Author Topic: The official world cup thread  (Read 111579 times)

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Offline Kazan

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The official world cup thread
our national team roster was annouced yesterday



we're going to do some owning - ranked #4 by FIFA






PS: see you in the semifinals limeys
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Offline Ghostavo

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Re: The official world cup thread
If Brazil gets it's act together I don't know who can beat them... then again, this can be said every world cup.
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Offline aldo_14

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Re: The official world cup thread
The US would do well to get out of their group (Italy, Czech, Ghana) IMO.  I can't see past Brazil either, myself, although I think Argentina will go further than perhaps is expected of them - especially if Messi is fit and playing.  Spain, surely, must be due for a good run; although they're perhaps are a wee bit light up-front (not impressed with them at Euro 2004), they have a great midfield (especially if Xavi is back to full fitness) and good width (Torres with Reyes on the left and Joaquin on the right?), plus one of the best defenders in the world in Carles Puyol.

 

Offline Kazan

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Re: The official world cup thread
Italy and Ghana should be no problem, Czech republic we need to atleast tie.  We need to get first in our group to avoid facing brazil in the group of 16 (which, barring miraculous play, would be disasterous - though i'm not going to assume any result to a theoretical USA vs Brazil match)

To get first in our group we need to at worst
Tie Czech, win vs Italy, win vs Ghana
I think we have a good chance to sweep our group.
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Offline aldo_14

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Re: The official world cup thread
Italy and Ghana should be no problem, Czech republic we need to atleast tie.  We need to get first in our group to avoid facing brazil in the group of 16 (which, barring miraculous play, would be disasterous - though i'm not going to assume any result to a theoretical USA vs Brazil match)

To get first in our group we need to at worst
Tie Czech, win vs Italy, win vs Ghana
I think we have a good chance to sweep our group.


Really?  I can't see it myself, to be honest; man for man I think the other 3 teams are better (Ghana, admittedly, is rather tougher to call, but the likes of Essien are an edge) and - crucially - have more top-level experience for their clubs and countries due to a much harder qualifying group.  I'd fancy the Czechs to top the group. Italy have the best squad, but are too inconsistent of late; even so I'd expect them to scrape second.

 

Offline Prophet

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Re: The official world cup thread
[singing]"Latenight HLP football smalltalk moment!"[/singing]
:lol:

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Offline Kazan

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Re: The official world cup thread
Aldo  :wtf: do you even pay attention to soccer

http://www.soccerphile.com/soccerphile/news/fifa.html

USA #4
Czech Republic #2
Ghana #50
Italy #14

11 players on the USMNT roster are MLS players, the other 12 are from a mix of european leagues - mostly england.
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Offline Kie99

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Re: The official world cup thread
It's football.

The USA play against easy teams week in week out, the only time they play any good teams is every 4 years at the World Cup, that's why they're ranked 4th.  I can't see them beating the Czechs and it depends on how Italy are playing, whether they'll beat you or not.

England should get through the group stages, but I can't see us getting any further than the quarter-finals without Rooney.
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Offline Kazan

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Re: The official world cup thread
this dismissive attitude really pisses me off

who's going to be the next mexico hmm?

i hope as farking hell it's you limeys - teach you a lesson for your stuck up attitude.

you're going to keep telling yourselves "oh the USA can't play!" right up till the moment we spank you - we barely lost to germany 1-0 last world cup, and they can thank Kahn for that.  Guess what? Kahn is getting old, and he's not starting anymore.  "played easy teams" pfft.   Some other US soccer fans refer to people like you are "Eurosnobs"

there is skill to be had in soccer on this side the ocean to!
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Offline aldo_14

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Re: The official world cup thread
Aldo  :wtf: do you even pay attention to soccer

http://www.soccerphile.com/soccerphile/news/fifa.html

USA #4
Czech Republic #2
Ghana #50
Italy #14

11 players on the USMNT roster are MLS players, the other 12 are from a mix of european leagues - mostly england.

