[Tiara]

From CNN.com.

EU welcomes 10 new members

Prodi: Largest-ever expansion heals Cold War divisions
Saturday, May 1, 2004 Posted: 12:39 AM EDT (0439 GMT)


Fireworks and searchlights light up Malta's harbor Friday night.

BRUSSELS, Belgium (CNN) -- Capitals across Europe celebrated Friday night and into Saturday morning as the European Union marked the largest expansion in its history.

Ten new members, eight of them formerly under communist rule, joined the EU at midnight CET (2200 GMT), but celebrations began earlier in countries farther east. The accession unites Eastern and Western Europe, patching rifts left by World War II and the Cold War.

The new member states are Cyprus, the Czech Republic, Estonia, Hungary, Latvia, Lithuania, Malta, Poland, Slovakia and Slovenia. The additions bring the EU's population to 450 million, making it the world's largest trading bloc.

At the Italian-Slovenian border, European Commission President Romano Prodi presided over a reunification ceremony in the Italian town of Gorizia and the Slovenian town of Nova Goricia, divided by an iron fence since the end of World War II.

Prodi said, in Italian, "Today's enlargement is the fifth and the largest in the history of the union, and I am convinced that it will not be the last. Other European countries and nations will decide to join our undertaking until the whole continent is unified in peace and democracy," Reuters reported.

In Poland, the largest new EU member, a chorus sang in a Warsaw square and a video screen showed scenes of Poland's climb from post-World War II destruction through communist domination to democratic rule.

President Aleksander Kwasniewski told the crowd, "Ladies and gentlemen, we are making history ... Today our dream is becoming reality. Poland is returning to its European family," Reuters reported.

At the German-Polish border, the hoisting of the EU flag was accompanied by fireworks and the "Ode to Joy" from Beethoven's Ninth Symphony.

A two-hour concert at the Berliner Konzerthaus and an open-air stage in Warsaw symbolically linked the two cities, and featured performers from the newest EU states.

In Malta, part of "Ca Ira (It Will be Fine)," a new opera by former Pink Floyd singer Roger Waters, was accompanied by lasers, floodlights and fireworks. Giant images were projected on the city's historic fortress walls, and boats with sails representing EU members' flags floated below.

The Berlin, Warsaw and Malta concerts were part of the celebration arranged by the EU, and were carried on live television in 30 countries.

"We are not expecting charity," one Lithuanian reveler speaking English told Reuters. "We are hard-working people, and we will work, we will catch up with the rest of Europe, and quite soon we will do it."

In Cyprus, Greek Cypriots celebrated the event, but Reuters reported that reaction was muted in the island's north, where the breakaway Turkish cypriot state was left behind after a reunification vote failed last week.

On Saturday, the leaders of all 25 EU countries will gather for a largely ceremonial summit in Dublin. The Republic of Ireland holds the six-month rotating EU presidency.

On the eve of the celebrations, Prodi declared that the divisions of the Cold War had been removed once and for all.

"We are bringing into the EU family 10 new member states and 75 million new EU citizens," the UK Press Association quoted Prodi as saying.

"Five decades after our great project of European integration began, we are celebrating the fact that Europeans are no longer kept apart by artificial ideological barriers.

"We share the same destiny and we are stronger when we act together. I urge all Europeans to join in celebrations of this astonishing achievement."

The commission is spending about 6 million euros ($7 million) on the enlargement celebrations.

The EU began with six member states, becoming nine in 1973 with the arrival of the UK, Ireland and Denmark.



Hungarian confectioner Lajos Kopcsik decorates a giant EU cake next to sugar euro coin for weekend festivities.


Greece followed in 1981, and Portugal and Spain in 1986. Austria, Sweden and Finland made in 15 in 1995.

"May 1 will be a milestone in the history of Europe," EU Enlargement Commissioner Guenter Verheugen said.

"It is Europe's response to the end of the Cold War and an opportunity to heal the wounds of the past, wounds of war and dictatorship," Reuters quoted Verheugen as saying in Warsaw.

