Author Topic: Of Animalism And Animalists...  (Read 14017 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Mobius

  • Back where he started
  • 213
  • Porto l'azzurro Dolce Stil Novo nella fantascienza
    • Skype
    • Twitter
    • The Lightblue Ribbon | Cultural Project
Of Animalism And Animalists...
This Sunday I took down a fagiano:



This is the second important kill in my Hunter-career,after the Cock I shooted at last year.



I was wondering,what do you think about animalism and animalists?
Every temptative of talking about that in Italian forums ended pretty bad,most likely due to the presence of Animalists.

But I think that here is different,a FS player kills thousands of people,as an NTF pilot he takes down civilians transports. I know it's just a game,but I don't think that you agree with what WWF members say about Hunting,if you ever paid attention on them.

Please,post here your opinion but this thread mustn't degenerate like the 9/11 one I created previously.I want to know what do you think about it.
The Lightblue Ribbon

Inferno: Nostos - Alliance
Series Resurrecta: {{FS Wiki Portal}} -  Gehenna's Gate - The Spirit of Ptah - Serendipity (WIP) - <REDACTED> (WIP)
FreeSpace Campaign Restoration Project
A tribute to FreeSpace in my book: Riflessioni dall'Infinito

 

Offline Mefustae

  • 210
  • Chevron locked...
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
If you're talking about organisations like the WWF, then i've got no problem with 'em. If you're talking about groups like PETA, then we've got a problem.

  

Offline BlackDove

  • Star Killer
  • 211
  • Section 3 of the GTVI
    • http://www.shatteredstar.org
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
This thread makes me feel like I've been bukkaked with stupid.

That's what I think about it.

 

Offline aldo_14

  • Gunnery Control
  • 213
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
This Sunday I took down a fagiano:



This is the second important kill in my Hunter-career,after the Cock I shooted at last year.



I was wondering,what do you think about animalism and animalists?
Every temptative of talking about that in Italian forums ended pretty bad,most likely due to the presence of Animalists.

But I think that here is different,a FS player kills thousands of people,as an NTF pilot he takes down civilians transports. I know it's just a game,but I don't think that you agree with what WWF members say about Hunting,if you ever paid attention on them.

Please,post here your opinion but this thread mustn't degenerate like the 9/11 one I created previously.I want to know what do you think about it.

Heehee, you said 'cock'.

*cough*

Ahem. (WTF is an animalist?)  Firstly, any mention of FS is entirely irrelevant - FS is a game, there is no natural 'cost' measured in actions. Anyone who honestly equates altering the state of RAM-stored bits as being in any way morally relevant to pulling a trigger and actually killing a living organism is in need of professional mental help.

I think hunting is bad if not being (necessarily) done for the sake of procuring food; otherwise it's (often unmanaged, or indeed cruel) killing for the sake of fun, and I'd like to think as a species we're a wee bit beyond that.  Basically, as a species - and a dominant, naturally destructive one - I think we have an obligation to manage our environment responsibly for out own sake.  Hunting - killing - for fun is a pointless anachronism harking bark to the darker era of human nature and behaviour.

However, the likes of PETA - the fundamentalists who deny human nature as an apex predator - are idiots and fools.  We do need to use animals - for testing medicine, clothing, and food.  I just think we need to manage that use sensibly.  You want to hunt a fox?  (for example)  Fine - just do it alone (so it's a fair 'sport'), and eat the fox when you finish.  Perhaps there's a double standard in advocating the use of (say) a rabbit to test a cancer cure, whilst opposing shooting one for the sake of a quick jolly.

 

Offline Dysko

Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
Sorry for this off-topic post, but:
But I think that here is different, a FS player kills thousands of people, as an NTF pilot he takes down civilians transports
I think this doesn't make sense. It seems like you are endorsing killing a lot of people in REAL world, since you kill them in a videogame. The difference between a videogame and real life is that in a videogame you can do what you could never do in real life. I think that nobody who played GTA (at least nobody mentally sane) would go with a shotgun shooting whoever comes in sight.
My aviation photography website: GolfVictorSpotting.it

 

Offline Col. Fishguts

  • voodoo doll
  • 211
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
I think it should be legal shoot hunters ... hey it's just a sport.
"I don't think that people accept the fact that life doesn't make sense. I think it makes people terribly uncomfortable. It seems like religion and myth were invented against that, trying to make sense out of it." - D. Lynch

Visit The Babylon Project, now also with HTL flavour  ¦ GTB Rhea

 

Offline Mefustae

  • 210
  • Chevron locked...
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
Vee shall now hunt zee most dangerous prey of all... man. *Cocks rifle*

 

Offline Nuke

  • Ka-Boom!
  • 212
  • Mutants Worship Me
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
id like to go hunting. il get a few thousand nuclear warheads and shoot at squirrels from orbit :D
I can no longer sit back and allow communist infiltration, communist indoctrination, communist subversion, and the international communist conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious bodily fluids.

