Because it needs at least some form of capital ship protection for itself maybe?
And two ULTRA-AAAs would mean that just about half of every Strike Craft present in a mission is guarenteed to be killed by it unless it's the first thing that gets destroyed.
I mean seriously is there any reason the Aeolus should still have these given its role as an anti-fighter warship? A pair of ULTRA's in their place would make them even more effective with their role.And why not replace all cruiser anti-capital beams with AAAF beams? They're all inherently anti-fighter warships, because if they were anticapital warships, then there would be no reason to build anything larger than a cruiser.
Given how powerful meson reactors are, ULTRA AAAF should be standard of all post-Capella capital ships already.The problem is, that wouldn't make for interesting nor fun gameplay since Ultra AAAF beams are so powerful and I think have longer range. They're also bigger, too, so they have more room to be inaccurate.
AAAf beams (not you, TerSlashBlueAAA) must be special, huh. Since meson ships can use them as well but fusion ships can't use blue beams.
Given how powerful meson reactors are, ULTRA AAAF should be standard of all post-Capella capital ships already.
AAAf beams (not you, TerSlashBlueAAA) must be special, huh. Since meson ships can use them as well but fusion ships can't use blue beams.
With all the new ships the GTVA already has and that mini-cruiser/gunboat (whatever it's called) comming up in WiH2 I doubt modifying the few Aeolus in service in Sol is a high priority to the GTVA, especially since they already do so well in their intended role.I believe it's called the Cretheus...and yeah, the Aeolus does pretty well in it's intended role. So well they can't use Standard Flak at all...which is quite pretty.
With all the new ships the GTVA already has and that mini-cruiser/gunboat (whatever it's called) comming up in WiH2 I doubt modifying the few Aeolus in service in Sol is a high priority to the GTVA, especially since they already do so well in their intended role.
It is in limited production. So while it's not being phased out, there are comparetively few of them in service in total and judging from what we saw in WiH, they didn't bring all that many with them into Sol (or cruisers in general for that matter).With all the new ships the GTVA already has and that mini-cruiser/gunboat (whatever it's called) comming up in WiH2 I doubt modifying the few Aeolus in service in Sol is a high priority to the GTVA, especially since they already do so well in their intended role.
The Aeolus is still being produced so it's not like it's being phased out or anything, especially since the Hyperion doesn't offer a lot in the way of performance increases.
Unless the Hyperion is in a mission where it's staged that every fighter attacking it is lodging Itano Circus down its throat I've actually seen it handle itself against fighters very well.
Those are the cruiser breakdowns for all of BP so far on the Tev side. The number of Aeolus cruisers we see in WiH alone is nearly 25% of all Aeolus cruisers produced before the Second Shivan Incursion. There may also be more we don't know about, since we have no confirmation on any ships in the 16th Battlegroup
Five Aeolus.Five ships that might have been constructed as far back as 20 years ago and seven ships that are brand new for sure.... I don't really see anything to contradict my point of view.
Three Leviathan.
Seven Hyperion.
Those are the cruiser breakdowns for all of BP so far on the Tev side. The number of Aeolus cruisers we see in WiH alone is nearly 25% of all Aeolus cruisers produced before the Second Shivan Incursion. There may also be more we don't know about, since we have no confirmation on any ships in the 16th Battlegroup.
Because it needs at least some form of capital ship protection for itself maybe?
And two ULTRA-AAAs would mean that just about half of every Strike Craft present in a mission is guarenteed to be killed by it unless it's the first thing that gets destroyed.
It's flak cannons do more damage per minute than its SGreens do.
Mjolnirs are pretty close to MAC sattelites in their role, only that in Halo they didn't have jumpnodes as bottlenecks, so they placed them in orbit of their planets instead.They look (http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww286/TSADestiny/MassdrivenMjolnirs.jpg) very pretty. (http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww286/TSADestiny/ShootingatDante.jpg)
I think I'm going to put a few Mjolnirs with mass drivers into FRED and see how that looks?
Mjolnirs are pretty close to MAC sattelites in their role, only that in Halo they didn't have jumpnodes as bottlenecks, so they placed them in orbit of their planets instead.
I think I'm going to put a few Mjolnirs with mass drivers into FRED and see how that looks.
On a related note: Is it possible to allow Mjolnirs to turn on the spot in order to track targets, instead of firing straight ahead (or replacing the beam)?
