[SypheDMar]

For those of you who haven't heard of this, Project M (or Melee 2.0 depending on who you ask) is a Super Smash Bros. Brawl mod whose goal is to bring back the competitive and fast-paced gameplay of Super Smash Bros. Melee, which is the only game I play competitively and is also considered the best in the franchise and is still being played in EVO while Brawl is pretty much dead. Project M also has a goal of attempting to balance all of the characters so that they are all viable in 1v1 tournaments.

The newest version of Project M is bringing an entire new Game Mode called Turbo Mode, a mode where Smash goes to the illogical extreme of "fast-paced". Project M also brings in two returning characters from Melee that were cut out in Brawl, namely Roy and Mewtwo.

I don't think that there's a huge audience for Super Smash Bros. Melee players in this forum, but in case there are like-minded folks or folks who may be interested, here's a trailer for version 3.0 of Project M:

[Scourge of Ages]

Yeah, I've heard about it. I have a friend who's nuts for Melee, and is in love with this game.

I'd be willing to try it, if modding SSBB didn't require modding the Wii and was such a hassle. I'll look into it when it's done and when I have some free time.

[Mongoose]

Melee was the absolute ****, but I never really sank enough time into Brawl to get a good handle on how it differed.  Cool to see people are running with this though.

[TrashMan]

MEh.. I dont' own a console, so I play MUGEN...which is basicly every fighting game ever rolled into one. Seriously. Can you say a character selection screen so big that just going trouhg it takes 15 minutes?

I mena loo kat this s***!
https://www.google.hr/search?q=mugen+select+screen&client=firefox-a&hs=Un5&rls=org.mozilla:hr:official&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=57iNUqCiE4ud7QaVyIGADA&ved=0CAkQ_AUoAQ

[SypheDMar]

Melee was the absolute ****, but I never really sank enough time into Brawl to get a good handle on how it differed.  Cool to see people are running with this though.

Starting from 11:06 to 15-minute mark, the difference is explained in the Smash Bros. documentary from a competitive Melee player's perspective. It's considered slower and more defense-focused. Something not mentioned in the documentary is that Brawl is also less responsive to controller input.

@Scourge: It's not necessary to hard-mod your Wii, and I think there are ways to play Project M without modding it at all (Gecko OS I think only requires a 2 or less GB SD card). I use Revolution myself because it's less of a hassle (my SD card is greater than 2 GB), but all it is is soft modding, so messing with your hardware required.

[Mongoose]

Melee was the absolute ****, but I never really sank enough time into Brawl to get a good handle on how it differed.  Cool to see people are running with this though.

Starting from 11:06 to 15-minute mark, the difference is explained in the Smash Bros. documentary from a competitive Melee player's perspective. It's considered slower and more defense-focused. Something not mentioned in the documentary is that Brawl is also less responsive to controller input.

I can definitely see that, thinking back to when I last played it.  Everyone did feel a bit too unnaturally float-y.

MEh.. I dont' own a console, so I play MUGEN...which is basicly every fighting game ever rolled into one. Seriously. Can you say a character selection screen so big that just going trouhg it takes 15 minutes?

Yes, but that's the sort of bog-standard, memorize-twenty-combos, round-done-in-30-seconds fighting game that I personally strongly dislike.  Smash Bros. is refreshingly different in that every character uses the exact same control inputs for all of their various special moves, and the emphasis on knocking your opponent off the screen instead of just dealing damage allows for some really crazy stuff instead of just a combo-input twtichfest.  Also there are the items...unless you're the "Fox only, Final Destination" type.

[Spoon]

No items, fox only, final destination

I never quite got why people played these games competitively when these games are not at all developed as competitive games in the first place. Why not, ya know. Play an actual competitive fighting game? Like Street fighter/any other 2D fighter or Tekken/VF/DoA/etc?

Project M also has a goal of attempting to balance all of the characters so that they are all viable in 1v1 tournaments.

So they are basically doing what the devs never did.

[Phantom Hoover]

Yeah, these projects all seem to be unfortunately underpinned by an unpleasant attitude that Brawl was 'dumbed down for the casuals', as though it's the devs' job to make sure the game still meets the needs of the physicsbending competitive crowd.

[TwentyPercentCooler]

Yeah, I think "competitive" play is kinda missing the entire point of SSB. It's meant to be FUN, so instead, a bunch of megadouches decide to squeeze all the innocence out of it and turn it into nothing but math and twitch reflexes. How about no.

[TrashMan]

Yes, but that's the sort of bog-standard, memorize-twenty-combos, round-done-in-30-seconds fighting game that I personally strongly dislike.  Smash Bros. is refreshingly different in that every character uses the exact same control inputs for all of their various special moves, and the emphasis on knocking your opponent off the screen instead of just dealing damage allows for some really crazy stuff instead of just a combo-input twtichfest.  Also there are the items...unless you're the "Fox only, Final Destination" type.