Nuke's Scripting SVN

 

Offline Colonol Dekker

  • HLP is my mistress
  • Moderator
  • 213
  • Aken Tigh Dekker- you've probably heard me
    • My old squad sub-domain
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
I dont agree with fox hunting as its more like a genocidal rampage, (Even though i've been once, once i said.... :nervous:) If the animals numbers are being thinned too much then let em re-populate as extinction is set for only shivans to dish out. If Pigeon hunting was a sport i could live with it for instance.
Campaigns I've added my distinctiveness to-
- Blue Planet: Battle Captains
-Battle of Neptune
-Between the Ashes 2
-Blue planet: Age of Aquarius
-FOTG?
-Inferno R1
-Ribos: The aftermath / -Retreat from Deneb
-Sol: A History
-TBP EACW teaser
-Earth Brakiri war
-TBP Fortune Hunters (I think?)
-TBP Relic
-Trancsend (Possibly?)
-Uncharted Territory
-Vassagos Dirge
-War Machine
(Others lost to the mists of time and no discernible audit trail)

Your friendly Orestes tactical controller.

Secret bomb God.
That one time I got permabanned and got to read who was being bitxhy about me :p....
GO GO DEKKER RANGERSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
President of the Scooby Doo Model Appreciation Society
The only good Zod is a dead Zod
NEWGROUNDS COMEDY GOLD, UPDATED DAILY
http://badges.steamprofile.com/profile/default/steam/76561198011784807.png

 

Offline Herra Tohtori

  • The Academic
  • 211
  • Bad command or file name
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
Eating animals is okay. Human as species is an omnivore, meaning that we naturally eat almost anything that moves (or doesn't move) and is even remotely edible.

So I have no problem with hunters as long as the prey is used as food. People eat meat anyway, I don't see any difference between meat coming from slaughterhause and meat coming from forest, at least ethics-wise. So it's okay as long as the meat is used.

Hunting animals just for fun is nuts, though. Killing animals in "Great White Hunter" style is something I do not really understand. This, however, is fun to watch: Paybaaack! I just wish he had mauled one of the hunters a little more. Fracking idiots, what were they thinking.



But here's something to think.

In Finland, it's a common hobby to hunt moose (or is it meese or whatever in plural... :lol:). So, in order to make the hunting more successful, an overgrown elk population is maintained in Finland. This causes many problems. For example, car vs. elk accidensts are quite common and often result in deaths and in any case, total wreckage of the car. Besides this, the animals cause havoc by eating young trees to death and causing millions of damage to forest industry.

Also, the natural predators of elk (ie. wolves) have been reduced to pitiful population as a result of hunting in old times, so it's up to hunters to keep the elk population under control - thus the overgrown size of elk population is completely conscious choice, and thus the hunters keeping the population too big are almost directly responsible for the great number of elk vs. car insidents, as well as millions of damage to the forest industry.

So, for making the hunting of elk easier for people who want to hunt, the population is kept quite big, which causes problems.

I'm definitely not against hunting elk in general, since if they weren't hunted there would be even more of them than there is now, but I just think their population should be reduced to perhaps half or even third of what it is now. It would make the hunting more of a challenge and it would reduce the collateral damage significantly.

I'm not into hunting myself, but I can understand why some people want to do it. If it's done correctly, it's all right. Killin rare animals such as elephants or gorilla just to get ivory or perhaps a stuffed gorilla into trophy room is something that almost makse me puke.


...On the other hand, so does PETA. I took a glance to their website and goddamn what morons they seem to be.

<Off-topic PETA rant - zoom if you want to read>
Eating animals is part of what humans do. Perhaps they would also want other predators to quit eating other animals. Most primates eat small animals when they get the chance. Some have more vegetarian diet, some have more predatory diet. Humans and chimpanzees have much in common in that regard, where as gorilla tend to be more vegetarian species.

Animals eat animals. Humans are animals (albeit one of the most intelligent species on Earth), thus there is no ethical barrier for eating animals IMO.