The Tech Room says three launchers and two beam weapons, possibly the second for housing an AAA beam, but since it wasn't made as described nobody can say.
If anyone knows I-War then they know how much of a mess it would be if Gunstars were added. :P
Mjolnirs are actually cruisers. If you set the rotation time to something less they should be able to turn.
Sounds good in theory, but doesn't work on Mjolnirs. Their gun points "up" not "forwards" and thus that command makes sure the Mjolnir is unable to attack that oject it's supposed to face.Mjolnirs are actually cruisers. If you set the rotation time to something less they should be able to turn.
set-object-facing-object
Sounds good in theory, but doesn't work on Mjolnirs. Their gun points "up" not "forwards" and thus that command makes sure the Mjolnir is unable to attack that oject it's supposed to face.Mjolnirs are actually cruisers. If you set the rotation time to something less they should be able to turn.
set-object-facing-object
Sounds good in theory, but doesn't work on Mjolnirs. Their gun points "up" not "forwards" and thus that command makes sure the Mjolnir is unable to attack that oject it's supposed to face.Mjolnirs are actually cruisers. If you set the rotation time to something less they should be able to turn.
set-object-facing-object
BP Mjolnirs have this fixed, so it works fine.
Or will make, in this case. I just tried it out and both the Mjolnir and Mjolnir#home behave the same way in the currently released version, so that fix must be in an internal version at the moment.
A forward-facing Mjolnir: http://www.mediafire.com/?xk19816sgl49ede
Forward facing Mjolnirs break retail missions. Hence they are stupid. (Well, at the very least it will totally obliterate the claim that you can play every retail mission properly with BP selected as a mod :P)
Forward facing Mjolnirs break retail missions. Hence they are stupid. (Well, at the very least it will totally obliterate the claim that you can play every retail mission properly with BP selected as a mod :P)Wrong. You just have to have them named differently from the retail Mjolnir. Problem solved.
two models complete with .pof filesNo there aren't. They're only different table entries. It's still redundant, though, especially since Mjolnir#home isn't even used AFAIK.
Home = where all the Mjolnirs live :yes:You like to see Mjolnirs naked?
When you do that they usually lash out at you with a green-colored beam that mauls your sensor subsystem.Home = where all the Mjolnirs live :yes:You like to see Mjolnirs naked?
When you do that they usually lash out at you with a green-colored beam that mauls your sensor subsystem.Home = where all the Mjolnirs live :yes:You like to see Mjolnirs naked?
getting back on topic... they could just buff the sgreen's a lttle.
SC Lilith *tremble*Eh,what about the little rakshasa beam inferno?
The GTVA, or at least the Tevs, just don't have an advanced enough beam tech to mount meaningful beam weaponry on cruisers. Shivans, on the other hand...
The GTVA, or at least the Tevs, just don't have an advanced enough beam tech to mount meaningful beam weaponry on cruisers. Shivans, on the other hand...
The second most powerful beam in vanilla FS2 is a terran one that's (barely) small enough to be mounted on a cruiser. The GTVA just chooses not to, for some undiscernable reason.
Might he be talking about the MjolnirBeam?The GTVA, or at least the Tevs, just don't have an advanced enough beam tech to mount meaningful beam weaponry on cruisers. Shivans, on the other hand...
The second most powerful beam in vanilla FS2 is a terran one that's (barely) small enough to be mounted on a cruiser. The GTVA just chooses not to, for some undiscernable reason.
wat
Yep, the fixed Mjolnirbeam does 2350 sustained DPS when recharge time is factored in, nearly double the LRBGreen's 1194 (but still well behind the BFRed's 8085).
Slap some engines, crew compartments, and a few defensive turrets on a Mjolnir, and you have something about the size of an Aeolus. :p
I mean there has to be a reason besides hurr durr command is dumb that they didn't fit them on more ships.
Yep, the fixed Mjolnirbeam does 2350 sustained DPS when recharge time is factored in, nearly double the LRBGreen's 1194 (but still well behind the BFRed's 8085).
Slap some engines, crew compartments, and a few defensive turrets on a Mjolnir, and you have something about the size of an Aeolus. :p
It'd more likely come out the size of a corvette with the hitpoints of a freighter.
