Albeit nuclear weapons related topics tend to get tainted or watered down by childish dogma, hopefully id like to establish a concesus about the issue below regarding the decision to use the two atomic bombs on Japan in WW2.... lets all remember that during the circumstances of the era, and the thinking as well as politically, how we would have responded if we were in there shoes (theres as in our forefathers who decided this route), and compare how we think now regarding the use of such weapons....
my one thing im tryin really to tinker with is the idea of a neccessary evil. such as, for example, roughly 350,000 people at most died from the use of these weapons, which also spared the lives of the remaining Japanese Populace from invasion by the allied forces of the US, Russia, China, and so forth, and you know dang straight if the other 2 got involved, there'd probrably be a north and south japan right now... or a situation similair to that of the east and west berlins/germany.
Now i read from a source that if we did invade Japan, almost double as many lives could be lost, if not more if we attempted an invasion of mainland Japan, and even if we did succeed, which would have been an inevetability, the civilian populace would have suffered grately from the invaders. Collateral would have made the collateral damage in europe or in GERMANY for that matter seem like a sand castle that has been stepped on lightly.
millions would have died. think about it, 300,000 people (who i say didnt prob deserve that fate) was the cost of saving maybe 3-200 million and or more japanese and thousands of US, chinese, russian, and any other allied forces that would have been involved. It sucks to think of it in this matter, as a numbers game, because 300,000 IS
OF PEOPLE, but at the same token, just as many and more chinese, philopino, pan-asian civilians that are never going to be accounted for suffered just as horible a fate as those civilians did during the bombings.... (sucky perspective, but these are sucky times, gladly we all live in an era now where we can look back and accept the crap for what it is, and make sense out of it.)
300,000 lives apposed to 200million people from various nations being involved in a nation whom would have defended itself to the last man and woman... what do you think?
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Link:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8837468/Article Here:
HIROSHIMA, Japan - Tens of thousands of people gathered in Hiroshima Saturday to mark the 60th anniversary of the world’s first atomic bomb attack with a moment of silence and offerings of flowers and water.
More than 55,000 people joined in the austere ceremony in Peace Memorial Park, a sprawling, tree-covered expanse that for one day each year becomes the spiritual epicenter of the global anti-nuclear movement.
A moment of silence was observed at 8:15 a.m., the instant of the blast. Flowers and water — symbolizing the suffering of those who died in the atomic inferno — were offered at a simple, arch-shaped stone monument at the center of the park.
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About 140,000 people were killed instantly or died within a few months after the Enola Gay dropped its deadly payload over the city, which then had a population of about 350,000.
Three days later, another U.S. bomber, Bock’s Car, dropped a plutonium bomb on the city of Nagasaki, killing about 80,000 people. Japan surrendered on Aug. 15, 1945, bringing World War II to a close.
The true toll on Hiroshima is hard to gauge, however.
Still no closure
Including those initially listed as missing or who died afterward from a loosely defined set of bomb-related ailments, including cancers, Hiroshima officials now put the total number of the dead in this city alone at 237,062.
This year, about 5,000 names are being added to the list.
“For the people of Hiroshima, this is a day of prayer,” said Takaomi Tahara, who lost several relatives, including his grandfather, in the bombing. To this day, he said, the remains of his dead relatives have not been found. “For us, there isn’t any closure.”
Along with being a time to remember those who died, Hiroshima’s anniversary has become the focus of the international peace movement.
In the biggest pre-anniversary event, about 8,000 people attended the annual World Conference Against Atomic and Hydrogen Bombs. The conference organizers, mainly leftist and labor groups, have collected more than 8.5 million signatures calling for a global nuclear ban.
Global peace gathering
On the eve of the anniversary, fundamentalist Christians held a prayer circle in Hiroshima, while members of the International Communist League handed out leaflets nearby.
Some people came on their own, offering a purely personal message.
“Our goal is to apologize to those who suffered and are still suffering the horrible, unspeakable atrocity of the atomic bomb,” said John Schuchardt of Ipswich, Mass., who came to Hiroshima with his wife. He said he was on a nine-day fast.
The United States has plans to keep 5,000 warheads — each far more efficient than the one that devastated this city. Russia, China, Britain, France, India and Pakistan, the confirmed nuclear powers, have no plans to give up their arsenals, either, and more countries are looking to join the club.
“I think everybody agrees that the world would be a better place without nuclear weapons,” said Helen Barlin, a 19-year-old tourist from Sachsenheim, Germany. “But with the politicians it’s all just words, words, words.”
A necessary evil?
Was a Hiroshima — and by extension today’s nuclear-armed world — a necessary evil?
Dr. Charles Waldren, a native of Colorado, is an expert on the medical legacy of the atomic bomb.
He is 71 and has spent his adult life studying the effects of radiation on humans and animals. For the past four years he has served as vice chairman and chief of research for the Radiation Effects Research Foundation, headquartered on a quiet hill within walking distance of Hiroshima’s ground zero.
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NBC: Navigator of Enola Gay feels no remorse
Since 1948, the foundation has tracked the lives of 100,000 people who survived the bombing. Roughly 40,000 are still alive, and their average age is 71.
“It was a horrible, horrible event,” Waldren said. “But it could have been worse.”
He said research indicates those exposed to the bomb’s radiation have only a 5 percent higher likelihood of developing cancer than the general population. “It’s smaller than people expected, which I think is an extraordinarily good thing.”
He added that there is also no clear link to hereditary mutations.
“Only one in 20 who develops cancer does so because of irradiation,” he said. “The risk from radiation is quite small compared with smoking.”
Waldren said he believes bombing Hiroshima was justified.
“My brother was in the Battle of the Bulge,” he said. “He was badly wounded, but they planned to ship him off to the Pacific. There was no doubt in my family that (dropping the bomb) was the right thing to do.
“I think it ended the war,” he said. “And I think it was a good thing.”
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