Other thing that disturbs me is that we "shouldn't use animals for testing" mantra they seem to like so much... While I can agree that testing cosmetics and other unnecessary products with animals is even more stupid than the idea of 100% denser and three times longer eyelashes, testing medical products with animals is frankly necessary, unless we want to do the tests directly on humans, and that's even more unethical IMHO.

Also, I don't think using wool clothes is bad for the sheep... :lol: And I don't think the slaughtered and eaten cows need their hides any more. In fact, since we do eat the animals, why wouldn't we use every part of them? It would be such a waste not to use perfectly good hide for leather products. Fur farming, though, is more of an ethically doubtful thing to do IMHO. It's different amongst the inuit and other people who live in environments where they really need fur clothes to survive... but decorative use is not so cool.

</rant>
There are three things that last forever: Abort, Retry, Fail - and the greatest of these is Fail.

 

Offline Kazan

  • PCS2 Wizard
  • 212
  • Soul lives in the Mountains
    • http://alliance.sourceforge.net
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
occasionally the herd needs to be thinned for the health of the herd as well - such as deer populations in several counties in my state ... the "ZOMG you cannot kill bambi!!!" freaks go off... but seriously don't know wtfh they're talking about because if they don't allow bow hunting in city limits the deer population would get so high they'd get sick with diseases they can give to little johnny son-of-bleeding-heart-idiot


PS: original poster = insane
PCS2 2.0.3 | POF CS2 wiki page | Important PCS2 Threads | PCS2 Mantis

"The Mountains are calling, and I must go" - John Muir

 

Offline Colonol Dekker

  • HLP is my mistress
  • Moderator
  • 213
  • Aken Tigh Dekker- you've probably heard me
    • My old squad sub-domain
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
Bambis mum = valid target every time, as is thumper....... :)
Kill whatever you want, just dont wip[e them out, thats my general take on it./...... :nod:
Campaigns I've added my distinctiveness to-
- Blue Planet: Battle Captains
-Battle of Neptune
-Between the Ashes 2
-Blue planet: Age of Aquarius
-FOTG?
-Inferno R1
-Ribos: The aftermath / -Retreat from Deneb
-Sol: A History
-TBP EACW teaser
-Earth Brakiri war
-TBP Fortune Hunters (I think?)
-TBP Relic
-Trancsend (Possibly?)
-Uncharted Territory
-Vassagos Dirge
-War Machine
(Others lost to the mists of time and no discernible audit trail)

Your friendly Orestes tactical controller.

Secret bomb God.
That one time I got permabanned and got to read who was being bitxhy about me :p....
GO GO DEKKER RANGERSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
President of the Scooby Doo Model Appreciation Society
The only good Zod is a dead Zod
NEWGROUNDS COMEDY GOLD, UPDATED DAILY
http://badges.steamprofile.com/profile/default/steam/76561198011784807.png

 

Offline vyper

  • 210
  • The Sexy Scotsman
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
I wouldn't mind going out and shooting a deer or something if I was going to eat it. Bar that, it seems rather too much like giving in to our worst instincts.
"But you live, you learn.  Unless you die.  Then you're ****ed." - aldo14

 

Offline Colonol Dekker

  • HLP is my mistress
  • Moderator
  • 213
  • Aken Tigh Dekker- you've probably heard me
    • My old squad sub-domain
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
Its either that or let em build up, We're not Jedi or Vulcan, Its good to let off steam......:snipe: :headz: :random non-existant smiley:
Campaigns I've added my distinctiveness to-
- Blue Planet: Battle Captains
-Battle of Neptune
-Between the Ashes 2
-Blue planet: Age of Aquarius
-FOTG?
-Inferno R1
-Ribos: The aftermath / -Retreat from Deneb
-Sol: A History
-TBP EACW teaser
-Earth Brakiri war
-TBP Fortune Hunters (I think?)
-TBP Relic
-Trancsend (Possibly?)
-Uncharted Territory
-Vassagos Dirge
-War Machine
(Others lost to the mists of time and no discernible audit trail)

Your friendly Orestes tactical controller.

Secret bomb God.
That one time I got permabanned and got to read who was being bitxhy about me :p....
GO GO DEKKER RANGERSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
President of the Scooby Doo Model Appreciation Society
The only good Zod is a dead Zod
NEWGROUNDS COMEDY GOLD, UPDATED DAILY
http://badges.steamprofile.com/profile/default/steam/76561198011784807.png

 

Offline Dysko

Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
This summer there has been the problem of the overgrown bambi population in a region of Northern Italy. The regional rulers gave away permissions to hunt bambis since they were creating a lot of problem, but people who doesn't want animal to be hunted (Mobius called them "animalists", but it seems this word doesn't exist in English, so please tell me which word is that :rolleyes:) made many sit-ins to complain about this. Result: only few hunting permissions were given at high prices, so the problem hasn't been resolved.

