[mikhael]

Originally posted by TrashMan


Ermmm.... didn't you notice the two words in the title?

Typhoon, NOT Typhon - a different ship
And Beta, as in not 100% done

granted, with jsut a few relativly simple modifications (moving vertex and edges around) one could make a normal Typhon easily. If anyone wants to go ahead, I don't mind..

The hull for this one has allmost 2000 polys and it's a lot smoother then the original, but making vasuidan ships look more detailed is an unrewarding job...

Yes, I noticed them. I, however, chose the evidence of my eyes: its like the Trashman version of the Typhon. And I like it less than I do the original. My comment stands.

[StratComm]

What I find interesting is that, after seeing the true comparison shots, this model is actually substantially less-detailed than the Typhon.  For all of the extra polys, the basic alienness that the original design excelled at is lost.  Despite it's lack of polys, the original Typhon was a chiseled masterpiece.  But now much of that detail has been lost in the blob-smoothing job that's been done.  The second hanger is novel.  Increasing the deck guns is useful, provided they aren't overpowered.  But there was no reason to alter the nose profile, no reason to remove the vertical variation, and no reason to fatten the arm extrusions.  Most importantly and more characteristicly, there was no reason to make it bigger.  And there was NEVER any pretense to pretend that this is a different design; it's just a Typhon without the typhon-ness.

[TrashMan]

@Aldo - what looks alien and what looks not is a very subjective matter. To me it looks more alien.

@Trivial Psychic - good catch.
 Most ofd the texturing is shabby, and that's why I asked if anyone would be willing to help me texture it. If on one takes my offer I'll have to try and do it myself, but I'm not that good when it comes to texturing smooth, aliens stuff....

by BlackDove

.....it's exactly the same thing with a few minor details changed.

Why?

couse I wanted it that way

What I find interesting is that, after seeing the true comparison shots, this model is actually substantially less-detailed than the Typhon. For all of the extra polys, the basic alienness that the original design excelled at is lost. Despite it's lack of polys, the original Typhon was a chiseled masterpiece. But now much of that detail has been lost in the blob-smoothing job that's been done. The second hanger is novel. Increasing the deck guns is useful, provided they aren't overpowered. But there was no reason to alter the nose profile, no reason to remove the vertical variation, and no reason to fatten the arm extrusions. Most importantly and more characteristicly, there was no reason to make it bigger. And there was NEVER any pretense to pretend that this is a different design; it's just a Typhon without the typhon-ness.

I say again - alienness is subjective, and it's not less detaield. If you like hte original Typhon so much better , here, use my mesh and edit to to turn into the normal typhon. You have my blessing.

[StratComm]

I'll grant that alienness is, to a degree, subjective.  But level of detail is not.  And your mesh simply is less detailed.  I actually (as usual) still have no idea where you put all of those polys, since the only areas I can see with distinctly more are the engine blocks, the nose "claw", the fighterbays and the arms and those all manage to look less integrated with the ship than they were on the original model.

Originally posted by TrashMan
If you like hte original Typhon so much better , here, use my mesh and edit to to turn into the normal typhon. You have my blessing.

But why would I use what I consider an inferior model to start from?  Especially one that, for all of its similarities, would be a real pain to make match (cough... side profile).  Were I to do a HTL Typhon, I'd start with the original or from scratch.  There's really no other way to do it.

[Unknown Target]

The very least you could do is change it from "Typhoon" to something else. "Typhoon" is a common typo of the correct ship name, "Typhon".
And anyway, from the top it looks like you stretched the old one, removed the bridges, and smoothed the arms.

[IceFire]

I applaud all modeling attempts...seeing as they are better than my borg cube attempt with no UV mapping...but if we're going to be doing high poly versions of FS1 and FS2 ships...my feeling is that they have to match the old one almost exactly.  The difference of course being the additional details (greebling ) and ability to model everything with better details.  But the outline of the ship should remain essentially unchanged.

This isn't too much to ask really.  I know some guys doing work for WWII aviation stuff and they produce to accurate blueprints.  We've not got that kind of constricted development here...just produce based on what we've got.

[Wanderer]

Originally posted by Unknown Target
The very least you could do is change it from "Typhoon" to something else. "Typhoon" is a common typo of the correct ship name, "Typhon".
And anyway, from the top it looks like you stretched the old one, removed the bridges, and smoothed the arms.

It is big and nasty so how about... Typhoid!
 
Close to the Typhon but far enough from it to be recognized.

Just kidding.

