[Lynx]

Having played many space sims, I saw that almost every game portrays nebulas in a way I strongly dislike. In almost every game, the nebulas are glowing like fecking flashlights in space, it looks like the sky is on fire or something. No one even tried subtle backgrounds, only I-WAR 1&2, the original FS1(yeah, I like the FS1 nebulas more than the FS2 stock ones!) and WCP weren't as bad(Their nebulas were mostly too bright too, but at least the transitions are better, they fade into black at their edges, making them look as if they are a part of the background, rather than looking as if inserted to make the game look fancy to the standard customer with an IQ of 85).
However, in most other games(I dunno how it is in X2, haven't touched it) the backgrounds look stitched  together(Prime canditates are all of FS2 and many sytems in Freelancer) because the nebulas don't really have soft transitions, have different colors(some color varitaions are nice, but going overboard with it isn't), and thus making space seem smaller. Just play Freespace with nebulaes turned off - space seems more vast, bigger - like space should feel.

Here's a comparison pic: What do you like more, the smooth, subtle nebula in the left pic or the standard, spacesim flashlight nebula in pic2?



Discuss.

[Fineus]

Uh, it's just my opinion but I-War2s nebulas seem pretty bright a lot of the time.. Not bright on a par with FreeSpace2s but they're still not "dark".

Relating to your pic, while the brightness of the one on the left seems more reasonable - it doesn't look particularly gaseous.

Generally it seems that space sims don't tip their hats to "realism" in this line of things... and looking at a consistently black background can get very dull...

[Bobboau]

they both look good for diferent reasons, I'd like to see both used, bright high contrast images and large smooth space fillers that give a more all around you feel

[Stryke 9]

It's something to look at and something to orient the player. That's the whole point. When you're wheeling around to take a shot at that interceptor that just did a flyby on you, a 'subtle' nebula isn't even gonna get seen.

Sometimes they look better muted, but a lot of the time they're fine or better as these big splashes of color- the I-War 2 ones were downright lovely. They can get gaudy, but aesthetics is only half of their function. When you're in a big black vacuum and the only other things around are moving around and mostly trying to shoot at you, it's nice, even necessary to have a few points to navigate by.

[Lynx]

I don't say that nebulas should be removed - I just want that the sky doesn't look like it's constantly exploding.

One example I forgot to mention above is Starlancer - It did it almsot right...at least in most of the missions. The nebulas, while don't having good transitions, were subtle and dark and blended well into the background.

About the I-War nebulas. I never said the were less bright, but they had much better transitions into the blackness of space.

[Stryke 9]

They don't need to be removed to lose their purpose. It ever occur to you that there's a reason street signs aren't made with a camo pattern?

[Ransom]

Frankly I couldn't give a damn about realism. I care about what looks visually better. For me nebulas are there to make space more interesting, something other than black, boring emptiness. After all, its primary purpose is to be a background. Yes, I think the left pic looks better, but that's mostly because it's more detailed and more colourful compared to the blob on the right.

[WMCoolmon]

I agree, the left pic looks better.

But then, nebula missions would be a whole lot less interesting if they were portrayed realistically (I'm guessing)

[Lynx]

It's amazing how fast you people jump to conclusions.
I never said anything about removing nebulas alltoghether or 'realism'. Anyway whoever uses realism in context of FS is a moron anyway.

Back to the topic: I'm not really against glowing color blobs as nebulas per se, they can look good, but only if used right, which FS2(and sadly some Fanprojects, too) didn't. Many missions had the nebulas floating seperate in the background without any connection. Now it would have been much better already if they were connected by a darker nebula form between them, thus feathering the edges of the nebulas more and making them seem as part of a bigger nebula instead of every blob beeing a separate entity. However, the best way to use both nebula forms is to have a bright center of the nebula and the rest being darker, thus blending it better into the background(that's what I-War2 did, and it looked very good compared to other games)

[aldo_14]

I think it depends on the game and - more specifically - the situation the player is in.  i.e. both subtle & er, non subtle nebulae*can have different effects on the atmosphere conveyed to the player - i.e. a dark, subtle red nebula is good for menace, or a brighter orange or yellow nebula is a good backdrop for dramatic elements (i.e.  ships silhouetted against it).  

And obviously you mentioned a sense of claustraphobia you can induce - pretty useful is you want a mission like Into the Lions Den or Playing Judas to be more effective, and something difficult to achieve with 'normal' space.

So,er, either actually.  As the situation depends.

*nebulae!  Whee!

[castor]

Originally posted by Lynx
the smooth, subtle nebula in the left pic

..is much, much better, IMO.
The other one looks like its quite close to the viewer and doesn't provide the "depth" effect nearly as nice (it rather looks like space there has catched some freaky disease, hmm..).

[Nico]

That's one of the subjects that comes often in space sim arguments. For me, it depends where you are, and that's it ( In sol, there's no nebula visible with bare eyes, would be idiotic to have a marked one. If you're a couple clicks away from the horsehead nebula, I tell you it's gonna be large and bright ).

[Baron MacDoblin]

Starshatter.

[Kazan]

i want star variation in the damn background! the stars are too homogenious

[NeoHunter]

Frankly speaking, can you really see that many nebulas or frequently see them in every area of space?

I find that most of FreeSpace 2's missions have nebulas. Its like as if the entire GTVA is surrounded by nebulas!

[Kazan]

if you're looking into the plane of the galaxy - YES -

[ShadowWolf_IH]

i have to agree with Kazan.  The hallmark of something done right is the excruciating attention to every concievable detail.  Look at our own night sky......we have a ton of variants to the naked eye.  imagine those variants without atmospheric conditions.  Imagine how much more full the night sky would be.  And while i agree that the nebulas aren't exactly realistic, they do serve as a beacon to orient us.  I've used them more than once.  and now with the advent of sky boxes, we can do anything we want with a background.

But i do like the star variants idea, i think that would be a subtle detail that would do much for immersion of the player.

[NeoHunter]

Originally posted by Kazan
if you're looking into the plane of the galaxy - YES -

Well...

[Lynx]

In my comparison pic above, the first pic is indeed a bit too dark, I meant it more to be like that:

BTW it would look about like that when you look at the galactic plane.

[Kazan]

for games personally i prefer coolness and beauty over realism on the starfields