox and the PS4, they're going to look up reviews, and - especially if they're looking at generic electronics sites as opposed to gaming specific ones - reviewers are going to mention any ongoing costs. This really could hurt Microsoft, if Sony are clever enough to exploit it.

The "kid gamer" was really just one example, but not what I would base my argument on.

I think you overestimate the amount of people who are willing to research what they buy.
Don't take me wrong ... I do research stuff heavily as well, but always had the impression that I am definitely not the majority.

And generally speaking... the more money people have the worse it gets. (I.e. especially people in their 30s + with a regular income and "fun" money to spend.)

When talking about the mass market, the informed consumer is a myth.

If anything, it's all about hype and advertising to get into peoples homes ...  but hardly about factual articles.

[Lorric]

I don't see how the XBOX ONE could possibly make you choose it over the PS4.

Simple fact is, something is going to have to make you choose, and the PS4 is simply superior right across the board. It even costs less.

[karajorma]

Lately Sony have been all too eager to take potshots at MS over their stupid decisions. Unless for some reason they're dumb enough to try to follow them on this one, they must be a queue a mile long behind the gun sights.

54. Pizza Hut – Yup, you need a Gold Subscription to order pizza. PREMIUM SERVICE.

Oh, they've got to be ****ing kidding.

[swashmebuckle]

Making people pay might actually be really good strategy in the long term. They've probably already lost most of the pre-launch customers who were on the fence due to their higher price/inferior hardware/smaller number of exclusive titles, but for those who are already committed it's a great psychological trap because people assign a higher value to something if they paid for it. They might well also play more as a result (to get their moneys worth), leading to further game sales.

[BritishShivans]

Naturally, such a process will eliminate everyone who isn't stupid, thus further pruning the customer demographic. 

[swashmebuckle]

Considering a game console is pretty much a pure luxury investment to begin with, I don't really see a problem with Microsoft using a paywall to increase their customers' level of satisfaction, especially not while there are alternatives that offer a similar experience without the fee. It should certainly be made clear to those customers what they are and aren't getting when they buy the box, though.

[karajorma]

I'd move this to the gaming forum if it weren't for the fact it appears that even MS doesn't think the XBox One is primarily a games console.

[Klaustrophobia]

TV..... TV..... TV......


more on topic - this SHOULD be a bad move for MS, but consumers as a whole have shown time and time again that they're too stupid for this to turn out badly for MS.  They are used to hate being slung at them on the internet, and it has never stopped them before.

[karajorma]

Unfortunately this is far too big a project to turn into another Zune.

[Lorric]

TV..... TV..... TV......

I had thought about posting that video earlier.

It must be done now.

All you have to do is type "TV TV TV" into Youtube and it's the top video.

I can't get my head around why anyone would buy it. If you ask them why they chose it, what possible reason could they have? Outside of people who just buy all of the consoles.

[swashmebuckle]

People do assign a lot of value to their accounts, "achievements" (ha!), and the general feeling of continuity and wellbeing that comes from loyalty to a brand, so I'd guess Microsoft is just focusing on retaining a big chunk of their existing install base (evident from all the America-specific marketing) rather than broadening their appeal and then extracting the maximum profit out of that base. It's possible that this will be their last real console so I can't guess what their broader strategy is.

[Scotty]

It could also be that Microsoft is going after the non-hardcore gamer who doesn't particularly care about issues we care about, much like Nintendo did with the Wii and Gamecube when Microsoft and Sony were still duking it out on console-power.

EDIT: That doesn't necessarily make an Xbox One a good purchase for any of us, but at least there's a reason behind it.  Personally, I've resolved myself to getting a PS4 when I can.  Probably as a Christmas gift to myself.  Thank you, employee discount at Target.

[swashmebuckle]

$500 is double what the Wii launched at, so I have my doubts whether the casual market will bite, especially since they haven't been trying to position it with the type of family friendly marketing that helped ship so many Wiis. They're definitely betting the farm on Kinect though, so I have no idea. The whole thing feels like the work of committees that were appointed by committees. Xbox live subscriptions clearly make them tons of money though, so they might end up making greater profits than Sony even if PS4 outsells Xbone by a wide margin.

[Scotty]

The Xbox One is also much more of a multimedia center than the Wii ever was.  It's clearly designed to replace PCs, other gaming consoles, home phones, and a good deal of other home electronics.

[Beskargam]

Home phones still exist?

[Dragon]

They do. Mine is great for calling various people when I'm at home; the connections go to my parents' phone bill, not mine. Though TBH, I toned it down after they noticed a significant increase in costly home-to-mobile calls. Though aside from that (and an occasional home-to-home call to my grandmother, they come cheap), it's indeed rather useless.