[Flipside]

People only notice them when they are dressed up for temple, same as a lot of Muslim teenagers, when they are just another kid hanging out with his mates, he's invisible. That leads to the assumption that all Jews ever wear is temple gear.

[Col. Fishguts]

Yeah, he did.

Step 3: Profit

On topic: While it's true that the first generation of immigrants sometimes refuses to integrate themselves in any form, they're children and grand-children don't seem to give a rats ass about their heritage.
The current generation of 15'ish old kids all want to be suburb-hiphop-gangstas. They all speak the same wannabe-slang and emulate hiphop-video behavior. Ethnic background doesn't play a role there, everybody can be a wannabe-homie, yay !

Explain the Jews then.

What Jews ?

I was talking about the immigration waves from the last few decades here in Switzerland, which came from Italy, Portugal. Spain, Ex-Yugoslavia, Sri Lanka, North-Africa, Turkey and recently Germany. The last jewish immigrants came here during WWII, and all the Jews I know are at least 3rd generation here, wich I wouldn't consider immigrants anymore.

[Mr. Vega]

And I'm talking about how the jews maintained their identity over the course of 2 millennia no matter what. I'm not saying the muslims emigrating into Europe have anywhere near that level of cohesiveness, but there are also a lot more of them. Instead of brushing it aside with rhetoric, try actually considering whether they might not assimilate at all, which means they'll be forming a pocket nation inside the european countries. If that is true, then all that has to happen for Steyn's worse case scenario to occur is for the muslim birth rate + immigration rate to outrun the original population's birth rate. End of story.

EDIT- on top of that, the european countries (especially France) aren't exactly welcoming towards the muslims, which makes assimilation much less likely.

[Flipside]

Well, it does also need to be taken into account that America still has a 'Hispanic community' and an 'African American' community, for example, people will habitually group together with people who dress and act as they do, you can see that kind of behaviour from teenagers onwards, and not just by nationality, groups form all the time regarding musical style, favourite pastimes even make of car or whether you prefer a Harley Davidson, and each of those groups will remain a little bit 'seperate' from other groups, sort of like an Elite club.

France gets a lot of stick, one minute they are anti-semitic, the next they are anti-Islamic, when, in truth what France is, is Pro-France, who can blame them really? I don't hold with all their practices regarding immigration, but they simply use a different approach. Does it work? Time will tell, the riots recently have suggested otherwise, however, I've heard people in France saying there was far far more to that than the media were reporting.

Edit : I'm sure each of you has at some point been in one group that has a member that another group you hang around with doesn't like. If you have been in that situation, you'll know the strength of group ties and the difficulties with dealing with conflicting interests.

[Flipside]

Sorry for the double post, but I thought this would help clarify my point...

http://encarta.msn.com/media_461544073/U_S_Birth_and_Death_Rates.html

If you look at that, you'll notice that since 1970 there have been higher birth rates and lower death rates in non-white communities. Using this data alone, I could hypothesize that in around 200 years the white population of America will be pushed out by the non-white population.

Of course, in order to come to that conclusion, I have to ignore several other facts. Mixed-race marriages aren't all that common even these days, so a blending of societies is still a fair distance off, but they are one factor I've not bothered to include. As well as the number of people from each ethnic group in the country (i.e. out of the US's 300 million people, approx 235 million are of European/White ethnicity)*

So, a simple 'Birth to Death' chart can say all sorts of things, depending on how you look at it.


*http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0762156.html

[Mobius]

I confirm that.Everyone has sex but with condoms...

[aldo_14]

I confirm that.Everyone has sex but with condoms...

Sweet!

*adds Italy to holidays list*

[vyper]

When did The Pill go out of fashion?!

[aldo_14]

When did The Pill go out of fashion?!

Because it makes more sense to encourage use of a barrier contraceptive.

[kode]

I confirm that.Everyone has sex but with condoms...

me, I like sex with women, but to each his own...

and wtg ****ing up the quote.

[Mefustae]

I confirm that.Everyone has sex but with condoms...

me, I like sex with women, but to each his own...

and wtg ****ing up the quote.

*Chuckle*

kode, you so crazy.

[vyper]

When did The Pill go out of fashion?!

Because it makes more sense to encourage use of a barrier contraceptive.

But it's less fun.

[aldo_14]

When did The Pill go out of fashion?!

Because it makes more sense to encourage use of a barrier contraceptive.

But it's less fun.

If it was supposed to be about fun, they'd be handing out furry handcuffs and whipped skooshy cream at family planning clinics.....

[Wobble73]

When did The Pill go out of fashion?!

Because it makes more sense to encourage use of a barrier contraceptive.

But it's less fun.

And so are STD's.   : 

[Sandwich]

I get annoyed because, and it's not particuarly you, I'm afraid you just got the brunt of a late night and a headache, there is far too much flinging of comments about the European Union that seem to be garnered more from Fox News than from research, and just as people from other countries find it annoying when people generalise about their country or union, there's a line for Europeans too.

...yeah, but Europeans are all the same!!12

[vyper]

When did The Pill go out of fashion?!

Because it makes more sense to encourage use of a barrier contraceptive.

But it's less fun.

And so are STD's.   : 

If it's someone you know well enough and trust then they're not an issue. If you want to sleep with anything, well thats a whole different ball game... I'm not big on man-whoring.

[Flipside]

...yeah, but Europeans are all the same!!12

LOL

As for the whole STD's thing, yes, there are some stupid people out there at the moment, chlamydia is a big problem, but then, it is a worldwide problem, mainly because people are so paranoid about their 'private parts' that most do not go to the Doctor with problems until much later than they should have. This is often worse in countries where people are encouraged to think of those parts as 'dirty' in the first place.

However, once again, the push here is to educate teenagers to the danger of having unprotected sex rather than simply throwing regulations at them, and it is slowly working.

[Turambar]

sure as hell aint working here.

they taught us abstinence.




yeah.  that worked.

[Flipside]

Abstinence was a stupid idea, that, I would say, is a classic example of what happens when you simply try to regulate sex by telling people not to do it instead of educating them why they should take precautions.

[Rictor]

Why would a europe with a substantial muslim population be a bad thing, again?

For the same reason that Egypt with 20% of the population being first or second generation European would be a bad thing - it would cease being, or if not cease than decrease the degree to which it is, Europe. Say what you will, from any scientific POV Europe's identity is white and Christian. It also has a distinctly different heritage than most African and Middle-Eastern countries, not better or worse just different - the Renaissance, enlightenment, industrial revolution, a specific form of government etc. Different places have different identities, and if you mix them together too much you end up losing the uniqueness of the place. I am as opposed to immigration from Algeria to France as I am from France to Algeria. A sort of nationalism is favour or no one and everyone.

If you think that there's nothing wrong with unlimited immigration, ask yourself what Syria would think about having 2 million Germans living in the country. Or what