Also, recently there has been another similar problem. Those of you who live in Europe should have heard the history of Bruno the bear. Bruno was a bear that was freed in an Italian park, but he then went in Germany, where he caused a lot of problems (eaten sheeps etc.). When he became a threat for towns, some hunters killed him. When this happened, here in Italy there have been a lot of complains about his killing (ah, we Italians, we always find something to complain about! :doubt:).
My aviation photography website: GolfVictorSpotting.it

 

Offline aldo_14

  • Gunnery Control
  • 213
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
The answer is really quite simple; culls should be done by professionals with training in land management, not amateurs out for a laugh.  It's not unknown, of course, for culls to be unecessary or excessive for the simple purpose of economic benefit (through hunting tourists, etc) - I believe the US moose population has suffered for this reason, with widespread overexaggeration of numbers.

 

Offline Flipside

  • əp!sd!l£
  • 212
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
I hunted by bow once, took down a hare which we ate that evening, it's a very 'powerful' experience to end a life, I can understand why some people can get addicted to it.

The good thing about bow hunting is that it's a more 'basic' confrontation, you have to pick targets a lot more carefully, however, inexpert bowmen are as bad as inexpert riflemen, animals can be wounded and in pain if the shot isn't clean. For actual hunting, the clean kill is more important, because you are planning to eat it, and a painful death is not only unpleasant for the animal, it releases toxins that can ruin the taste of the meat.

Trophy Hunting is something else entirely and I really am not a fan of it, it's like 'Wow, that Deer must be really old to have Antlers that big, I better shoot it to prove to everyone how long it was alive for.'

 

Offline kode

  • The Swedish Chef
  • 28
  • The Swede
    • http://theswe.de
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
I dont agree with fox hunting as its more like a genocidal rampage

depends on how you go about it. the traditional brittish way of doing it isn't exactly what I'd call good hunting ethics, as it stresses the animal far too much. sitting waiting and watching for them all night is an entirely different matter, however.

myself, I've only been hunting moose, which involves a lot of waiting for the game, and not much else. but it's still very exciting when you suddenly hear something close to you, and the dogs barking is coming closer... that said, I haven't killed anything yet myself, but that doesn't really matter too much to me - the act of it is more important. of course, getting a couple of kilos of meat home isn't bad at all, either.
Pray, v. To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf of a single petitioner confessedly unworthy.
- Ambrose Bierce
<Redfang> You're almost like Stryke 9 or an0n
"Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored."
- Aldous Huxley
WAR IS PEACE
FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH

 

Offline Bobboau

  • Just a MODern kinda guy
    Just MODerately cool
    And MODest too
  • 213
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
most of you don't know what your talking about, you hunt an animal you develop a lot of respect for it, it's life is on the line and it puts up a lot of effort to survive, you have to track it, get inside it's head, you need to use your senses and your instincts, and it all comes down to the kill, you can't properly experience this if you aren't actual trying to kill the thing, otherwise your basically just scareing it off. it puts you into contact with nature and yourself.

I hunt rabbits and the lot in my largish yard mainly with large home made knives (many designed to be thrown), the odd shuriken, and spear like weapons, mostly to keep them away from my garden. I have had experiments with projectile weaponry, I have this thing about making my own stuff, especially weaponry, so everything I have is homebrew or at least heavily modified, so I won't use a gun unless I build it, which I've considered a few times (some of you may remember the incident with the home made slingshot).
I mostly only have a desire to hunt down herbivorous mammals but I'm not opposed to fighting any largish preditor that should happen to invade my territory (dogs mostly). I think instincts are good and should be followed.
Bobboau, bringing you products that work... in theory
learn to use PCS
creator of the ProXimus Procedural Texture and Effect Generator
My latest build of PCS2, get it while it's hot!
PCS 2.0.3


DEUTERONOMY 22:11
Thou shalt not wear a garment of diverse sorts, [as] of woollen and linen together

 

Offline Ford Prefect

  • 8D
  • 26
  • Intelligent Dasein
Re: Of Animalism And Animalists...
Are you a mountain man?
"Mais est-ce qu'il ne vient jamais à l'idée de ces gens-là que je peux être 'artificiel' par nature?"  --Maurice Ravel