[Janos]

NO FLAMING/TROLLING/SPAMMING HERE

This thread is for political discussion concerning the tsunami and aftermatch (thanks, Sandwich!). Don't be a jerk and be reasonanble.
All "US vs. UN, US suxx0r r0xx0r, ein Volk ja" etc. discussion goes here, with polite manners considered. Don't act as a jerk, give sources for your outrageous claims, be reasonable, don't troll, be prepared to actually give respectable sources for your claims, you know the drill. DO NOT TROLL-

Some articles about the political outcome about tsunami. I will not add any emphasis on the articles, so READ before you post, pissant!
http://news.ft.com/cms/s/3a3abc72-5ad1-11d9-aa6e-00000e2511c8.html
some info, whatever

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/12/31/us.aid/index.html
CNN is lieberal media ok

http://www.un.org/aboutun/chart.html
Read this before criticism against the IRC. Base your criticism on facts, not on stormfront.org talking points. This applies to democrats as well!

http://www.newshounds.us/2004/12/30/fox_news_misstates_un_skimpy_remark.php
LOL FAUXNEWS COM

OK let's see editorials and stuff. Recommended reading to EVERYONE. Stay neutral before comments; these sources might not be balanced and neutral, but use your reason before comments. Again, give neutral data if possible.
http://www.newkerala.com/news-daily/news/features.php?action=fullnews&id=53396 read this!
http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/181_1178376,001301540005.htm <- POP-UP ALERT
http://www.scoop.co.nz/mason/stories/PO0501/S00007.htm
http://www.alertnet.org/thefacts/reliefresources/110442677961.htm

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/12/31/us.aid/index.html
Something about the aid.

Now, read this again, ****wads.

This thread is meant for political discussion. Said topic includes all REASONABLE CRITICS <- read and comperehend -  with sources. Rumours and opinions are to be based on something, I don't want AMERIKKKA/LIEBERALS KKKLITON **** in this thread. This thread is approved by Sandwich, so normal HLP rules apply - I am not a mod! And overall:
 Please - don't be a jerk, make some basic research before your posts, act reasonable.

Personally I wish to be able to grab some analysis about Indian/Ceyloanian relations, possible trade outcomes and so on. Post all articles you come up with and add some commentary. Keep your quotes intelligent. Link to your posts. DO NOT QUOTE 30+ PAGE LONG ARTICLES UNLESS ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY!!!! Give a link and short pversight of important points if absolutely necessary. If a link requires registration, give us all required info.

Feel free to spam this thread with articles, but mention sources and, if you feel, possible referrals according neutrality/source of news/whatever. If commentary is needed, MENTION IT. DO NOT SPAM.

Go ahead and commit whatever you see fit. I included the topics mentioned above because I saw them to be fit to current conversation.

[spellcheck approved]

[Tiara]

But the move, which amounts to an effective block on funding for the United Nations, is a vindictive decision, designed to punish the world body and, by its exclusion, the EU, for their stance over Iraq. It will be both costly - just wait for the duplication and waste, especially when military forces get involved - and shortsighted.

I hope that the 'core group', led and initiated by the US, doesn't end up like the quote above.  If The US does start relief efforts without coordinating with the UN, the results could be quite repurcussive.

While I doubt that this will actually happen, i am puzzled as to why the US left out the UN - and thus the EU - in this effort. A combined effort, including the UN, would be far more effective rather then splitting everything up into two camps.

I seriously hope that they keep their word in 'supporting the UN instead of duplicating the efforts'.

[Corsair]

For the record, the US has upped the amount of aid it's going to send over to something like $350 million, just so we all know that America isn't being quite so stingy.

[Nuclear1]

Not that we ever really are in the first place.

[Kazan]

must..resist..giving..janos...an..aneurism

[by making a patently partisan comment just to watch the fireworks]

[BlackDove]

Originally posted by Corsair
For the record, the US has upped the amount of aid it's going to send over to something like $350 million, just so we all know that America isn't being quite so stingy.

Lose the 0.

It's 35 million.

Sweden is giving out 75 million.

STOCKHOLM, Dec 30 (AFP) - Sweden will give 500 million kronor (75 million dollars, 55 million euros) in emergency aid to the regions struck by the massive quake and tidal waves around the Indian Ocean, officials said Thursday.
"The extent of the catastrophe's devastation is not yet known and we must be prepared to help in any way we can," Development Aid Minister Carin Jaemtin said in a statement, calling the aid an "initial" installment.
The amount of the Swedish aid is large -- by comparison the United States has sent or promised 35 million dollars in aid.
The Swedish money will be channeled through the Swedish International Development Cooperation Agency, and will primarily go to the United Nations, the International Red Cross and other Swedish humanitarian and emergency aid organisations.
Sweden looked Thursday likely to be one of the Western countries hardest-hit by the massive earthquake and tidal waves, with between 1,000 and 4,500 Swedish holiday-makers still missing or unaccounted for, mostly in Thailand.
The confirmed overall death toll from Sunday's tragedy climbed to more than 118,000 on Thursday.
po/jfs


On the sidenote - just tonight the TV marathon took in 48 million dollars, and is going to continue on for two weeks.

