[kode]

Originally posted by CP5670


Exactly. Even if you limit this to the people alone, there are much larger numbers of sick/poor/homeless than trained astronauts and there is less chance that they could become something which is high in demand, so they are worth less; it is as simple as that.

as is your opinion to me. and no, I wouldn't lift a finger to defend that right for you.

[CP5670]

Ah, and all opinions are of "equal value," eh? This is getting better and better...

fr3d0m 0f 5p34ch!!!11

[kode]

Originally posted by CP5670
Ah, and all opinions are of "equal value," eh? This is getting better and better...

yes. all opinions are worthless to me.

[CP5670]

I take it you changed your mind since your last couple of posts then? (unless you consider your own opinion worthless, of course)

[Zeronet]

Originally posted by Turnsky
i think NASA's been working on new shuttle designs since challenger but so far, haven't found anything that surpassed the versatility of the current design plus they can't reach escape velocity

Its called money, NASA dont have enough money to make the next generation shuttlecraft, there are tons of designs etc etc, possible stuff, but they dont have the funds. 1 in 4 Discovery programs used to have pictures of the new shuttle that'll never appear due to budget constraints.

Its possible this disaster could of been human error and that there is nothing actually wrong with the shuttles. Re-entry is extremely dangerous.

[karajorma]

Originally posted by kode


well well.... freedom of speech, baby.

You don`t have that here. Freedom of speech means you can set up your own board and have people go there.
 It doesn`t mean you can come onto this board and talk trash. HLP isn`t a free board in that respect. You talk about what the mods want you to talk about or you get censored or booted. Don`t like it. Set up your own board.

 Instead of complaining about american imperialism why don't you just show some ****ing sensitivity. I know that those peoples lives weren`t any more valuable than 7 starving kids in africa or any other 7 people but they were still people.

If someone sees fit to say they are sorrowful at their loss have some ****ing respect.

This isn`t a topic about 9/11. If you want to talk about that you can go elsewhere.

[kode]

Originally posted by CP5670
I take it you changed your mind since your last couple of posts then? (unless you consider your own opinion worthless, of course)

no. my opinions are also worthless. but you don't think your's are. just everyone disagreeing with you.

[StratComm]

Originally posted by kode


then exactly what are we discussing? lemme see... oh, that's right. the shuttle thingy. or was it anti-americanism? or was it perhaps why I should shut my big, dumb, foreign, anti-american, liberal, belligerant (aggressive) mouth? right. I'll be a good euro-trash and shut my mouth now, and you'll be the ignorant american who gives a **** about 7 dead persons in an accident, but not as much about the sick, poor, and homeless.

bring it on. oh, wait... that's "let's roll", isn't it?
*wuvs generalisations*

I rest my case.  I'm not making any references to nationality or political leanings in telling you to shut up, it's just that I, like a number of people around here, am getting tired of seeing you shoot your mouth off.  And until you have met me and talked with me at greater length about my beliefs and convictions, calling me "the ignorant American" doesn't bother me in the least.  Rather, it only serves to further the conviction that you are arguing just for the sake of argument and getting people all riled up.

[CP5670]

no. my opinions are also worthless. but you don't think your's are. just everyone disagreeing with you.

But that would create a contradiction, because if your opinions are worthless, then your opinion that your opinions are worthless is also worthless, so it has worth, which means it is does not have worth, and so on.

I try to judge them on the rationality of the opinions themselves independently of where they came from. I do think that some "freedom of speech" is necessary for today's societies to function, whatever the actual opinions are, but that might change in the future.

[kode]

Originally posted by karajorma


You don`t have that here. Freedom of speech means you can set up your own board and have people go there.
 It doesn`t mean you can come onto this board and talk trash. HLP isn`t a free board in that respect. You talk about what the mods want you to talk about or you get censored or booted. Don`t like it. Set up your own board.

 Instead of complaining about american imperialism why don't you just show some ****ing sensitivity. I know that those peoples lives weren`t any more valuable than 7 starving kids in africa or any other 7 people but they were still people.

If someone sees fit to say they are sorrowful at their loss have some ****ing respect.

This isn`t a topic about 9/11. If you want to talk about that you can go elsewhere.

I am aware of that. If they don't like what I'm saying, I WANT them to ban me for it. but the MEMBER that told me that I wasn't allowed to express my opinions in this topic was not a MOD or an ADMIN.

you have obviously missed to point I was expressing. I think that I in my first post here stated that I do not dislike americans, america, or anything or anyone else in the world. I even said that I cared for them, but in proportion to everyone else dying. I think that message at least got true, however it seemed to have glitched a little.

I mentioned 11/9 once. I haven't mentioned mentioned imperialism as much. Only that I think that your country is raping the rest of the world just because they can. the schoolyard bully of earth, if you will. I can not say that I am okay with that. you however, might be.

[StratComm]

Originally posted by CP5670


The idea could be extended to that though, right? After all, escaping the Earth's atmosphere is where almost all of the fuel is used up. I suppose there is the issue of global radiation, but there could still be a couple of launches carried out in remote places like antarctica without too much danger.

Not for a vessel as often-used as the shuttle, and in reality, not at all.  In antartica you have the issue of thermal pollution as well, plus the fact that the radiation released even while in orbit would still find it's way back to earth.  You have to get out or earth's gravity far enough for the radioactive particles to at least take a while to get back to earth before nuclear propulsion could be considered safe.  And I don't know how well that drive would function with the fluid motion of the air around the explosions was factored in; it sort of depends on the blast coming from directly behind the ship and wind on the ship or the bomb could easily mess up that alignment.

