[Stealth]

Originally posted by diamondgeezer
You realise Iraq had the world record for unexplained disappearences under Saddam? The people he locked in cupboards for ten years would probably disagree with you, Stealth.

note what i said:

but from what i've heard ... most people were happy with Saddam's rule

i didn't say "all"... it's impossible for a government on this earth to be perfect.  i said "MOST people"

now back to what you said:
true, but you're going by what the media's said, right?  i can tell.  look what the people are going through now... look what everyone's going through now, not just a few people "locked in cupboards for ten years".  sure there were conspiracies and corrupt government dealings with the people, but that happens in every country, even (believe it or not) in the US *gasps*

i dunno, see, it would make sense that the US goes into Iraq after Saddam, and at the same time helping the people, but many people (ok, MOST people) don't want the US to establish a government there, they were (are) for the most part happy with what they had.

Well sure I've seen a fair share of good news from tv and such, but it's not like our news coverage is the complete happy candy land people make it out to be either, at least where I live.

you live in America, therefore it is.  unless you watch news programs from other countries via satellite etc.

But I still get the feeling like both sides of the story are being told. (Yes, one side is going to be biased, that's a given.) but like I said, it still ain't the Fairy-Candy American Land everyone makes it out to be.

you're right, but you see you don't see the other side.  you may see part of the other side, but my point is you don't see the WHOLE other side, unless you live in another country, then you will, because the media tells everything, what the government wants the public to see, and what they don't... because in America the government controls the media.

Don't think i'm saying i don't like or support the United States... ****, if i hated it so much i wouldn't be living here  i'm just saying what the media portrays isn't the whole story

[Tiara]

I was writing a reply to this... but I decided against it. Political discussions in this forum are useless.

[Stealth]

very good point Tiara, but realize we're not arguing, we're discussing.  everyone knows (apparently everyone but KT) that American media is biased, because the government controls it.  DG is asking my opinion on something, which i gave him.  no arguing.

[Knight Templar]

Especially with Stealth's new "You don't know what it's like, you live in America.... even though I do too..." stance..

I was never said we do see the other sides view on things. As I said, that would make for bad business for the media. Why would Americans want to see themselves as bad guys? Iraq's media is just as biased as ours dude, just in the opposite direction...

Where have you been during the war?

and on a side note: Yes I know I live in America. And I wasn't disputing the biased-ness of our media, I was disputing wether or not everything our media shows about Iraqi civilians is happy-go-lucky.

Originally posted by Stealth
very good point Tiara, but realize we're not arguing, we're discussing.  everyone knows (apparently everyone but KT) that American media is biased, because the government controls it.  DG is asking my opinion on something, which i gave him.  no arguing.
 

Originally posted by Tiara
I was writing a reply to this... but I decided against it. Political discussions in this forum are useless.

[Stealth]

Originally posted by Knight Templar
Especially with Stealth's new "You don't know what it's like, you live in America.... even though I do too..." stance..


1) it's never been new, i've always said this
2) i've lived in other countries, you never have, so you wouldn't know

I was never said we do see the other sides view on things. As I said, that would make for bad business for the media. Why would Americans want to see themselves as bad guys? Iraq's media is just as biased as ours dude, just in the opposite direction...


why wouldn't they?

Where have you been during the war?
America mostly.  Italy for a bit, then in England for a little too

and on a side note: Yes I know I live in America. And I wasn't disputing the biased-ness of our media, I was disputing wether or not everything our media shows about Iraqi civilians is happy-go-lucky.

so you admit that American media is biased?  uhhh ok.

the media does show Iraqi civilians as happy, American-loving people, since America "helped" them set up a new government.  my whole point is they're not as "happy" as the media makes out.  trust me, my brother was stationed there till the end of May, a handful of civilians are happy with what America's done, but the majority are NOT.  that's the point i'm making

 

[Stealth]

Originally posted by Knight Templar

heeey you can read!  good job!

I wasn't saying she said "arguments".  i know she said "discussions", i'm just saying there's nothing wrong in my opinion with discussing something as opposed to arguing it

[Stryke 9]

However, the media is fickle- now they're starting to notice that the whole WMD thing was a blatant lie. Now they're starting to pay attention to the fact that Halliburton is getting more attention than the Iraqi populace.

See, in the US and industrialized West, the news media more or less tells the people what the people want to hear- no more. In places like Iraq, it generally tells the people what the government wants to hear. There are concessions towards the government here (no particularly pointed questions during White House press conferences, because the newspaper/show wants to get invited to the next one), and the result is often similar, but ours has the advantage of being a pain in the ass for the government as well as doubly one for those who resist the government.

[Stealth]

I don't know about Iraqi media, since i have never watched/listened to/read it so i'll take your advice on it

[Stryke 9]

You saw the clips of the Information Minister, yes? I don't have sattelite, but I've seen some of the propoganda, and it's not like it's anything special. Half the friggin' world has it, and the other half did until relatively recently.

[Knight Templar]

Why wouldn't they? So you mean, you'd pay to watch a tv show or subscribe to a news paper that shows the America that you live in and love so dearly portrayed as Murderers and butchers? You'd want to see a media broadcast that names your brother as an evil murderer? I doubt most Americans would...

the media does show Iraqi civilians as happy, American-loving people, since America "helped" them set up a new government. my whole point is they're not as "happy" as the media makes out. trust me, my brother was stationed there till the end of May, a handful of civilians are happy with what America's done, but the majority are NOT. that's the point i'm making

Well then why are you being picky with me? I know our media is biased. Like I've said, duh. What my point is is that from my news coverage (perhaps yours is different in Republican Texas?) is that everything I see on the Iraqi Civilian faces ain't all smiles and lollypops. If you're here to say that I'm wrong, that's not what I see, then there isn't much I can do about that then, is there?

