[Sandwich]

Originally posted by Bobboau
I _can_ _not_ _beleve_ you are still holding on to that "you're killing people" line

But America is. Of course, there's no need to mention the famous "Can't-make-an-omelete-without-breaking-a-few-eggs" quip, nor is there need to point out how in the original Gulf War, Saddam actually caused more Jews to come into the world than he took out, by virtue of the birth rate skyrocketing 9 months afterwards as well as the lowering of road accidents due to lowered traffic, thus reducing the number of deaths...

But no one said "Oh, please Mr Saddam, keep on tossing Scuds at us - it's saving lives!"

Same here. Yes, people are being killed. War is a pain. War hurts people. So do vaccinations, operations, and life's lessons. But no one is screaming "Stop the heart-transplants - people are dying!!"

[Bobboau]

today is the day that will go down in history as the day Iraq tasted freedom,
thouse of you who wish to refuse to beleve what we truely have done and the joy that this day has brought to tens of millions of people can take there place in the flat earth society.

if you need me I will be with the hundreds of millions of people around the world reveling in the victory of freedom over tyrany and the liberation of a people.

[Pez]

Originally posted by Bobboau
today is the day that will go down in history as the day Iraq tasted freedom,
thouse of you who wish to refuse to beleve what we truely have done and the joy that this day has brought to tens of millions of people can take there place in the flat earth society.

if you need me I will be with the hundreds of millions of people around the world reveling in the victory of freedom over tyrany and the liberation of a people.

Great! Next targets: China, Iran, Belarus, Pakistan, Libya, Algeria, Congo, Nigeria, Somalia, Rwanda and all the other countries that are undemocratic and/or that have a dictator. Lots of people to liberate so get going!

[CP5670]

The anti-US guys are now angry that we have prevailed; they were expecting it all along, but as the saying goes, nothing succeeds like success itself. Anyway, now I can laugh at all the people who were saying that Baghdad will become a very tough military target with urban guerilla fighting and civilian rebellions earlier in this thread. (although as I said before, they knew what would happen all along, but did not want to show it)

well, i think iraq's infromation minister has become the unofficial 'joke' of this war.... he kinda reminds me of officer barbrady from south park

He said just yesterday that "Iraq is safe, secure and great." I guess he himself didn't realize how much meaning those words had...

[Pez]

Originally posted by CP5670


He said just yesterday that "Iraq is safe, secure and great." I guess he himself didn't realize how much meaning those words had...

This guy is hilarius, he should get his own talkshow.

[01010]

I don't think it even matters that they haven't found any WMD's to me at least. Seeing the reaction from the people of Basra and Baghdad makes me think that this should have happened twelve years ago. Yes people died, civillians at that, but I think that unless America really balls it up now, the ends justify the means.

Rumours flying about now that the Russian Embassy is hiding Saddam....

[vyper]

Originally posted by Pez


Great! Next targets: China, Iran, Belarus, Pakistan, Libya, Algeria, Congo, Nigeria, Somalia, Rwanda and all the other countries that are undemocratic and/or that have a dictator. Lots of people to liberate so get going!

And this is a problem why?  

[Tiara]

I am glad they finished the job this time. But if they establish a US government for longer then 3-4 months they'll have new problems. Especially since even Blair is against long-term US goverment in Iraq. You have to remember that there will always be a part of the Iraqi population that likes the afct that the US got rid of Saddam but don't want a US gov.

Though I might not like the US way they got to this war, they way they handled it was quite good

[Pez]

Originally posted by vyper


And this is a problem why?  

My previous post (which you qouted) was a sarcastic response to Bobboau post about that the liberation of the Iraqi people when the agenda for US in this war was not to liberate the Iraqi people (US wanted to get rid of Saddam and the alleged WMD). The US has never cared about if a country is undemocratic or if it run by a dictator (just look at the recent war in Afghanistan where the US supported Pakistan or in the 80's when the US gave weapons to Saddam).

And no it's not a problem but you gotta realize why states to these things (read CP5670 posts and you'll understand). The remark was ment to be sarcastic cause I don't see the US liberating a poor country that aren't a threat to the US. So don't you ever say it's about liberation or freedom. It's about a goverment that protects their own citizens and about money. It's that easy.