The enlargement crowns efforts by Poland and Germany to overcome the past. They are the largest old and new members of the EU, with about 80 million and 40 million citizens, respectively.

Just thought i'd mention this

[Assassin]

[Xelion]

Preconceptions aside, I think this is a good sign for Europe as a whole . Hopefully some good will come out of these relations in the next decade or so as well .

[Janos]

No it isn't.

Now we can't decide anything over even the simplest things. We need more federalism (which I hope the new countries will head for) and less Franco-German-Italo nationalist stupidity.

Soon we can't even decide whether sea water is salty or not, because as Portugal declares sea water perfectly good, Lithuanians tell us that it has ATOMS and Sweden wants to negotiate. Italy declares that all sea water in the world belongs to it. France and Germany pull a stunt and announce that they will dry the seas once and for all. Estonia proceeds to ban Russian seawater. Finland tells that "while draining all the seas could have some influence for our international stance, we still should just stay aside and be quiet".

[vyper]

Crassly put arguments aside, this is not what I'd call a day to celebrate. Well it is if you're in those countries, but not if you're in the country that'll foot the bill for most of this - the UK.

Of course, that will mean a substantial tax hike because every penny UK tax payers put into Europe, Spain takes the exact same amount out.

I suddenly have the desire to vote conservative.

[Ghostavo]

Hopefully it will bring something good for Europe.

25 members... it has a nice "ring" to it doesn't it?

[Stunaep]

Yep, we're in the EU now.

Of course, you've already started harassing us, by signing trade treaties with Russia, which state that both sides must respect the human rights of minorities (again I state, a TRADE treaty with RUSSIA), and only thanks to the stern NO!'s of the baltic states, weren't we mentioned by name in the pact.

For those unaware (which probably would be the most), Russia has since the fall of the Soviet Union accused Estonia for requiring a language exam for those Russians without Estonian citizenship, who live here (because they were brought here by the soviets during the 50 years of occupation), should be given citizenship. This comes from a country, whose citizens prefer to live here without a citizenship, than there with one.

So now, this new treaty with the EU, even though it annuls the double-tolls with russia, that Russia forced on us after the break of the USSR, they still can harass us about not respecting the human rights of russian citizens living here (because the life in Russia sucks to much for them to actually go back).

Mostly, the new countries need a bit more backbone to stand up to all the standardised **** EU is forcing on us (such as not allowing to call milk with less than 3.5% fat in it 'milk'.)

Otherwise, it's great. I can now go to study in Sorbonne and pay a whooooolleeee lot less than I should have 3 years ago.

[Tiara]

Originally posted by Janos
No it isn't.

Yes it is. Maybe not in the short-term but most certainly in the long run. Thats the whole point of them joining. Sure, in the beginning they have very little to contribute but with the free trade within the EU it won't take very long before those countries start to contribute themselves. It's a trade-off. A good one from my perspective.

On their own they are crap (I apologize to anyone living there ). They have little to no outside help besides when it suits those who want to 'help'. Now they have a chance to thrive themselves.

Besides, if anything they serve as a nice shield and early warning system against any Communist invasions

[vyper]

[q]free trade within the EU[/q]

My dear Tiara, if all this was, was a matter of  trade then I'd be perfectly happy. Unfortunately we know what it's about - a unified Europe as one nation. Which, I should tell you, is not a popular idea here in Britland. Well, unless your name is Tony and you plan to be a key player in it.

[Tiara]

Originally posted by vyper
[q]free trade within the EU[/q]

My dear Tiara, if all this was, was a matter of  trade then I'd be perfectly happy. Unfortunately we know what it's about - a unified Europe as one nation. Which, I should tell you, is not a popular idea here in Britland. Well, unless your name is Tony and you plan to be a key player in it.

Well, why should I care what you Brits think? Really, after the past few years of arrogance towards the mainland it means exactly **** to us if you want to be excluded from the EU in its entirety for all we care.

