Author Topic: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.4 (launcher / mod installer)  (Read 18535 times)

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Offline ngld

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Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
That's not true anymore. All FSO builds now use the working directory as the default directory where they search for the root VPs.
It seems like you're right about Windows and Linux. However on MacOS that doesn't seem to be the case.

Installing now. Everything from Windows Smartscreen to Avast started yelling about DANGER! That's a hurdle we need to overcome if this is gonna go more general.
I'm open to suggestions. AFAIK the warning is based on the fact that not too many people have installed this before. If anyone knows why these programs are complaining or how to avoid it, I'd gladly listen.

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
Yeah. Avast thinks it's an extremely rare file. I told Avast I trust it!

 

Offline chief1983

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Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
That APPLE_APP functionality was only recently restored.  It has been restored to fix being able to run the app bundle from the finder by doubleclicking it, just like you can on Windows.  It was complaining until recently that it could not be run from the drive root.  We can adjust the behavior of the APPLE_APP define as long as we don't break that (ideally, not sure we absolutely need that behavior but it was considered a regression).  There are still some issues with the app bundles and Mac in general we need to resolve anyway though.
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Offline jg18

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Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
This looks really cool. I'll try it out and comment as soon as I can from the point of view of a former wxL co-project lead.

Just wanted to reply to chief real quick that I'd strongly prefer for FSO to remain runnable from the Finder as long as it doesn't make SCP devs' lives significantly harder. We can continue that discussion over PM or in another thread though.

 

Offline chief1983

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Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
Yeah if nothing else I'd hate for us to decide a bug I just helped fix didn't need to be fixed after all :P
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iamzack:  i dont have hamynerge i just want ptatoc hips D:
redsniper:  Platonic hips?!
iamzack:  lays

 

Offline mjn.mixael

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Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
OK, I need to read all this and learn how Knossos works still... but I think this is probably one of the most important developments we have going on right now based on what my understanding is so far. That said... how do I get involved in the UI design for the player's side of things? I have thoughts and ideas. (Note, I have not yet downloaded Knossos and looked at it. Will do that tonight after work.)
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Offline chief1983

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Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
Yeah I think the UI will make or break this on the player's (Knossos) side of things.  The terminology actually really makes sense - Knossos is the portal to the Nebula, Nebula is the workspace where modders configure and set up their mods for Knossos to install them.  As I understand it anyway.  The Nebula could also have a user aspect to it as well, similar to GOG or Steam's websites.  But Knossos is the client and the only thing a player would really need to use to get things.
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"You may not sell or otherwise commercially exploit the source or things you created based on the source." -- Excerpt from FSO license, for reference

Nuclear1:  Jesus Christ zack you're a little too hamyurger for HLP right now...
iamzack:  i dont have hamynerge i just want ptatoc hips D:
redsniper:  Platonic hips?!
iamzack:  lays

 
Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
From the deep analysis method of glancing at the GitHub manifest an hour ago, I think the frontend ui's all done in HTML.
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Offline ngld

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Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
Most of the UI is done with Qt and can be edited using the Qt Designer the relevant files are in the ui subfolder.
The mod list (and welcome page) is realized using HTML/CSS/JS and the relevant files are in the html subfolder.

The actual application is written in Python and uses PyQt5 to interface with Qt.

This looks really cool. I'll try it out and comment as soon as I can from the point of view of a former wxL co-project lead.
Thanks! That would be really helpful. Did you run into any problems with AV software?

I have thoughts and ideas.
I'll be glad to hear them. :)

Yeah I think the UI will make or break this on the player's (Knossos) side of things.  The terminology actually really makes sense - Knossos is the portal to the Nebula, Nebula is the workspace where modders configure and set up their mods for Knossos to install them.  As I understand it anyway.  The Nebula could also have a user aspect to it as well, similar to GOG or Steam's websites.  But Knossos is the client and the only thing a player would really need to use to get things.
I'm glad that you picked up on the naming scheme. That's pretty much what I (and Hellzed) intended. :D

 
Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
Feedback:

- your AUR package should have qt5-webkit as a dependency

- I selected 'install a TC', pointed it at an empty directory and tried to get a Diaspora install set up. When I click 'install Diaspora' it says that it can't, because FSO is missing. I installed the FSO nightly as well but it still gives the same error message.
The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell.