While saying it would be cruiser-sized may have been going too far, it seems highly unlikely that a mjolnirbeam would take up enough space on a corvette to compromise structural integrity.
Hell, the Chimera's model strongly suggests that its main guns run at least half the length of the ship, making each of them take up more space than a mjolnirbeam.
Assuming, of course, that radiation and stability weren't the issues.
True. Although even if the reason were hurr durr command is dumb, it would be far from the dumbest thing command has done.
Command is rarely if ever dumb.This is my point, in-universe Command has probably thought of all the simple solutions but decided against using them for one reason or another. They're not idiots.
While saying it would be cruiser-sized may have been going too far, it seems highly unlikely that a mjolnirbeam would take up enough space on a corvette to compromise structural integrity.
Have you seen how many hit points a Mjolnir has? I'll stay here while you go look it up.
Now you're seriously suggesting that stringing that thing together with armor, propulsion, reactors, heat sinks, radiation cladding, crew spaces, more armor, armor (remember, the base Mjolnir is fragile as hell) is going to end up the size of a cruiser?
People who think Command is dumb need to pay more attention and go play Windmills. Command is rarely if ever dumb.
I already conceded that I was probably wrong about cruiser-sized mounting. However, mounting a mjolnir in something corvette-sized isn't going to magically drop the corvette's hitpoints down to freighter levels.
Throwing a Hecate in front of a Sathanas to "distract" it, and then blowing off in rapid succession everyone who points out what a stupid idea it is, seems to point to a fairly large cognitive problem.
I already conceded that I was probably wrong about cruiser-sized mounting. However, mounting a mjolnir in something corvette-sized isn't going to magically drop the corvette's hitpoints down to freighter levels.
Ever designed a 'Mech in Battletech? Want to fit an oversized gun and make it work in the corvette frame, you're going to have to make sacrifices. Either you cut armor or you cut endurance. Something's got to give - either you end up with a fragile corvette or a slow, unsustainable corvette.
QuoteThrowing a Hecate in front of a Sathanas to "distract" it, and then blowing off in rapid succession everyone who points out what a stupid idea it is, seems to point to a fairly large cognitive problem.
Given the information available and the tradeoffs there, I would make that decision in a heartbeat.
Yes--if you fit an oversize gun onto it. Comparing the Mjolnir and Deimos models, the Mjolnir isn't all that oversized. The assumption of radiation and explodiness problems make for compelling arguments against doing it.
They had scans of the Sathanas's weaponry. They'd seen it chew through allied warships already. There was ample evidence to suggest that the Phoenicia wouldn't survive a single volley, let alone actually make any contribution to the fight.
Yes--if you fit an oversize gun onto it. Comparing the Mjolnir and Deimos models, the Mjolnir isn't all that oversized. The assumption of radiation and explodiness problems make for compelling arguments against doing it.
The Mjolnir is huge compared to a TerSlash emitter. Its size is a compelling argument. (I should know; BP has internal fluff about warship design and component size, so I pretty much get to dictate the rules here. ;))
QuoteThey had scans of the Sathanas's weaponry. They'd seen it chew through allied warships already. There was ample evidence to suggest that the Phoenicia wouldn't survive a single volley, let alone actually make any contribution to the fight.
I'd still do it in a heartbeat. Total victory over the immediate Shivan threat on one hand, the loss of the GTVA's biggest warship and probably their core systems on the other? Anything to slow it down.
That's easy to say in hindsight, but coming up to the decision, I'd take the chance. It's only a few thousand people and one destroyer.
You keep invoking these radiation/explodiness problems, but there are far more parsimonious explanations I've already presented right here - "The Mjolnir as we saw it had one purpose: to sit outside a node and fire its beams frantically in a very narrow engagement window, probably blowing all its reaction mass, wasting its own power systems, and irradiating itself in the process. That's just not a formula for success on a warship. (Warships also need subspace drives - forgot about that.)"
And, while I understand the vast differences in what's at stake between that situation and what I'm about to mention, "only a few thousand people and one destroyer" is on the surface a pretty hilarious line coming from one of the designers of a campaign in which a war has gone on for a year and a half without a single destroyer loss, because both sides are so careful. ;)
I have no idea what point you're trying to make any more about the Mjolnir.
