[Bobboau]

can we please get rid of the registry storage of settings, it is giveing me the most bleeding ass problems, if you don't know specificly look in the specular thread, 90% of all crashing bugs have been causes by the registry not being set (corectly) wich in 90% of the time is caused by the launcher not working (BTW it refuses to detect 1024X768 under any cercomstance), so can we have a FS.cfg or something for holding settings or something. I'm thinking someone could just change the calls in osregistry from Reg*KeyEx to one of the text file parseing codes, now it would be a lot more work than that (or I would have done it alredy) but the registry has just been an insain pain in the ass as of late, and I've never liked useing it anyway

[redsniper]

I agree with Bob, this registry crap has been giving Unknown Target and I all kinds of problems with the specular build.  I think if we want to keep adding features to FSO while maintaning stability this needs to be changed.

[FreeTerran]

[Solatar]

I don't know what this means, but if it helps people out, do it.

[LAW ENFORCER]

It means... errr... you have to give all your money and cows to us!;)



 
Yup I agree with Super Bob

[Flipside]

Get's my vote, the registry has so far required me to reinstall the whole of FS2 twice to reset it

Flipside

[J.F.K.]

Originally posted by LAW ENFORCER

Yup I agree with Super Bob

That should be his new title

[Grey Wolf]

I was thinking an .ini file, similar to the games by Bioware. Of course, the only difference is the extension

[Bobboau]

NO, IT MUST BE CFG!!!


I prefer the look of the icon

[Flipside]

LOL I don't care, as long as it ISN'T .reg

Flipside

[Unknown Target]

Oh, yes, PLEASE do this!
*offers first-born child to the Super-Bob*

[RandomTiger]

If you are having problems with launching you should contact me about it.

As far as getting registry out stuff goes, I dont have the time to re-write the launcher to do that. I dont see how it would magically fix everything anyway.

Perhaps you could form your actual problems into bug reports then they could be sorted out. Every part of this project has suffered from bugs, this is just another part of the process.

I think it would be quite sad to throw away the launcher but do what you want.

If there are launcher problems its because most people cant be arsed to join a tester list list to ensure that code gets a good test. Yet as soon as something interesting comes along they expect it to work properly.

Its also worth pointing out that DX8 was merged back into the main branch (so you have to use it) this early against my advise.

Do you know the numbers off possible PC configurations, verious settings options, freespace options, configurations, mod complications.

Games companys either employ multiple professional testers or are provided them by their publishing companys. Things are tested hundreds of times. There are companys out there that offer compatiblity testing on hundreds of different machines with different setups.

We dont have these resources. Im sorry if people are having problems but this thread has really annoyed me.

IT DOESNT MATTER WHERE THE OPTIONS ARE STORED, IF THEY ARE WRONG, THEY ARE WRONG!
IF YOU DONT TEST IT, DO NOT EXPECT IT TO WORK!

[LAW ENFORCER]

if they are wrong - you need a reliably and easy way to fix it:doubt:

[IceFire]

Originally posted by RandomTiger
If you are having problems with launching you should contact me about it.

As far as getting registry out stuff goes, I dont have the time to re-write the launcher to do that. I dont see how it would magically fix everything anyway.

Perhaps you could form your actual problems into bug reports then they could be sorted out. Every part of this project has suffered from bugs, this is just another part of the process.

I think it would be quite sad to throw away the launcher but do what you want.

If there are launcher problems its because most people cant be arsed to join a tester list list to ensure that code gets a good test. Yet as soon as something interesting comes along they expect it to work properly.

Its also worth pointing out that DX8 was merged back into the main branch (so you have to use it) this early against my advise.

Do you know the numbers off possible PC configurations, verious settings options, freespace options, configurations, mod complications.

Games companys either employ multiple professional testers or are provided them by their publishing companys. Things are tested hundreds of times. There are companys out there that offer compatiblity testing on hundreds of different machines with different setups.

We dont have these resources. Im sorry if people are having problems but this thread has really annoyed me.

IT DOESNT MATTER WHERE THE OPTIONS ARE STORED, IF THEY ARE WRONG, THEY ARE WRONG!
IF YOU DONT TEST IT, DO NOT EXPECT IT TO WORK!

All good points too.

I understand where of people are coming from in this thread.  From Bobboau to RandomTiger.  I think the issue of this thread however is the fact that we've had a number of changes to the way we deal with the FS2 registry settings and of people, who are not professional testers, who probably don't have a remote idea of what goes into beta testing and Q&A process that gets retail games onto the shelves, are having trouble getting various updates to work (cut of the bleeding edge kinds of updates too - the stability that we've been able to maintain over the last few releases has been impressive to say the least - kudos to all involved).

RT...I don't think anyone is suggesting throw away the Launcher.  Perhaps the end result of what people are asking for would equal that but I doubt thats what anyone meant.