 
Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
Ah, OK, I see that the mod installation functionality is in much earlier stages than I thought.

I started from scratch just doing an FSO installation from the GoG launcher, something which proceeded with admirable smoothness; I had a working FSO install up and ready with a few clicks. Some more writing in the installer to make the process self-documenting for a new user would be a good aim, I think. Also I think the launcher should provide a sane default for your FSO install directory — what is that sane default, though?
The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell.

 

Offline ngld

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Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
Thanks for the feedback. I've updated the AUR package but I added qt5-webengine instead of qt5-webkit. Knossos supports both but I prefer webengine since the webkit implementation has been deprecated by Qt.
The "FSO is missing" error is caused by the fact that I haven't uploaded a Linux 64bit build for FSO, yet.

Some more writing in the installer to make the process self-documenting for a new user would be a good aim, I think.
Where should I put the additional help text?

Also I think the launcher should provide a sane default for your FSO install directory — what is that sane default, though?
I have no idea. I usually install it to ~/games/fs2.

 
Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
Games\Freespace 2 is a sane default (and IIRC it's the one that's offered by the windows CD). Alternatively: Knossos/FS2 so you have a clean folder to have those TCs in.

 

Offline AdmiralRalwood

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Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
There might be an interesting discussion to be had here about pushing some of the flags into FSO. e.g. some mods need to have 3dship-select on, others need to have it off, and some don't care.
No mod ever needs the 3D selection flags enabled; if the 2D art isn't present/defined, the 3D model is used automatically.

Alternatively: Knossos/FS2 so you have a clean folder to have those TCs in.
I don't particularly like that idea, myself; imagine if your current FS2 install was in wxLauncher/FS2 and you wanted to switch to Knossos.
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Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
Obviously it'll have to be platform-specific.

Some more writing in the installer to make the process self-documenting for a new user would be a good aim, I think.
Where should I put the additional help text?

Ugh **** I've forgotten the idea I had of how this should work. When you start the launcher fresh it should present you with a clear list of instructions:

Are you trying to install Freespace from scratch? Click here to set that up => instructions for obtaining and unpacking the GoG installer and, in the future, hopefully scan for existing retail/Steam installs too.

Are you trying to install a free, standalone total conversion (i.e. make it clear what a TC is)? Click here => separate options and brochures for Diaspora, WoD, TBP, etc.

Are you trying to use Knossos with an existing FSO install? Click here => whatever that option does.
The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell.

 

Offline Axem

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Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
I'm not fully caught up on the thread yet, but I do just want to bring up something about fsnebula.org. I do think it would be useful to have it look pretty, just so we could throw a weblink to a mod's page to people or in like in social media posts. So someone who might not have FS or Knossos installed might happen across a link, be impressed with the quality and start their way to the world of FreeSpace modding. With Steam, store pages render the same in your own browser or in steam itself (obviously because its all just html anyway). Just a thought anyway!

 
Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
Yeah, it could also replace all the disparate and horribly unmaintained mod homepages that sit around ****ting up Google results for FSO.
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Offline mjn.mixael

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Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
Posting this here so I don't forget the idea...

Knossos should be able to directly open the Debug Logs or the folder to the Debug Logs.. or for bonus points, automatically upload them to somewhere and offer players a link they can post to the forums.



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Offline ngld

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Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
Knossos can already open the debug log (it's kind of hidden at Settings > Game settings > Open fs2_debug.log). A button to open the config folder has been added thanks to a recent suggestion but it's not released yet.

I proposed a button which would upload the log to pastebin and put the URL in your clipboard but no one's responded to that idea.

Nebula is hosted on my own server, the source code is on GitHub but it's missing installation instructions.

@Phantom Hoover: I think that could work but I'm worried that you'll have to start scrolling if I put too much text on the welcome page.
@Axem: Making fsnebula.org pretty is certainly something I want to do but getting Knossos stable is a higher priority for me. The comparison with Steam has been mentioned and is something I wanted to do but I haven't been able to figure out a good page design.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2017, 06:47:32 pm by ngld »

 

Offline mjn.mixael

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Re: PUBLIC BETA: Knossos 0.4.1 (launcher / mod installer)
Upload log to pastebin in a must.
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