Author Topic: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/  (Read 11318 times)

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Offline NGTM-1R

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
Actually I was a bit shocked at how poorly they handled 'dying.'

They seemed to have a bit of shock when being resurrected which you would assume wouldn't quite be there.

Keep in mind Caprica-Six and Galactica-Boomer are explictly atypical. Caprica-Six may have been the first Cylon to die, but there were plenty ahead of Galactica-Boomer; a Six model got shot by Caprica-Boomer, another got stabbed by Starbuck, a whole bunch of Boomers (maybe others?) got blasted when the Basestar in Kobol's orbit was nuked, the resistance has shot/stabbed/blown up quite a few. The Three that Caprica-Six talks to mentions that her current body isn't her first either. She also seems much more well-adjusted. Presumably for most Cylons the rebirth procedure isn't nearly as traumatic.
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Offline Mefustae

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
Caprica-Six may have been the first Cylon to die
Where are you getting that from? Not only is it pretty obvious Caprica Six isn't the first to die and be reborn given they would have had to develop the rebirthing/download process prior to the attack - and as such there would have been testing - but we actually see another Six get killed aboard Armistace Station in the opening few minutes of the Mini. But apart from that, you make a good point.

@Ace; What do you mean the 'shock' shouldn't be there? The interrogation of Leoben back in Flesh & Bone, and the state of Gina in Pegasus showed that Humano-Cylons are suseptible to the same stresses mentally as run-of-the-mill Humans, and as such the mere memory of dying would prove somewhat... unsettling at the very least. As RDM said in the Podcast for the episode, once past the basic archetype of their model, each Cylon is an individual, and as such it's a logical step that some would bear the resurrection process better than others.

 

Offline NGTM-1R

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
Caprica-Six may have been the first Cylon to die
Where are you getting that from? Not only is it pretty obvious Caprica Six isn't the first to die and be reborn given they would have had to develop the rebirthing/download process prior to the attack - and as such there would have been testing - but we actually see another Six get killed aboard Armistace Station in the opening few minutes of the Mini. But apart from that, you make a good point.

Well I haven't watched the Mini in a few weeks. :p Stupid error on my part.
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Offline aldo_14

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
AFAIK he's said he doesn't want to use that part of the original story.
Indeed, I recall mentioning of the 'War of the Blades' or something along those lines out of the book of Pythia, and though it's not stated by any of the characters [AFAIK], you can see mentions of it when the camera gives the close-ups of Pythia in Home Pt. 1 & 2 etc. It'd be interesting to see what this war actually constituted.

'Blaze' rather than Blades, I thought, although in any case I'd imagine it to be very, um, interesting given that it seems to be regarded as a war between Gods, yet observed as such by what seems to have been a fairly advanced human civillisation (AFAIK Ron Moore has never said Kobol was primitive in tech level nor that the FTL transport was provided by a more advanced race, and I think he gave the analogy of how the Roman empire collapsed as a suggestion as to why the only records of Kobol are on parchment).  Thermonuclear war on Kobol?

As near as I can tell, the reason they resurrected Boomer is because, A) she may have had additional information and B) she's not really a threat. Perhaps they wanted to study her, to compare her to the behavior of Caprica Boomer. When "death becomes a learning experience", you can afford to keep double agents around in apartment rooms, I guess.

I would guess there could be a c) they needed information from Galactica-Boomer (it's possible, I think, that sleeper agents don't have an active connection to the rest of the Cylons).  Or d) they're like humans in the sense of wanting to have war heroes they can celebrate and hold high, perhaps not realising they may not be willing heroes.

 
Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
Presumably for most Cylons the rebirth procedure isn't nearly as traumatic.

I do believe "Scar" effectively disproves that.
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Offline NGTM-1R

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
I do believe "Scar" effectively disproves that.

Vengence isn't always for pain. :p Scar may be upset about the indignity of it. He/she/it is an ace after all. Aces have an ego most of the time. (Kat!)
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Offline Blue Lion

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
Maybe she was brought back because it costs more to "make" a new one.

 

Offline WMCoolmon

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
Maybe she was brought back because it costs more to "make" a new one.

As near as we can tell, Cylons do not have any kind of economic system other than what's necessary coming first, and what they want coming next.

There's a big complexity going on with Boomer. Keep in mind that the reporter girl has brought back critical information, but isn't a hero. So she could be jealous. But as Six pointed out (And I think we can take this as being pretty accurate) they're celebrities in a unity-based culture. The Cylons seem to have a very communistic style of life (see economic comment). But seeing as how the Cylons view the revenge on the human race as an important goal, they become special for their achievments. But other Cylons, presumeably the ones in power, do not want them to possibly change the opinion of the other Cylons, and introduce chaos.

Finally, there's the whole resurrection thing. Which would seem to be very important to the Cylons. Think of how defensive people get when someone mentions Social Security. How defensive would those people be if you started knocking off people's chance of resurrection? They'd be afraid of the same thing happening to them. And in a unity-based culture, unity and cooperation are going to be important. So if it's some master computer giving orders to the Human Cylons, it needs them cooperative, or the culture goes bye-bye. If it's the Human Cylons giving orders to themselves, then it has to be done with the cooperation of the others - or else it could spawn factions, and crack or even shatter the unity.
-C

 

Offline Blue Lion

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/

Quote
As near as we can tell, Cylons do not have any kind of economic system other than what's necessary coming first, and what they want coming next.

