[ZylonBane]

So if the humans (and yes, they are HUMANS) in BSG drank acid and pissed laser beams, you wouldn't have a problem with that?

That would depend on how much sense it held within the value of the storyline. As Ford pointed out, that sort of example is particularly nonsensical as it is formulated to make no sense and have no perceivable value to a storyline. Anyways, at that point they wouldn't be humans, would they?

Which was exactly my point. The people in BSG are humans. Humans evolved here, on Earth.

Ever noticed how even the laziest science fiction no longer has canals on Mars or Amazon women on the Moon? That's because even the common guy on the street now knows that those planets are barren wastelands. Older stories could get away with that sort of stuff because people at the time didn't know any better. That's a key component of good fiction-- to build verisimilitude, you don't contradict what the reader knows to be factually true.

This is why BSG can't have humanity originating off Earth any more than a contemporary fiction author could have the Thames running through Egypt.

[aldo_14]

Which was exactly my point. The people in BSG are humans. Humans evolved here, on Earth.

Ever noticed how even the laziest science fiction no longer has canals on Mars or Amazon women on the Moon? That's because even the common guy on the street now knows that those planets are barren wastelands. Older stories could get away with that sort of stuff because people at the time didn't know any better. That's a key component of good fiction-- to build verisimilitude, you don't contradict what the reader knows to be factually true.

This is why BSG can't have humanity originating off Earth any more than a contemporary fiction author could have the Thames running through Egypt.

Why did you ignore the second part of my post, which was written to address this?  I mean,  BSG has Humvees and real-world assault rifles, so we know the writers can use points of reference.

[ZylonBane]

Because props aren't part of the plot.

[aldo_14]

Because props aren't part of the plot.

Of course they are; they're part of the setting and hence convey aspects of the background story or the emotion (intended) of a scene or said setting; even if just to convey a sense of familiarity to heighten the impact of story events.

[Unknown Target]

Good sci fi is written so that it can be plausible; it's depicting the author's vision of what may happen in the future; so if you have a human who shoots laser beams out of his eyes and farts ****-fueled nukes, you better have a damn good reason for it.

You can't write sci-fi and just go "Oh, well it's sci fi, so I can make ANYTHING happen!"; even Star Trek tried to quantify what it did by using a bunch of complex-sounding techonbabble.

[aldo_14]

Good sci fi is written so that it can be plausible; it's depicting the author's vision of what may happen in the future; so if you have a human who shoots laser beams out of his eyes and farts ****-fueled nukes, you better have a damn good reason for it.

You can't write sci-fi and just go "Oh, well it's sci fi, so I can make ANYTHING happen!"; even Star Trek tried to quantify what it did by using a bunch of complex-sounding techonbabble.

Plausible/believable is important, yes, but is an elastic term that is defined by the requirements of the storyline and setting (just look at fantasy books).  In the case of BSG, specifically, what is plausible within the universe can go in a multitude of ways; one way (not that this is what I'd say is the most likely or a way I'd expect to be taken) would be if the prophecies & history referred to could be taken literally, so you'd have beings who were close to being or actual gods living in Kobol alongside humans; in which case a lot of stuff would become more plausible.  Likewise, if it was found to be not literally true, certain things that might happen based on the prophecy, etc, would become more implausible.  With, for example, the date of BSG being unknown, it raises a lot of issues as to what is the most plausible connection to Earth, particularly Earth as we know it, is. 

If the writers find some better way to tell the story of going to Earth than making it the origin of humanity and hence it's (our?) journey to Kobol in the first place, then I'll judge that based on how well that part of the story is told and written.  Yes, it will likely be a more difficult way to go based on BSGs fairly 'solid' ground; that's why I don't think that route would be taken, and that's why my personal preferred option would still be the Earth-as-origin storyline.  But until we are given further information about Earth and the history of humanity as it is in BSG, then it's impossible to really judge which options have been closed or opened.

Assuming they ever reach Earth to answer the question, of course.

[Ford Prefect]

The best science fiction does not make simply predicting the future its primary goal. Science fiction at its best is a literary device.

[heretic]

I've seen complaints about BsG using humvees and "earth-made" weapons, but people need to understand that there isn't an unlimited amount of money.

and as to the year on the show and how it equates to earth, in the original series when they reached earth it was present-day.

[aldo_14]

I've seen complaints about BsG using humvees and "earth-made" weapons, but people need to understand that there isn't an unlimited amount of money.

and as to the year on the show and how it equates to earth, in the original series when they reached earth it was present-day.

Yeah, and that was somewhat of a disaster, wasn't it?

The Humvee, etc, thing to be honest doesn't bother me.  It's a bit odd, granted, but you can probably put it down to convergent design if you really need to rationalise it.  Plus it's nice to have a sci-fi show where everything isn't made of plastic.