Firstly, the FIFA rankings mean **** all, because they're determined as much by the oppositions' weakness as the strength of the teams' playing.  Brazil are top, that's about all (the Czechs weren't even in the last WC but are 2nd).  Are Mexico better than England or France?  I doubt it.  Are Trinidad and Tobago better than Ghana?  Nae chance.  Etc.  You get the likes of the US, Mexico, etc high up because they play a lot of weak teams compared to the Europeans in particular.

I've never actually heard anyone claim the FIFA rankings are reliable for this, to be honest.  Offhand, I think France were still ranked at or near the top after their dismal 2002 showing.

Now, looking at the Us teams' european players;
   DaMarcus Beasley    M    PSV Eindhoven
   Carlos Bocanegra    D    Fulham
   Steve Cherundolo    D    Hannover 96
   Bobby Convey    M    Reading
   Cory Gibbs    D    ADO Den Haag
   Marcus Hahnemann    GK    Reading
   Tim Howard    GK    Manchester United
   Kasey Keller    GK    Borussia Mönchengladbach
   Eddie Lewis    D    Leeds United
   Brian McBride    F    Fulham
   Oguchi Onyewu    D    Standard Liège
   Claudio Reyna    M    Manchester City

Beasley is the only one playing for a top-level team that's involved in european football (howard has been on the bench all season behind Van Der Sarr).  I'm not sure if Reyna is first choice at Man City now, actually (Sibierski might be nudging ahead), but in any case both MC and Fulham haven't had a sniff of european football for ages.  Both Reading and Leeds play in the 1st division (although both could be promoted this season).  ADO are a mid table Dutch side, IIRC, and Hannover likewise in Germany.  Mönchengladbach i'm not sure about, except that they had a bit of a 'mare when Advocaat was managing them and finished 15th in 04/05.  Liege are the one team that probably can qualify regularly for europe, but Belgium is rather a poor league.

That's not to say it's a bad side, but in terms of where players are playing, I reckon the other teams have a stronger base with the possible exception of Ghana, who have some very good players like Essien or Appiah but perhaps a weaker 2nd string.

Anyways, stop taking the huff.  You'll see in a month or so, but there's been little evidence on this side of the ocean that the US are anywhere near being one of the top teams in the world.  Maybe about the level of Denmark or Sweden - a solid, skillful side but without the spark of genius characterising a great side.  Maybe they'll be astonishingly good, and i'll eat my words.  Let's wait and see.

Worth noting that the last World Cup was utterly, utterly bizarre though in terms of results (stand up S.Korea!), with a lot of the best teams going out early when, man for man, they should have went far further.  I mean, just look at Germany in Euro 2002, out in the group stages and struggling to beat Latvia.

EDIT: next Mexico?  Mexico have never done well in world cups on the 'wrong' continent; no S.American team, other than Brazil, has either.  The only time Mexico went beyond the 2nd round was when they hosted it (plus Mexico have been playing in the Copa America, so they have more top-level experience against the worlds best teams).
« Last Edit: May 03, 2006, 10:32:50 am by aldo_14 »

 

Offline Kie99

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Re: The official world cup thread
this dismissive attitude really pisses me off

who's going to be the next mexico hmm?

i hope as farking hell it's you limeys - teach you a lesson for your stuck up attitude.

you're going to keep telling yourselves "oh the USA can't play!" right up till the moment we spank you - we barely lost to germany 1-0 last world cup, and they can thank Kahn for that.  Guess what? Kahn is getting old, and he's not starting anymore.  "played easy teams" pfft.   Some other US soccer fans refer to people like you are "Eurosnobs"

there is skill to be had in soccer on this side the ocean to!

Oh no Eurosnobs!  However will I cope?

Germany aren't all that good you know, they were beaten by England 5-1 at home about a year before that World Cup.