QuoteAnd, while I understand the vast differences in what's at stake between that situation and what I'm about to mention, "only a few thousand people and one destroyer" is on the surface a pretty hilarious line coming from one of the designers of a campaign in which a war has gone on for a year and a half without a single destroyer loss, because both sides are so careful. ;)
It would be a pretty hilarious line except for, you know, the vast differences in what's at stake between the situation and what you mentioned. When the GTVA had every reason to believe the future of their species depended on getting 4 beam cannons taken out in a very narrow window of time, well, that crew knew what they signed up for.
And in fact there's a passage in War in Heaven that talks about how much more willing the GTVA is to spend lives to get the job done. It's not a matter of being right or wrong, just that they're far more pragmatic.
The GTVA, or at least the Tevs, just don't have an advanced enough beam tech to mount meaningful beam weaponry on cruisers. Shivans, on the other hand...
The GTVA, or at least the Tevs, just don't have an advanced enough beam tech to mount meaningful beam weaponry on cruisers. Shivans, on the other hand...
Hence why they should be replaced with ULTRAs. :P
So useless SGreens it is. :P
So useless SGreens it is. :P
The Aeolus as a package is a really effective ship in its niche. Ships need interesting weaknesses to make for interesting missions - otherwise we'd all be driving Ares with the maneuverability of a Pegasus.
Wasn't the ULTRA only ingame, because otherwise the corvette in "A Game of TAG" wouldn't stand a chance?It was also used on the Colossus in High Noon, I believe.
So what?
Uhhh, if they are replacing the SGreens with AAAf's, those AAA-beams are badly placed. And it doesn't make any sense to replace because the they can only fire in their directions, unlike the usual turreted ones.
I've never seen an Aeolus firing the SGreens backwards, downwards, port or starboard. They are firing to the direction the Aeolus is facing.Uhhh, if they are replacing the SGreens with AAAf's, those AAA-beams are badly placed. And it doesn't make any sense to replace because the they can only fire in their directions, unlike the usual turreted ones.
I thought those turrets had at least decent fields of fire, am I wrong? (i could be wrong)
I've never seen an Aeolus firing the SGreens backwards, downwards, port or starboard. They are firing to the direction the Aeolus is facing.Uhhh, if they are replacing the SGreens with AAAf's, those AAA-beams are badly placed. And it doesn't make any sense to replace because the they can only fire in their directions, unlike the usual turreted ones.
I thought those turrets had at least decent fields of fire, am I wrong? (i could be wrong)
I'm pretty sure having seen SGreens fire quite upwards in Post Meridian, thanks to me having extensively playtested the coop version.Yes, quite upwards, but that's the dead end.
I'm sure you would want dual SGreens if you chance upon a Sanctus than two AAAfs, or like that mission where the Akula and Ranvir got blown up.
Why not replacing all Terran Turret's on the Aeolus-cruisers and the Deimos corvettes with STerPulses?
Because of imbalancing?Why not replacing all Terran Turret's on the Aeolus-cruisers and the Deimos corvettes with STerPulses?
Why not replace all TerSlash with BGreens?
Why not replacing all Terran Turret's on the Aeolus-cruisers and the Deimos corvettes with STerPulses?
Why not replace all TerSlash with BGreens?
Because of imbalancing?Why not replacing all Terran Turret's on the Aeolus-cruisers and the Deimos corvettes with STerPulses?
Why not replace all TerSlash with BGreens?
I think you're underestimating just how much the SGreen sucks. It doesn't even do twice the sustained damage of the AAAf, and every capital ship that isn't a Fenris has enough hitpoints that the relatively high volley damage isn't worth much. The Aeolus is an anti-fighter platform with some pathetic anti-cap beams tacked on as an afterthought,Every Cruiser is akin to an anti-fighter platform with crap beams tacked on unless you're Shivan, then it's a 'meh' Corvette killer with crap anti-fighter coverage or a wtfhax Destroyer killer with the same crap anti-fighter coverage.
Deimos-corvettes with BGreens would make Blade Itself really difficult....Because of imbalancing?Why not replacing all Terran Turret's on the Aeolus-cruisers and the Deimos corvettes with STerPulses?
Why not replace all TerSlash with BGreens?
:nod:
Every Cruiser is akin to an anti-fighter platform with crap beams tacked on unless you're Shivan, then it's a 'meh' Corvette killer with crap anti-fighter coverage or a wtfhax Destroyer killer with the same crap anti-fighter coverage.That. And retail vasudan cruiser don't even have a single anti-cap beam.