[heretic]

it could be worse... remember Dark Angel with the Aztek?

and yes, the last season of the original series was beyond pathetic. I hope they actually don't reach earth this time.

and the humvees/weapons aren't the only thing. The show will make things look similiar on purpose to show a connection between the colonies and earth. For instance, Colonial 1, the name itself is just like Air Force 1 (which is any plane the president is in, just like RL) and also the colors of the ship itself.

They play a card game that is almost exactly like poker, a basketball/football hybrid, etc.. there are a lot of similarities.

[aldo_14]

it could be worse... remember Dark Angel with the Aztek?

and yes, the last season of the original series was beyond pathetic. I hope they actually don't reach earth this time.

and the humvees/weapons aren't the only thing. The show will make things look similiar on purpose to show a connection between the colonies and earth. For instance, Colonial 1, the name itself is just like Air Force 1 (which is any plane the president is in, just like RL) and also the colors of the ship itself.

They play a card game that is almost exactly like poker, a basketball/football hybrid, etc.. there are a lot of similarities.

Question is whether it is a literal or emotive connection; like how Colonial 1s is modelled/designed after a modern day airliner, to make it distinctive amongst the fleet.  Or like how the sidearm is (apparently) an exact replica of the gun Olmos had in Bladerunner.

Incidentally, here's a nice quote from Ron Moores blog;

"The question I would really like to see addressed is how to reconcile the underlying quest of Battlestar Galactica with actual scientific plausiability. The quest of Battlestar Galactica is to find Earth, the 13th Colony. However, it is a basic and well-substantiated tenet of science that human life here on Earth evolved slowly from a primate ancestor. Attempts to deny evolution based on the notion that human kind deserves a far more worthy origin than what evolution details, are a diservice to the pursuit of scientific truth and endeavors in our own world. There was always that reactionary sense to the original series, which drove it away from a secure standing as *science* fiction. How will the new series avoid this pitfall?"

I don't have a direct answer for this question yet. There are a couple of notions rolling around in my head as to how we reconcile the very real fact of evolution with the Galactica mythos, but I haven't decided which approach to take. However, it was a fundamental element of the orginal Galactica mythos that "Life here began out there..." and I decided early on that it was crucial to maintain it.

[Ace]

One solution while keeping that would be the 'gods' seeding life on Earth and taking some humans to Kobol once they arose.

Then when the civilization collapses on Kobol, a group returns to Earth. (maybe they never made it back?)

It would be interesting to see the Iblis plot used, with Iblis as one of the old gods who is using the Cylons and monotheism as a way of getting back at the other members of his race. Of course the 'gods' could have some delusions of granduer ala Stargate which almost makes Iblis seem justified. (of course to the more rational people like Adama they see Iblis' construct of 'god' as just as nasty)

[aldo_14]

One solution while keeping that would be the 'gods' seeding life on Earth and taking some humans to Kobol once they arose.

Then when the civilization collapses on Kobol, a group returns to Earth. (maybe they never made it back?)

It would be interesting to see the Iblis plot used, with Iblis as one of the old gods who is using the Cylons and monotheism as a way of getting back at the other members of his race. Of course the 'gods' could have some delusions of granduer ala Stargate which almost makes Iblis seem justified. (of course to the more rational people like Adama they see Iblis' construct of 'god' as just as nasty)

I think it's there to some degree already, isn't it?  I'm sure there's something in the new mythos about one of the 13 lords/gods of Kobol declaring war on the others, prompting the exodus to the colonies (which in itself raises interesting issues; if the 12 not-at-Earth colonies identify themselves with individual gods - and I'm not sure whether they do, so this may be moot - does the 13th - i.e. Earth - identify with that 'fallen' god?).  The idea of having one rebel god would tie in quite well, I suppose, with sparking the Cylon monotheism and resulting drive to convert/destroy colonial polytheism, although I'm not sure if I'd consider it a good story or not to make it that literal.

[Fineus]

On a slightly different note (and sorry to derai briefly). Can anyone in the UK who has seen the BSG adverts tell me what Darkness song is used during it? Or if it's not a Darkness song... who is it?

Cheers

[aldo_14]

On a slightly different note (and sorry to derai briefly). Can anyone in the UK who has seen the BSG adverts tell me what Darkness song is used during it? Or if it's not a Darkness song... who is it?

Cheers

'Kamikaze', by PJ Harvey.

Apparently.  Been wondering that myself for a while, never bothered checking until you mentioned.  And it's only a 5 second google search to know, you lazy pumpkin!

[Fineus]

Cheers

In all honesty I did spend a good few minutes typing in a different combination of "lyrics", "space", "battlestar" and the like. I guess I'm just not very good at it!