Typhon seems (from wiki) also to have been a offspring of the Gaia and Tartarus so perhaps a search in mythology close to these themes? Something like Echidna ("Mother of All Monsters") the other offspring of Gaia and also Typhons mate. Check wiki or some other resource for these.

Typhoon is really too close to the name Typhon, and does it have anything to do with mythology?

[aldo_14]

Typhon is apparently the Greek form of Set/Seth.

[TrashMan]

Originally posted by StratComm
I'll grant that alienness is, to a degree, subjective.  But level of detail is not.  And your mesh simply is less detailed.  I actually (as usual) still have no idea where you put all of those polys, since the only areas I can see with distinctly more are the engine blocks, the nose "claw", the fighterbays and the arms and those all manage to look less integrated with the ship than they were on the original model.

the polys went to smoothing, where else? A clean render with no textures of both ships will show you just how big a difference there is...

[aldo_14]

Originally posted by TrashMan


the polys went to smoothing, where else? A clean render with no textures of both ships will show you just how big a difference there is...

The wireframe doesnt.  What's the actual difference in count; I would guess maybe 50% more polys (on the main hull)?  Of course, the problem with flat, bland shapes is that they tend to look simple; to me the best bit of the Typhon was that it looked higher detail than it was.

[TrashMan]

that's a OLD render with the old wireframe.

tehy typhon now looks far worse then it did in retail becouse of shinemaps and shadow casting, which reveal how truly low-poly the hul was - you can see the trinagles it's formed of...

Here's one screene I had lying around that shows part of hte issue...

[aldo_14]

That's partly because the shading on the Typon is screwed up; uniform 45 degree would fix a great deal of that, particularly shading.

[TrashMan]

I think this image sums it nicely:

See how smoother mine is?

[StratComm]

But again, most of that could be fixed by changing the smoothing angles on the old typhon without messing with its geometry.  And you're not going to like this, but that shot shows much more clearly that yours lacks the detail of the original.

[TrashMan]

Think what you wish..

Unless you haven't figured it by now there are 2-3 people on this board who's oppinion I mostly ignore....

[aldo_14]

Originally posted by TrashMan
Think what you wish..

Unless you haven't figured it by now there are 2-3 people on this board who's oppinion I mostly ignore....

Because you can't handle any form of informed criticism.  That's your problem, not mine, and I think this illustrates exactly why.

[TrashMan]

No, it's becose I can't rember those 2-3 people EVER liking anything I did (and  I've been here a lot and did a lot).

So when I get the feeling that someone is allways bashing my work, regardless of what I do I mostly ignore them (not in teh literal meaning - I allways read what they have to say  as even a broken clock is right two times a day, but when I feel the critics are misplaced or aren't constructive - I simply purge them from my memory)

[StratComm]

I know I'm the "2-3 people" that you're refering to.  But I know you have that perception because you tend to ignore the positive and read only the negative out of those posts.  And because you don't acknowledge the criticisms or start making excuses as to why it's "better that way" (or worse yet, "perfect" as it is) we tend to dwell on them to get it through to you that we have a point.  I'll be honest, I find your model style incredibly bland, but that's a personal preference that has nothing to do with the arguments I make about most things here.  And ultimately, the purpose of having these little discussions is to try to pass on to you some of the experience that I have accrued over the years which I do not see present in any of your models to date.  It's personal in the sense that you do have potential and a good creative eye, it's just often done partly and then rushed out the door.

Specifically the criticism here is don't try to pass of as a new ship something that is actually a poor knock-off of a original.  You said it was originally a HTL revamp of the Typhon, which I not only accept, I applaud.  But the key to making a HTL upgrade is to make the new model look better than the old while still remaining true to its roots, which I believe you have wholeheartedly failed at here.  Sometimes a project turns out as something not worth persuing.  Recognising that and turning toward other endeavors is a vital skill to have.

[mikhael]

I think it works out to you, Aldo and me, Strat.

I consider it good company.

[Gregster2k]

*points a finger at Stratcomm*

VARIETY IS GOOD. YOU ARE KILLING VARIETY.

I don't care if someone takes a Hercules and just adds a new fin to it and calls it a new ship, ITS VARIETY. And I like variety in any form because variety is fun. Variety keeps things interesting.

That said, stop knocking on this beautiful thing. And as for the name of it, stop arguing, it's a Typhon FROM AN ALTERNATE REALITY. There you go, arguing solved. Or its the Hammer of Light's version of a Typhon. WHO CARES WHAT IT IS IF ITS COOL?! GAD!