[kode]

Originally posted by StratComm


I rest my case.  I'm not making any references to nationality or political leanings in telling you to shut up, it's just that I, like a number of people around here, am getting tired of seeing you shoot your mouth off.  And until you have met me and talked with me at greater length about my beliefs and convictions, calling me "the ignorant American" doesn't bother me in the least.  Rather, it only serves to further the conviction that you are arguing just for the sake of argument and getting people all riled up.

If I was, it'd be working in your case, wouldn't it?

[karajorma]

Originally posted by StratComm


Not for a vessel as often-used as the shuttle, and in reality, not at all.  In antartica you have the issue of thermal pollution as well, plus the fact that the radiation released even while in orbit would still find it's way back to earth.  You have to get out or earth's gravity far enough for the radioactive particles to at least take a while to get back to earth before nuclear propulsion could be considered safe.  And I don't know how well that drive would function with the fluid motion of the air around the explosions was factored in; it sort of depends on the blast coming from directly behind the ship and wind on the ship or the bomb could easily mess up that alignment.

Actually you`re both missing the biggest point. The shuttle blew not on launch but on re-entry.

While orion might be great for launching things (if you don`t care about pollution) how would you land it?

[CP5670]

I mentioned 11/9 once. I haven't mentioned mentioned imperialism as much. Only that I think that your country is raping the rest of the world just because they can. the schoolyard bully of earth, if you will. I can not say that I am okay with that. you however, might be.

Refer to an earlier response of mine there. Of course we are "raping the world," since as I said, we are the big bad terrorists, but nobody can do anything about it at the moment. Sorry, that's the way the world works.

Not for a vessel as often-used as the shuttle, and in reality, not at all. In antartica you have the issue of thermal pollution as well, plus the fact that the radiation released even while in orbit would still find it's way back to earth. You have to get out or earth's gravity far enough for the radioactive particles to at least take a while to get back to earth before nuclear propulsion could be considered safe. And I don't know how well that drive would function with the fluid motion of the air around the explosions was factored in; it sort of depends on the blast coming from directly behind the ship and wind on the ship or the bomb could easily mess up that alignment.

I suppose you are right there, but that would really seem to undermine the effectiveness of the thing, since the amount of fuel used while in space is very small compared to that used up when leaving the atmosphere.

Actually you`re both missing the biggest point. The shuttle blew not on launch but on re-entry.

While orion might be great for launching things (if you don`t care about pollution) how would you land it?

It still had a little bit of extra fuel in it though, and even that is enough to cause a massive explosion if ignited incorrectly.

The old parachute ocean landing system, maybe? Although even the shuttle apparently does not use any fuel for landing, but rather utilizies the Earth's gravity to get it going.

[karajorma]

Originally posted by kode
I mentioned 11/9 once. I haven't mentioned mentioned imperialism as much. Only that I think that your country is raping the rest of the world just because they can. the schoolyard bully of earth, if you will. I can not say that I am okay with that. you however, might be.

Kode. You really should pay more attention.

[an0n]

an0n's summary of his opinions

I care about the crew of the Columbia about ten times as much as I care about the people who died in the twin towers. The astronauts aboard the Columbia were clever, fit, productive members of society and a great asset to the gene pool. The people in the twin towers however were just average Joes and the effect of their deaths is little more than a loss of man-power.

I have no sympathy or feelings of remorse towards the accident, or the families of those involved, the simple fact is that some really clever people died and that is all I give a **** about. That and the fact that without space-travel mankind will undoubtedly be ****ed and this incident is a blow to future expansion and domination of the human race.

The lives of the Astronauts aboard the Columbia ARE worth more than 7 tramps, or 7 etheopians because they are smarter, stronger, faster and more of an asset to the human race.

For example, I would gladly kill several hundred people to save the life of someone like Stephen Hawking.

But really, I still don't give a ****.

[beatspete]

If we had a topic about every little tragedy where somebody died then the forum would never get anywhere.  I dont like it when people just post to "show respect" cause it doesnt get us anywhere. Seven people died, its a trajedy for the people who knew them, but its not for anyone else.  What the tragedy is, and a minor one at that, is the set back to the american space program, and the impact on space exploration as a civilization. People are being over-sensitive and its becoming meaningless.
To those who lost family members and friends, yes its a tragedy, but for random people looking for some random deaths to hop on the "oh its so bad" bandwagon they might as well not even care. It doesnt get anyone anywhere.
A friend of mine died from an asthma attack 2 months ago on our school prom night, she was just 17,  thats a tragedy to me. I didnt mention it on HLP cause then it looses meaning.  If people are saying how sorry they feel for someone thats died but they didnt even know existed, then what is the meaning?  Its a false display of emotion, sure they may feel bad about it but the only reason they have to feel bad is because someone died. Thats it.

Today the space shuttle broke up on re-entry, 7 astonauts were killed.
Thats what happened.  The loss to the families is 7 people, but to everyone else its part of the space program, see the differences.

[kode]

Originally posted by karajorma


Kode. You really should pay more attention.

humour me.

[ShadowWolf_IH]

I am aware of that. If they don't like what I'm saying, I WANT them to ban me for it. but the MEMBER that told me that I wasn't allowed to express my opinions in this topic was not a MOD or an ADMIN.

and you want them to ban you for what reason?  So that you may appear to be a martyr?  Or so that you have ammunition to show that everyone is out to get you.  

As far as you stating that you do not dislike America or Americans.....

I'll be a good euro-trash and shut my mouth now, and you'll be the ignorant american

and so for this and many other annoyances, you have earned the distinction of being only the third person i have ever ignored in ANY forum.  Not for being anti american, not for being agressive, not even for being an infantile egomaniac.  It's just because in some things you spend time, in others you waste time, and you my friend, are a waste of time, at least in my opinion.....oh and i am allowed to express one......... freedom of speech and all.

Welcome to ignore.

[an0n]

There's an ignore function?

*abuses the ignore function*