The fact that we're pulling in more money than US is a ****ing joke.

[aldo_14]

The Us have raised their donation to $350m, it's been all over the news.  Japan have also raised theirs', to $500m.

[Kazan]

yep us raised to $350m, japan to $0.5B

[Unknown Target]

Get your facts straight before you post BD.

[Corsair]

Originally posted by BD


Lose the 0.

It's 35 million.

No, I'll keep the 0.

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/01/02/international/worldspecial4/02quake.html?hp&ex=1104642000&en=92dbe740aaf891ca&ei=5094&partner=homepage

As the first trickle of supplies broke through, the global relief effort to save an estimated five million survivors of last weekend's undersea earthquake and tsunami was reinforced yesterday when Japan increased its pledge of aid from $30 million to $500 million, the largest contribution thus far. Combined with a $350 million pledge by the United States on Friday, this brought total contributions from more than 40 nations to $2 billion, according to the United Nations. [Page 9.]

[BlackDove]

True, my bad. My news were a touch out of date.

[Ghostavo]

Am I the only one to whom this seems to be a popularity contest blown out of proportion? I mean giving money is good but with everybody screaming "You didn't give your last penny, AH!?!" it seems... ackward...  

Also, I thought the US was having budget problems, isn't this going to... er... "enlarge" them?

[aldo_14]

Originally posted by Ghostavo
Am I the only one to whom this seems to be a popularity contest blown out of proportion? I mean giving money is good but with everybody screaming "You didn't give your last penny, AH!?!" it seems... ackward...  

Also, I thought the US was having budget problems, isn't this going to... er... "enlarge" them?

Frankly, I don't give a ****.  Way I see it, most governments can find ways to piss away vast sums of moneys anyways, at least this way they can actually help people.  We should have more charity, in this country at least, so I'm not going to complain.

[Fineus]

What amuses me is that while some countries have massive internal problems and not a penny is spent on fixing them - something like this gets everyones backing because it's a tremendous oppertunity to look good infront of the world.

Don't get me wrong - my sympathies go to those affected. It is a tragedy and a terrible loss of life.

However, there are other problems in the world that'll still be there when this mess is cleaned up.

[Shrike]

The problem is, you can't fix internal problems by throwing money at them.  Internal problems almost always mean there's some sort of error in the system itself, the very system that those who run it have vested interest in maintaining.  By contrast, disaster relief is something you can help by throwing money at (assuming of course its managed properly).

[Fineus]

Perhaps Shrike, but referring back to an example of my own - the UKs rail service - I'm fairly sure that the problem could be solved by throwing money at it.

At present - our rail service is abismal. I've heard tales of European countries with computer controlled trains that can run in excess of 150MPH from station to station - are never late and run frequently.

Compared to Englands on rail service which - despite recent upgrades - is already out of date and based upon a system that badly needs replacing. Enough money could solve that problem.

I think I digress though, I think I was searching for an example of something that could be improved within a country before money is handed out to others as a show of good will.

I'm sure the money is welcome in the areas struck of course - and that it will be put to good use there. I think what irks me is governments performing a media act to better their own positions - sweeping internal problems under the carpet in a show of "look how nice we are, we've given these poor people money. Sure we've problems of our own that could use that money as well - but look at these people we've given the money to, and aren't we fantastic?".

I hope you can see what I'm trying to say - of course aid should be given. But - at least in my own country - I think our own infrastructures should be improved to equal those of other first world countries - before we attempt to play the media game alongside the US and other nations.

[Unknown Target]

Why do you care? I mean, I'm just saying: a big disaster happened. Sure, the world has other problems, but for once, everyone's banding together to do something nice.
What's the matter with that? Just look at what the various nations are doing, and not the reasons they did it. Good or bad, the end result is still good, correct?

[Fineus]

No doubt there - as I already said - the aid is well deserved and desparately needed.

However - I look at my own country and I don't see it as a first world nation. I see poor scholastic, medical, transport and civil facilities. We're in no position to attempt to match donations of the size that America and Japan have.

Of course - our goverment will no doubt arrange to have this disaster covered for some time to come in an attempt to sweep our internal issues under the carpet for a while.

[Flipside]

It's not just a question of throwing money, it's a question of throwing money accurately.

As for the current situation, I'm just sad that it's turned political in any way whatsoever, yes, what is being done is good, but from the impression I'm getting here, a lot of rich countries are stamping o each others fingers trying to prove how 'nice' they are.

[Ghostavo]

Originally posted by Kalfireth
No doubt there - as I already said - the aid is well deserved and desparately needed.

However - I look at my own country and I don't see it as a first world nation. I see poor scholastic, medical, transport and civil facilities. We're in no position to attempt to match donations of the size that America and Japan have.

Of course - our goverment will no doubt arrange to have this disaster covered for some time to come in an attempt to sweep our internal issues under the carpet for a while.

Same thing over here. Also, having been bombed by the media in the past years about
this, I find surprising that some countries (including mine), have donated as much as they have.