Really, the EU isn't that old yet. It's bound to have serious flaws like any nation has the first few decades of it's existence. You can't expect an entire continent of different nations to magically conform to a single nation. It's not like we are a recently colonized continent like the US was.

[Janos]

Tiara and vyper: Free trade is one thing. Whether this makes EU strong and politically capable is another.

I am a federalist, and have now more problems than ever. How can we possibly elect a governing element that is democratic and pays attention to 25 different countries? Can the good of the union surpass good of a single country (which would almost inevitable happen to be someone minor one)? Actually, I would be all in for somekind of Scandinavian/Fennoscandian Union, and let's take Baltic states in it also.

edit:

Tiara sprouted this out
Well, why should I care what you Brits think? Really, after the past few years of arrogance towards the mainland it means exactly **** to us if you want to be excluded from the EU in its entirety for all we care.

Well, Britain is part of EU. If EU focuses on nitpicking and sassing each other over trivial things (maybe this isn't such, but whaever), a strong unified policy and harmony can never be found. You have actually stated why current EU is at this moment unable to operate. Why should France care what Estonians think? Well, maybe because they now share the same basics France works on!

[Tiara]

Originally posted by Janos
Tiara and vyper: Free trade is one thing. Whether this makes EU strong and politically capable is another.

Originally posted by Tiara
Really, the EU isn't that old yet. It's bound to have serious flaws like any nation has the first few decades of it's existence. You can't expect an entire continent of different nations to magically conform to a single nation. It's not like we are a recently colonized continent like the US was.

I am a federalist, and have now more problems than ever. How can we possibly elect a governing element that is democratic and pays attention to 25 different countries? Can the good of the union surpass good of a single country (which would almost inevitable happen to be someone minor one)? Actually, I would be all in for somekind of Scandinavian/Fennoscandian Union, and let's take Baltic states in it also.

That would so work against everything that would make Europe even a little bit powerfull It's all or nothing.

[Janos]

Originally posted by Tiara

 That would so work against everything that would make Europe even a little bit powerfull It's all or nothing.

what

I mean, what. Free trade is all and well, but steadily increasing the number of different countries in an union that should work even somehow can't but just backfire. The pre-enlargement status of the EU was already quite poor, as everyone just played the domestic issue card all the time (Italy shooting down WRITTEN PROMISES and so on). Even though I believe that this propably will benefit everyone economically, I think that politically this will further weaken the EU. Noticed the breakdown in inter-EU relations before the current Iraq quagmire? Imagine such things on larger scale. Ugh.

[vyper]

[q]Well, why should I care what you Brits think? Really, after the past few years of arrogance towards the mainland it means exactly **** to us if you want to be excluded from the EU in its entirety for all we care.[/q]

Because we do more trade with mainland Europe, than mainland Europe does with us.

As for our past few years of arrogance, I'd like you to explain what you are referring to? We're the ones having our fishing fleet raped for the sake of mainland Europe. We're the ones who's own government can be over-ruled by a mainland european court. We're the ones who have ended up with asylum seekers that france let through so they wouldn't have to deal with them.

I think we're the ones up **** creek to be honest. Britain will quite happily have nothing to do with your new "nation", because we cherish some ideals Europe doesn't. I'd start with freedom for one. (and this is absolutely NO reference to any allegiance to the US, the war on terror (!), the invasion of iraq, or another ****e that Europeans have a go at the Brits over)

[Tiara]

Originally posted by Janos


what

I mean, what. Free trade is all and well, but steadily increasing the number of different countries in an union that should work even somehow can't but just backfire. The pre-enlargement status of the EU was already quite poor, as everyone just played the domestic issue card all the time (Italy shooting down WRITTEN PROMISES and so on). Even though I believe that this propably will benefit everyone economically, I think that politically this will further weaken the EU. Noticed the breakdown in inter-EU relations before the current Iraq quagmire? Imagine such things on larger scale. Ugh.

I think you are looking at it a bit too... shallow.