I do have one suggestion for the launcher which is working very well indeed.  Perhaps we need a "rebuild registry" button or option to run?  Maybe thats overly complex and uneeded but most people don't want to mess with the registry and its probably recommended that they don't and largely thats what it took for me to upgrade from an older version of SCP EXE's and launcher to the latest that Bobboau and the rest of you have put out.

Remember...everything that we do with SCP is a test...an open beta.   of people complain that games don't have open beta tests but as you can all see...there's usually a good reason.

Keep up the positive work!

[Flipside]

We aren't saying there are problems with your Launcher Random, we are saying there are problems with the registry and the way it stores (or doesn't store) information.
I think the Launcher is fine, it is Windows that is giving us all nightmares.
Bobboau is not suggesting we get rid of the Launcher, merely change where it writes it's information, that way the data won't keep resetting itself etc. As I said, I don't think this is a Launcher error, I think it is a Windows thing.
It is true that sometimes, even when you use regedit to change something, it doesn't actually change, you go back into the registry and it is still saying what it did before you edited it, this problem is not limited to FS2 or your Launcher.
We aren't slagging you or your coding off, we are trying to find a way of reducing your work, not increasing it, after all, if people keep losing their joysticks etc because of Windows and it's idiosyncratic nature, surely it would make your life easier to be able to be sent a .cfg file to see if it is a code problem or just us poor mortals not having a clue what we are doing?
I don't doubt that some of these errors come from our own ignorance of how FS2_Open and the registry work, possibly doing this would allow us to decide which are which?

Flipside.

Edit : Personally, I've had very few problems with the Launcher recently, I've got it so it works, and now I leave the registry settings well alone

[Inquisitor]

Garbage in, garbage out. I never actually have problems, but I am never screwing around with my fs2 machines settings.

I think the problems will be just as fun in a cfg file.

That being said, a couple of points:

1) RT, we merged the code, it is a done deal. Now we just have to get the niggling details sorted. You need to calm yourself.

2) Manipulating the registry is not fool proof and often breaks more han it solves, config files can be easier to "debug" than making a user/developer edit reg keys. There was an old support axiom we had: Never make the user manipulate the registry,  It will cause problems. I think we're seeing it here, people using it in a combination of development and actual "use" and that leads to system instability. Lots can go wrong while you are in regedit.

3) If the data in/out is working, the registry is a GREAT place to store information, especially when that information is shared between multiple programs. IF the data going in and out is good.

5) If the *nix build were ever to happen, we'd need to have a alternate to the registry. Config files are an old stand by for this. But, since we've embraced windows, this is unlikely to be a reason to change things at least in the near term.

4) NOBODY suggested getting rid of the launcher. That would be inane.

Config files are easier to deal with, but the registry is a good long term/final solution. Bob: do you have an alternative?

[RandomTiger]

There are problems with my launcher, but I need comunity help to fix them (ie report and test) because they dont occur on my machine because thats where it was made and tested.

A lot of problems seem to be with initialisation, mode selection etc. Changing to a non registry solution will not solve this, most of the mode selection code is in the fs2_open exe itself and fiddling with the values where ever they are just wont cut it.

As far as all the other ones, how about people actually properly document all the problems, let me have a look at them and ask them some questions. If more than a third are really problems with the fact we are using the registry I'll look into alternitive solutions while Im eating my hat.

The launcher is really no more than a glorified registry setting program, so it would almost be throwing it away. The only other bit of complexity is the DX8 mode selection which just hasnt received the testing it needs to be foolproof. I only have two machines, GF4 and TNT2, its amazing it works on an ATI at all.

Send me your problems, please!

[Taristin]

Ok, want an annoying bug I keep getting?

I run the FS original launcher, and get the vidcard settings, then load the FSOpen launcher and have the 4 settings my Vid card supports. Great. I play the game and have fun.

Then I close the launcher, and go to play it some time later. Open th elauncher, and Direct 3d 5 is the default option. No big problem, but when I choose Direct 3d 8, I get about 24 different resolutions and bitrate setting to sort through. Quite annoying.

[RandomTiger]

Originally posted by Raa Tor'h
Ok, want an annoying bug I keep getting?

I run the FS original launcher, and get the vidcard settings, then load the FSOpen launcher and have the 4 settings my Vid card supports. Great. I play the game and have fun.

Then I close the launcher, and go to play it some time later. Open th elauncher, and Direct 3d 5 is the default option. No big problem, but when I choose Direct 3d 8, I get about 24 different resolutions and bitrate setting to sort through. Quite annoying.

OK, good start, please e-mail me the problem ([email protected]) with details of your OS, gfxcard and the version number of the launcher and details of the fs2_open exe you are using.

[Taristin]

As soon as I get my PC up and running again.

I broke it.