Wouldn't that depend on the characters you download? I'm no fan of cheap characters with super-exploitable combos.
And given that Mugen is incredibly moddalbe, a smash bros battle mode probably already exists

[AdmiralRalwood]

No items, fox only, final destination

I never quite got why people played these games competitively when these games are not at all developed as competitive games in the first place. Why not, ya know. Play an actual competitive fighting game? Like Street fighter/any other 2D fighter or Tekken/VF/DoA/etc?

Most fighting games played as "actual competitive fighting games" tend to demand a high physical price, as you have to react to threats with a 5-or-more step action in 1/60th of a second. As Mongoose mentioned, every character in SSB uses exactly the same controls, and there are no "QCF,HCB+XY" inputs that have to be performed in response to a specific stage in an incoming combo, and let's not even mention things like Ivy's special input throws from the Soul series (I've never ever seen anyone pull those off outside of training).

Besides, there are people who will play anything competitively.

Yes, but that's the sort of bog-standard, memorize-twenty-combos, round-done-in-30-seconds fighting game that I personally strongly dislike.  Smash Bros. is refreshingly different in that every character uses the exact same control inputs for all of their various special moves, and the emphasis on knocking your opponent off the screen instead of just dealing damage allows for some really crazy stuff instead of just a combo-input twtichfest.  Also there are the items...unless you're the "Fox only, Final Destination" type.

Wouldn't that depend on the characters you download? I'm no fan of cheap characters with super-exploitable combos.

Yes, it strongly depends on which characters you download, given that you can re-create a wide variety of other fighting games to a high degree of accuracy (not 100% accuracy if they require tag-team functionality, although that's been requested so many times we may eventually see it). There are characters that are so broken that they win the fight before it begins (yes, some people actually do this), and then there are some characters that couldn't defeat a wet paper bag (the extreme version of this being the "punching bag" character that is exactly what it sounds like). Most people prefer characters to be somewhere in the middle.

And given that Mugen is incredibly moddalbe, a smash bros battle mode probably already exists

Given that the 1.1 beta adds zoom functionality to stages, this may actually be possible now, if someone were to spend an inordinate amount of time on it.

[Mongoose]

Yeah, I did play a bit of Mugen ages ago in a college video game club, and it seemed like the main purpose was to generally reproduce the fighting styles of a bunch of different franchises, along with all sorts of other craziness obviously.  The best one I saw had to be that douchebag Light from Death Note, where you'd win with a single button-press by him using his book.

[Spoon]

on the subject of mugen: Saltybet.com

[Lorric]

No items, fox only, final destination

I never quite got why people played these games competitively when these games are not at all developed as competitive games in the first place. Why not, ya know. Play an actual competitive fighting game? Like Street fighter/any other 2D fighter or Tekken/VF/DoA/etc?

Project M also has a goal of attempting to balance all of the characters so that they are all viable in 1v1 tournaments.

So they are basically doing what the devs never did.

Now, I don't even play these games (only because of the fact I've gone down the Playstation road) but games are what you make them. If a game is good it's worth playing competitively. And there are so many top characters from top games built into such an acclaimed game, I can totally see why a competitive scene could build up. It's kind of like saying *insert game/sport X* shouldn't be played competitively because it wasn't designed to be.

[Fenrir]

Project M is amazing regardless of your stance on competitive smash bros. If you sit down and play the thing, you're presented with a responsive game engine filled with fun to play characters who are pretty well balanced with respect to each other. The only shame is that the game wasn't like this to begin with!

[MatthTheGeek]

If a game is good it's worth playing competitively.

You sir, are why we can't have nice things.

[yuezhi]

Oh, Burn!

[Fenrir]

Yeah, I think "competitive" play is kinda missing the entire point of SSB. It's meant to be FUN, so instead, a bunch of megadouches decide to squeeze all the innocence out of it and turn it into nothing but math and twitch reflexes. How about no.

The problem with Brawl is that it's just slower and less rewarding overall regardless of how it's being played. There are all sorts of strange design decisions and oddities in the game that I can't figure out why they ever happened.

[Lorric]

If a game is good it's worth playing competitively.

You sir, are why we can't have nice things.

I don't even like competitive play myself. I just mean it will spawn competitive play.

It doesn't have to be one or the other. A game balanced to allow competitive play doesn't have to eliminate casual play. You can have both. Games are what you make them. Another person will play a game totally differently to how you will.

[TrashMan]

Yeah, I did play a bit of Mugen ages ago in a college video game club, and it seemed like the main purpose was to generally reproduce the fighting styles of a bunch of different franchises, along with all sorts of other craziness obviously.  The best one I saw had to be that douchebag Light from Death Note, where you'd win with a single button-press by him using his book.

Ok, now I have to track down that character...just so I can beat the living snot out of him.

I'm not worrierd, as I have "You are already dead"Kenshiro, Ikki "you will wish you were already dead" Phoenix and  Chuck "the God-Emperor" Norris on my roster.