[Bobboau]

ok, I think I've figured out why our debates tend to devolve into meaninglessness, we don't have a structured set of rules, so as a test of this I'm makeing another religon thread and setting some rules.

all responces to this thread must be in the form of a 'yes', 'no', or another question. another question being the prefered responce.

so with that I will start things off with the seed question.
:

If there is a God, how can I know that it exsists?

[Rictor]

Oooh, I like this. Its like that one game in Who's Line is it Anyway where they have to speak only in questions

Fine, I'll pay along.

How can you know if God exists? Well, do you classify know as having scientific proof, or just a gut feeling?

[Knight Templar]

How do you not having scientific proof that God exists as your colon?

[icespeed]

hey wassup everyone?

isn't the point about God that if you have faith, you find proof, and if you don't have faith, there will never be enough proof?

[Knight Templar]

More or less. Although, I'd replace have with need.

[Kamikaze]

How can I or anyone else know anything about a supernatural being when we're all natural beings?

[icespeed]

good one, kami.

so KT, you mean 'anyone who needs faith will find proof, anyone who doesn't need faith will never find proof?' but that's obvious, it doesn't need stating.
besides which, who doesn't need faith?

[Bobboau]

why does anyone _need_ faith?

[Ace]

So it really comes down to:
Proof v.s. Faith

Sure you can *try* to toss in other junk like Descarte's little gamble thing, but in the end it's proof v.s. faith.

Next!

[icespeed]

nanana, it's proof+faith vs noproof+nofaith

[Ace]

Originally posted by icespeed
nanana, it's proof+faith vs noproof+nofaith

If you have proof, then present it.

[Bobboau]

(it seems hitting escape has the same effect as hitting the reset form button)

were any of the last three posts 'yes', 'no', or a question?

what would Mr. Trebek have to say about this?

can faith without reason lead to knowledge?

[Kamikaze]

Can't faith be used to value *anything* as knowledge if it were valid? What use is a definition of knowledge that makes knowledge totally arbitrary?

[icespeed]

Who's Mr. Trebek?

[Col. Fishguts]

Originally posted by Bobboau
...were any of the last three posts 'yes', 'no', or a question?

Well, your first question wasn't a 'yes' or 'no' question . But if you're question meant: "Do you think/believe there is a God ?" , I'd go for 'No', since I haven't seen anything that would make me belive otherwise. I'm not talking about scientific fact, I mean personal experience and stuff.....I can't think of one good reason why I should believe there is an omnipotent being, and I refuse to believe something just because a lot of people tell me to do so and because this particular belief is around for several thousands of years.

[aldo_14]

Originally posted by icespeed
Who's Mr. Trebek?

why should we care?

[Blaise Russel]

isn't the point about God that if you have faith, you find proof, and if you don't have faith, there will never be enough proof?

"If you presuppose the existence of God, you will find a way to justify it; and if you do not presuppose the existence of God, you will find no evidence for his being?"

Descarte's little gamble thing

Pascal's Wager, which assumes God is blind... not a particularly wise assumption, I feel.

why does anyone _need_ faith?

Because it is difficult to prove, inductively or deductively, a number of assumptions that we make in the going-about of our daily lives... assumptions like "we are real," "I am me," "this world is real," "everything including memories of past times weren't constructed five seconds ago," that sort of thing.

[Aspa]

Is it possible to have a poll for each post in a thread? Then we could have a 'yes-no' poll for each post that is a question, and moderate away everything else

[Setekh]

Originally posted by Kamikaze
How can I or anyone else know anything about a supernatural being when we're all natural beings?

Methinketh that the natural would never know the supernatural if the supernatural wanted to stay hidden. Following that idea, it would require supernatural relevation for the natural to ever know the supernatural.

Aspa, unfortunately that sort of thing isn't possible with the present system. One poll per thread.

[Ashrak]

there is no god .... theyr just super advanced aliens who we showed to that we were retarded enough not to bellive them instead we killed them .... so they left and maybe possibly will come back