[EDIT]This goes for most states so it's not some anti-US bull****. The only thing is when people (most of the times americans) say that US or some other country does something because of freedom and liberation of the people when it's obviously that's not the case.[/EDIT]

[Kamikaze]

To people claiming that there's great rejoice, you only have half a picture. You think the US media'll cover any unfriendly response to occupation? nope... http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/allnews/page.cfm?objectid=12825322&method=full&siteid=50143  at the very least it's a mixed response, you can't decide what the majority think with biased media coverage (btw, I'm not saying the majority is against. just that what the media claims is not necessarily truth like you think)

Oh and the US may have supposedly freed people (merely a by product, not at all a goal of war) but was the excuse provided a good one? nope.... http://english.aljazeera.net/topics/article.asp?cu_no=1&item_no=2154&version=1&template_id=277&parent_id=258
All the US officials provided in multiple articles I've read was (a few days ago) we'll go find weapons after the way (i.e. they don't have any, but we'll make sure to plant some later )


http://asia.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=topNews&storyID=2535904 <-- CP was right after all

[Stryke 9]

Funny how the hawks seem to imagine mass looting is a good thing. "Hey, anarchy and chaos are healthy! They're just getting it out of their systems! Good for them!"

Not that I'm particularly against anarchy, mind, but the looting-and-lynching variety generally isn't so great, particularly if you have any plans on "rebuilding" the place afterward.





****, look at Watts. It's been forty ****ing years, inside the very same country that is now so big on "rebuilding", and the place still is a burned-out hole in half the parts.

[Bobboau]

the people looting the government buildings shows that they arn't afraid of themany more and they are riseing up and fighting Sadam, not nesasaraly that them breaking and stealing **** is an inherantly good thing but looting and linching is the sort of thing that happens in revolutions, wich this truely now has become.

[Stryke 9]

No, not really. It's the sort of thing that happens in sieges. It's called mass chaos. And seeing as they're looting damn near everything, I wouldn't consider it "symbolic" so much as "indiscriminate". They ain't particularly scared of the government right now, but they're not likely to be any more scared of, say, US troops.

It's called a riot, man, and just in case you've never been in one, it's ****ing insane. It's like everyone's got rabies, and it doesn't always stop.

[Falcon X]

Stryke:  If this goes succesfully and we do what we said we were going to do and the people support us...  I want you to eat crow and take a picture of it... and right now I'd start finding some crow.

[Stryke 9]

And if this doesn't, I want you to go take a vacation in Basra.


Or, for that matter, anywhere in the general area of the Middle East. **** gonna get pretty hot.

[Deepblue]

Stryke, you are so CYNICAL!
And I agree with Falcon X.

[Deepblue]

Why can't you accept what is happening. The people realize that were serious this time and are rising up against Saddams regime. Besides where do you get your information. I don't even think you are very well informed. You seem to be more like someone who just mindlessly forms oppinions based on hate or political stance.

[Stryke 9]

'Course I am. And I'm almost always right, too.

Fact, it's usually when I'm not cynical that I'm wrong. Anyway, there's one ****load more risk in losing the war than gain in winning it- and I'm talking about the extended war, too. Any half-decent Iraqi commander would have seen that the initial conflict wasn't a winnable one and would have reorganized for an extended guerrilla warfare, to basically blow up the US's victory in its face. And what with the anarchy, the lack of real combat, and the sudden unexplained dissapearance of an awful lot of Special Republican Guard units, I'd say that the writing's on the wall, and it's not a happy message. You'd better believe that Baghdad is child's play to what happens when all those guys start spreadin' the hate.

Though I am going to have so much fun watching as Bush's "reconstruction" is forced to take place in the form of armed US thugs forcing the people to do everything, simply because they won't cooperate except at gunpoint.

But maybe I'm wrong, unlikely as it is. Still, it's infinitely better to suspect the likely worst case than blithely assume that everything is gonna be fine and not wake up to what's going on until more buildings start exploding and the heads of Turkey, Saudia Arabia and whatever poor **** we put as puppet governor of Iraq are dancing a foot above the ground from a streetlight.

As to your second post: Oh yes, stop the hate, spread the love, looting and pillaging shops is now a legitimate form of revolution when armed soldiers from a foreign country are marching down your street. And it's called every major newspaper and radio source. You might have heard of them.

Sure, they realize it's serious this time. I think they figured that out when American planes started bombing the **** out of their cities, Einstein. It's kinda a little late to be "rising up against the regime", though, eh? Seeing as its effectively gone and all. The Baghdadders aren't revolting, they're just rioting- the Kurds (remember them? The guys we told to revolt, left to die, and then tried to sell out to Turkey?) revolted. The Shias (the guys we keep oppressin'? Might ring a bell?) revolted. Hell, those twits in Washington revolted, such as it is (though what kinda revolution ends with you in some cushy pad in DC while your comrades are blown up in trenches is a mystery to me).

[Falcon X]

But will you eat crow?

[Bobboau]

every major newspaper, radio, TV show, internet article I ve seen sais they are primarily looting government buildings though I havn't been able to read/watch/hear any news for the last 10 hours so I may be out of date

and yes will you?