If you can tell me any good teams (note plural) which play against the USA other than at World Cups then I'm happy to concede.
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Offline Rictor

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Re: The official world cup thread
We're in a group with Argentina and the Netherlands, ranked #3 and #4 in FIFA. It would take nothing less than an act of God to get Serbia past the first round. Sure, we did OK in qualifiers, but sadly I think this is out of our league. Not to mention that those bastard Dutch are the reason we didn't advance in World Cup 98 and didn't qualify in 2002. Honestly, it's either a very strange set of coincidences, or they're on some sort of vendetta.

 

Offline Ghostavo

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Re: The official world cup thread
I don't want to sound like a bashing kind of person Kazan, but they are sort of right... http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com/06/en/w/team/overview.html?team=usa

Look at the friendlies... that 4-1 isn't exactly something to brag about. And that was about a month ago. Germany was #19 together with Greece in the Fifa rankings at the time.
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Offline Kazan

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Re: The official world cup thread
why is it people presume that we're putting our best team in the field on a friendly?  :wtf:

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Offline Ghostavo

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Re: The official world cup thread
So you assume USA would have beaten Germany if you had what players on the field?

EDIT:
BTW, what do you people think Angola's chances are?
Most people here are seeing them as a dark horse.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2006, 12:20:56 pm by Ghostavo »
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Offline Col. Fishguts

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Re: The official world cup thread
Most of the African teams that attend this time are sort of a blank paper, since Nigeria and Cameroon are missing.

The German team is in pretty bad shape at the moment, not that that ever stopped them from getting really far in the tournament.

@Kazan: As Aldo so kindly put it, the FIFA rankings are worth ****. I'd be really impressed if the US beats the Czechs and Italy, but good luck anyway.

I would put my money on either Brasil (the usual suspect) or Argentina. My half-argentinian friend swears on the combination of Messi and Riquelme. What I've seen of Riquelme in the Champions League was promising (ok, the last penalty not so)

But of course my heart beats for Switzerland, and our team is in pretty good shape, definitely better than at WorldCup'94.
We'll be facing France, Togo and South-Korea in the first round, which gives us a realistic chance I hope.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2006, 12:34:18 pm by Col. Fishguts »
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Offline aldo_14

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Re: The official world cup thread
why is it people presume that we're putting our best team in the field on a friendly?  :wtf:



Well, FIFA rankings are also determined by friendly results.....

 

Offline Kazan

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Re: The official world cup thread
So you assume USA would have beaten Germany if you had what players on the field?

EDIT:
BTW, what do you people think Angola's chances are?
Most people here are seeing them as a dark horse.

if Kahn wasn't on the field - he saved their butts

why is it people presume that we're putting our best team in the field on a friendly?  :wtf:



Well, FIFA rankings are also determined by friendly results.....

you do have a point there



i still expect to beat ghana and italy without problem - czech republic will be a challenge.
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Offline aldo_14

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Re: The official world cup thread
i still expect to beat ghana and italy without problem - czech republic will be a challenge.

Me, I doubt that (certainly 'without problem' - you have seen the Italy squad, right?).  However, we shall see come June, so let us wait till then.  After all, this a bit early to have a WC thread before most domestic leagues have completed.

EDIT; for those who count such things - match odds http://www.oddschecker.com/betting/mode/c/card/worldcup2006-worldcup/scard/17323/btype/M
(United States (3/1)   Draw (11/5)   Czech Republic (15/13)
Italy (5/8)   Draw (45/17)   United States (9/2)
Ghana (29/12)   Draw (9/4)   United States (6/5))

Of course, we all know how unpredictable the World Cup is  (Come on Trinidad & Tobago! :D)
« Last Edit: May 03, 2006, 01:12:49 pm by aldo_14 »

  

Offline Kazan

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Re: The official world cup thread
our domestic league runs april->november so if i waited until after ours was over the world cup would be long over
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