And how do you know so much about me and where I have or haven't lived in my life? Makes me wonder..

[Stryke 9]

What are you watching? Something scary?

[Stealth]

OK well right now i'm going to work, and after work i'm not going to check replies in this thread, because i usually don't take part in political discussions like this (hence why i only started on page 7, and only to post a comic strip).  let me just say what i've been trying to say, the reasons i've replied in this thread so far.

1)  to post the comic strip, thought you guys might get a kick out of it

2)  defending my belief against KT's that the media in America is biased, whereas the rest of the world's (most of it anyway) is only somewhat, if any.  in many other countries the media doens't give a damn what the government or people want them to show, whereas in America they do

3)  Saddam did terrible things, yes, and America is justified in going after him perhaps, but look at Iraq now! Would you say they were better with a leader that tortured and killed its subjects secretely, but still ran the government; or at the moment, with a government that the majority of Iraqi civilians want to reject, but can't because of America's troops.  they're in a bad situation either way.

of course there were probably reasons for what America's done and/or is doing that we don't know about.

Well then why are you being picky with me? I know our media is biased. Like I've said, duh.

i refuse to argue with you.  see the above picture i posted

What my point is is that from my news coverage (perhaps yours is different in Republican Texas?)
uhhh.  ok.  
...
 is that everything I see on the Iraqi Civilian faces ain't all smiles and lollypops.
but how often do you see that since America's set up the Iraqi government?  since then all you see (mostly) is smiling Iraqis, happy about what America has done.  it's purely your opinion, but i'm just saying that it's a biased view.. don't believe what you watch on American television or read on newspapers.


If you're here to say that I'm wrong, that's not what I see, then there isn't much I can do about that then, is there?
uhhh.  

now go away.  you can post what you want in here kid, but i'm not going to listen or argue with you.

[CP5670]

ah, another thread resurrection; this is the third one in the last few days.

I wasn't saying she said "arguments". i know she said "discussions", i'm just saying there's nothing wrong in my opinion with discussing something as opposed to arguing it

Like there is a difference.

why wouldn't they?

I don't even know what to say to this one...

the media does show Iraqi civilians as happy, American-loving people, since America "helped" them set up a new government. my whole point is they're not as "happy" as the media makes out. trust me, my brother was stationed there till the end of May, a handful of civilians are happy with what America's done, but the majority are NOT. that's the point i'm making

I see about an equal amount of pro-US and anti-US articles in the WP these days and they don't appear to be heavily biased at first glance. What particular media service are you referring to? (I mean, of course they are biased, but that's because they are written by people; it is the same anywhere in the world)

But as I said before in this thread, it hardly matters whether or not the common people there are happy or not; their happiness or lack thereof would not alone provide or invalidate any justification for the war.

[Knight Templar]

 I like how the one topic Stealth chooses to take against me (and only me) is the one that I agree with him on

[Stealth]

yeah, well you have your opinions, i've got mine.

i'm done in this thread anyway.  i come in to post a comic strip, and a 15 year old kid jumps out trying to argue a few minutes later. *shrugs*

 I like how the one topic Stealth chooses to take against me (and only me) is the one that I agree with him on

nope, you said that no one has a non biased view.  that's true, because it's actually impossible to have a non biased view, but that wasn't the point i was trying to make.  i was saying that America has a more biased view (the media anyway) than probably any country in the world.

like i said,
peace out

[Stryke 9]

You think the media in the US serves the government? So... all that stuff about the whole media-generated Clinton "scandal" never happened? The Watergate story never broke? Nobody ever pointed out, before the war, that Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11?

The media in an open market tells people what they want to hear. Just because a large number of those people happen to be screaming, goose-stepping nationalists doesn't mean that the newspapers are entirely a government mouthpiece. Moreover, before the war in the few European newspapers (who I imagine you must be talking about, seeing as the likes of China and Nigeria don't have the best journalistic track record) I saw pretty much solely papers that reflected the government line; The Economist couldn't stop editorializing about how awful Saddam was or how buddy-buddy France and Germany were in trying to take over the world... Now they jump on Blair like pirahnas on a one-legged cow but I think it's safe to chalk that up to the fact that some estimated 80% of the country can't stand him...

[Stealth]

Originally posted by Stryke 9
You think the media in the US serves the government? So... all that stuff about the whole media-generated Clinton "scandal" never happened? The Watergate story never broke? Nobody ever pointed out, before the war, that Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11?

The media in an open market tells people what they want to hear. Just because a large number of those people happen to be screaming, goose-stepping nationalists doesn't mean that the newspapers are entirely a government mouthpiece. Moreover, before the war in the few European newspapers (who I imagine you must be talking about, seeing as the likes of China and Nigeria don't have the best journalistic track record) I saw pretty much solely papers that reflected the government line; The Economist couldn't stop editorializing about how awful Saddam was or how buddy-buddy France and Germany were in trying to take over the world... Now they jump on Blair like pirahnas on a one-legged cow but I think it's safe to chalk that up to the fact that some estimated 80% of the country can't stand him...

what are you saying!?

i agreed with you!
i wasn't disputing what you said!

[CP5670]

okay, now you're confusing me...

[Stealth]

i'm still trying to find where i said (according to Stryke) that the media is being fed by the government

[Knight Templar]

Originally posted by Stealth



nope, you said that no one has a non biased view.  that's true, because it's actually impossible to have a non biased view, but that wasn't the point i was trying to make.  i was saying that America has a more biased view (the media anyway) than probably any country in the world.

Well duh.. why would anyone else be more biased to an American view than America?