I don't think they have to pay the ressurection guy a living wage. Think of it as recycling. It's easier to use a mind that's already existed than to make one from scratch. If it's a "simple" process of downloading a mind, imagine what is required to make a new one.


Quote
There's a big complexity going on with Boomer. Keep in mind that the reporter girl has brought back critical information, but isn't a hero. So she could be jealous. But as Six pointed out (And I think we can take this as being pretty accurate) they're celebrities in a unity-based culture. The Cylons seem to have a very communistic style of life (see economic comment). But seeing as how the Cylons view the revenge on the human race as an important goal, they become special for their achievments. But other Cylons, presumeably the ones in power, do not want them to possibly change the opinion of the other Cylons, and introduce chaos.

This makes a lot of assumptions (and what do I know, I've only seen this series, not any previous ones)

Do we know there ARE cylons in charge? And how do we know this is even a forseeable thing? I mean we have the  lovely catch all "all of this has happened before" But couldn't it be possible the Cylons just don't see it coming?

 

Offline aldo_14

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
Of course, maybe the Cylons simply don't know how to make more than 12 or so kinds of mind, and perhaps their design is already being broken in terms of the boundaries those minds were expected to have.

Spoiler:
NB: I think there are a few episodes in the 3rd series relating to some character setting herself (D'anna Biers / Lucy Lawless) up as the Cylons' God.

 

Offline Mefustae

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
Keep in mind that the reporter girl has brought back critical information, but isn't a hero. So she could be jealous.
I believe you are incorrect in that statement. The D'anna Biers/Three that retrieved information on the Fleet [in the Galactica documentary] and Sharon's baby is still in the Fleet, while the D'anna Biers/Three we saw in Downloaded is just another copy. It's likely that the D'anna Biers/Three still in the Fleet is held as a Cylon Hero ala Boomer and Caprica Six, but they just didn't have any reason to mention her.

 

Offline Blue Lion

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
She's also probably not dead.

 

Offline WMCoolmon

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
Keep in mind that the reporter girl has brought back critical information, but isn't a hero. So she could be jealous.
I believe you are incorrect in that statement. The D'anna Biers/Three that retrieved information on the Fleet [in the Galactica documentary] and Sharon's baby is still in the Fleet, while the D'anna Biers/Three we saw in Downloaded is just another copy. It's likely that the D'anna Biers/Three still in the Fleet is held as a Cylon Hero ala Boomer and Caprica Six, but they just didn't have any reason to mention her.

Good point. I was thinking of her as the same as the fleet Three.

Although, I wonder if the support for Six and Eight are along copy lines. There is that bit from RDM about each copy being an archetype.
-C

 

Offline Mefustae

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
Although, I wonder if the support for Six and Eight are along copy lines. There is that bit from RDM about each copy being an archetype.
I got the impression that as 'heroes of the Cylons', they'd have the support of most - if not all - types. But it would be quite interesting if there was some sort animosity between certain types...

 

Offline Dan1

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
So what did you guys think of last night's episode? *March 3rd*

-I haven't read this anywhere or anything but going by the previews for next week I think one of 2 things will happen.

1) Baltar wins the election (they might not have the election results till the new season though it'd be a nice cliffhanger)

2) In the preview I think Roslin was talking to the convict guy that wanted to be her vice president before (can't remember his name) and telling him that Baltar is working with the cylons she thinks.  Thus he will join her on the ticket for a vice president (and she'd have to eat it as a concession for his support) and he'll agree thus ensuring Roslin has the presidency but (convict guy) is Vice.

Also, jumping inside of a mountain would suck.
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Offline Ace

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
The most sucky thing is that since the transponder still worked it meant that the vehicle was intact. So it replaces the matter it jumps into.

Now imagine being in a perfectly good raptor, stuck inside of a mountain, knowing that it's impossible to rescue you from a mile of rock...

Probably some crazy sex before they decide to turn off the life support...
Ace
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Offline an0n

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
You also come out of a jump at the same speed you were travelling when you activated your drives.

The transponder survived, but everything else woulda been mush.
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Offline Col. Fishguts

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
If the Raptor were still intact, they could have jumped back out. So they probably ended up in a violent underground fireball.

Also, Al is one badass priest.
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Offline Unknown Target

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
I think that once they jumped into the mountain, every open space around and inside the raptor would be A) Filled with rock, or B) crushed from the pressure.

 

Offline aldo_14

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Re: BSG what the ****!? /*yeah spoilers probly*/
The most sucky thing is that since the transponder still worked it meant that the vehicle was intact. So it replaces the matter it jumps into.

Now imagine being in a perfectly good raptor, stuck inside of a mountain, knowing that it's impossible to rescue you from a mile of rock...

Probably some crazy sex before they decide to turn off the life support...

http://www.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Lay_Down_Your_Burdens%2C_Part_I
Quote
Perhaps that part of the Raptor was in an air pocket in the rock, and thus not phased into it. RDM says in the podcast that the Raptor Jumping into the mountain wasn't like "swapping" spatial matter between two points: like a teleporter accident, the Raptor and its crew were horrifically merged into the rock itself.