I do not get why you like using anti-fighter beams instead of an anti-ship beam against a ship. Dual SGreens have a range of 4k and can deal out 5776 damage plus potentially killing a turret/subsystem before entering range to bathe them in flak fire. Depending on the circumstances the dual SGreens might be able to fire again before the target approaches 1.5k and eventually close enough for bath time. From what I see the BP GTVA doctrine operates on combined arms. Pair up with a Deimos, let the Deimos do the hull slagging while you provide fire support with SGreens and anti-air with your flaks unless you want to risk getting friendly fire by the Deimos.I'm sure you would want dual SGreens if you chance upon a Sanctus than two AAAfs, or like that mission where the Akula and Ranvir got blown up.
I think you're underestimating just how much the SGreen sucks. It doesn't even do twice the sustained damage of the AAAf, and every capital ship that isn't a Fenris has enough hitpoints that the relatively high volley damage isn't worth much. The Aeolus is an anti-fighter platform with some pathetic anti-cap beams tacked on as an afterthought, and when it does kill a warship, it does it with flak. The Aeolus is amazing in its primary role. If you want a cruiser that can (kind of) take care of itself in all situations, the Hyperion is your best bet.
From what I see the BP GTVA doctrine operates on combined arms.
If you want a cruiser that can (kind of) take care of itself in all situations, the Hyperion is your best bet.Not really. The SBlues have a five second faster charge, which is still 40 seconds between firing, and hardly if any damage boost compared to the sgreen.
If you want a cruiser that can (kind of) take care of itself in all situations, the Hyperion is your best bet.Not really. The SBlues have a five second faster charge, which is still 40 seconds between firing, and hardly if any damage boost compared to the sgreen.
If you want a cruiser that can (kind of) take care of itself in all situations, the Hyperion is your best bet.Not really. The SBlues have a five second faster charge, which is still 40 seconds between firing, and hardly if any damage boost compared to the sgreen.
SBlues have almost double the sustained DPS which is a reasonably substantial improvement over the SGreen.
If you want a cruiser that can (kind of) take care of itself in all situations, the Hyperion is your best bet.Not really. The SBlues have a five second faster charge, which is still 40 seconds between firing, and hardly if any damage boost compared to the sgreen.
SBlues have almost double the sustained DPS which is a reasonably substantial improvement over the SGreen.
Plus a substantial range improvement.
My point is that, with or without SGreens, the most important thing for a lone Aeolus to have if it runs into a hostile warship is its subspace drive.
My point is that, with or without SGreens, the most important thing for a lone Aeolus to have if it runs into a hostile warship is its subspace drive.
Implying that it isn't already.
Note to BP devs: Consider replacing blob turrets on Hyperion with terran version of VEF.What is VEF?
Screw Aeolus. I'd be more concerned with performance of the Hyperion, the supposedly next-gen cruiser which honestly doesn't have that big of an advantage over Aeolus.
Note to BP devs: Consider replacing blob turrets on Hyperion with terran version of VEF.
Vasudan Energy Flak maybeNote to BP devs: Consider replacing blob turrets on Hyperion with terran version of VEF.What is VEF?
Has someone actually tested what would happen, if a Narayana actually fires only its missiles at an Aeolus with ULTRAs?Completely nullified the Narayana's missiles, and held out decently against TWO Narayanas.
I just read up on the weapons in the tech room again and found a good reason not to use the ultra AAA on the Aeolus.I wonder why BP canon does it that way because there's something called sensor and weapons subsystems...
The tech describtion states that the additional firepower and range of it come by building in a little reactor into the weapon. Sounds good, but it comes with a rather massive downside. To fit that reactor in, you have to take out any and all targeting systems and completely slave the weapon into some external targeting system like the TAGs... or I suppose you could let a gunner aim it manually, but then it would need to become much more inaccurate than it is now.
I wonder why BP canon does it that way because there's something called sensor and weapons subsystems...
Strange, one Narayana against one Aeolus with FOUR Ultras...and the Aeolus was simply wasted...What are you doing with the Aeolus? My Aeolus had only it's SGreens replaced with Ultras and completely blew the Narayana's missile screen off the face of Neptune, yet yours with four Ultras was blown up...?
the Aeolus was going straight towards her broadsideWell there's your problem.