And again; I say that the EU needs time to find its place, to grow. Nobody even gives it a chance. They EU acts on so many fronts you really can't expect them to be perfect in a matter of years. A few of these fronst are:

Agriculture
Budget
Competition
Consumers
Culture
Customs
Development
Economic and Monetary Affairs
Education, Training, Youth
Employment and Social Affairs
Energy
Enlargement
Enterprise
Environment
External Relations
External Trade
Fisheries
Food Safety
Foreign and Security Policy
Fraud
Humanitarian aid
Human rights
Information Society
Internal Market
Justice and Home Affairs
Public Health
Regional Policy
Research and Innovation
Taxation
Transport  

Now, if you have a plan to get all this correct within the next 20 years without stepping on too many toes tell me. Or if you have a good plan to 'unify' Europe within the next decade, TELL ME.

It isn't as easy as it sounds. You don't 'just form a world power'.

[vyper]

[q]You don't 'just form a world power'.[/q]

You aren't meant to be forming one in the first place you're supposed to be forming a market place.

[Tiara]

Originally posted by vyper
Because we do more trade with mainland Europe, than mainland Europe does with us.

So... you trade more with us then we with you... Ok, then we don't need you. Basically, the EU is a trade-bloc that can function perfectly on its own and even overpowers the US in trade power. We sure as hell don't 'need' Britland in this to sustain us.

As for our past few years of arrogance, I'd like you to explain what you are referring to? We're the ones having our fishing fleet raped for the sake of mainland Europe. We're the ones who's own government can be over-ruled by a mainland european court. We're the ones who have ended up with asylum seekers that france let through so they wouldn't have to deal with them.

Fishing fleets raped? Gov.. blablablabla? So, you should try to compete with us if you really don't like us. Ow, wait, you can't... you don't have the power to do so. Or join us if you want to have it too. Don't wanna be with us, tough f'ing luck. Thats life.

I think we're the ones up **** creek to be honest. Britain will quite happily have nothing to do with your new "nation", because we cherish some ideals Europe doesn't. I'd start with freedom for one. (and this is absolutely NO reference to any allegiance to the US, the war on terror (!), the invasion of iraq, or another ****e that Europeans have a go at the Brits over)

Ok, the mere mentioning that we don't value freedom is unsulting to the extreme and I won't dignify that with a response.

The fact that you don't like us is because you don't have the power to compete. The British 'world-power' is no longer a real 'world-power'.

It's ironic really. Because many say that Europe has no power. Yet thats the reason why many hate the EU... Go figure

[Tiara]

Originally posted by vyper
[q]You don't 'just form a world power'.[/q]

You aren't meant to be forming one in the first place you're supposed to be forming a market place.

You just misinterpeted my arguments. This is the START of a world power. You don't just start out with a world power you need a FOUNDATION. Which is exactly what we have. And even that foundation makes Britland look really really small.

That clear enough?

[Janos]

Hey, I just said I don't think all these problems could be solved even in smaller union, let alone this behemoth we now have. I would be in for smaller unions with localized goverment. If I go optimistic, I say that maybe easing on the national rights could help a lot (it's essentially against the mood of current EU and does not help it at all).

Also, happily bunking the stability pacts, GG Germany, has not increased my trust on EU. If we punish small countries for democratically electing maybe repulsive leader and let a certain large country slip on towards some kind of semi-fascist goverment, where PM also controls most of the mass media, we [EU are stepping on dangerous lines. Hypocricy disgusts me.

While I am more than happy to give EU a chance, I do not believe it will work as anything else than a trade zone much longer.

[vyper]

Tiara it's a cultural thing - Britain would rather **** itself in the wind than give up it's sovreignty to a foreign power. We value the sacrifice our grandfathers and such made during two world wars too much to just throw it away.

If you think, btw, that the EU will be a "superpower" capable of taking on America you're delusional. 40 years of establishing power bases in ways you and I cannot even comprehend (nor probably want to) gives the US a strategic economic advantage that the EU will never be able to compete with.

Britain might miss the short term gains, but we'll take the spoils when all the dust settles.