Author Topic: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck  (Read 8740 times)

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Offline NGTM-1R

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
Well, there are a few Psalms out there that speak of God giving strength for War and teaching Fingers to Fight (Thank you Medieval Total War 2) but the thing is, both Holy Books contain verses about love, respect and tolerance as much as Fire, Death and Subjugation, that's why I don't trust either. Never trust a God small enough to fit into a Book, that's my motto ;)

There's truth to that, but the Shar'ia, which is essentially the "living" Islam, has long divided the world into two groups; the House of Islam and the House of War. The assumption was that Islam would keep fighting until they conquered the world. It did not come to pass. It does sometimes recognize a third division, the House of Truce, places which Islam did not directly control, yet. But the implicit assumption has always remained that Islam the culture and Islam the religion would one day control everything. It is perhaps to be expected, Islam fought wars very early in its existance, when the Prophet was still alive, but it has a militaristic bent to it that is totally foriegn to even the most devout follower of Christianity or Judaism, and therefore difficult to credit.

The credo of Islam ascendant over all humanity is extremely well-entrenched. It will take time and, regretably, a lot of explosives, to dig it out. Too many are True Believers in that credo, too many would use it to their own advantage to the detriment of everyone else. Too many who cannot be reasoned with, and cannot be appeased. They must be destroyed instead, for the good of Islam and the world. It would be better for Islam to police its own house, of course, much as Christianity policed its own house once upon a time (the humbling of Spain comes to mind), but it does not have the capablity to do so. The fall of the Ottoman Empire was a disaster for Islam in more than one way.
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Offline Bobboau

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
TOTALLY foriegn

Quote
Quote from: The Bible on July 14, 3006BC, 4:36:21 AM
10 When you march up to attack a city, make its people an offer of peace. 11 If they accept and open their gates, all the people in it shall be subject to forced labor and shall work for you. 12 If they refuse to make peace and they engage you in battle, lay siege to that city. 13 When the LORD your God delivers it into your hand, put to the sword all the men in it. 14 As for the women, the children, the livestock and everything else in the city, you may take these as plunder for yourselves. And you may use the plunder the LORD your God gives you from your enemies.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2006, 07:35:50 pm by Bobboau »
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Offline aldo_14

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
Name me one religion that doesn't attempt or aim to spread itself over all humanity.......

 

Offline Taristin

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
Hinduism?
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Offline Scuddie

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
agnosticism?

EDIT:  Probably any religion not a subset of Judaiaism
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Offline aldo_14

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
So all these other religions accept that their 'opposing' religions are perfectly 100% correct and cannot be in any way wrong?

 

Offline Nuclear1

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
So all these other religions accept that their 'opposing' religions are perfectly 100% correct and cannot be in any way wrong?

I'm not incredibly well-versed on religion, but I believe that Hinduism or Buddhism teach that there are many ways to enlightment/The Ultimate Goal™, but I wouldn't quote me on that.

Bear in mind that plenty of religions outside of the Abrahamic faiths (Judaism, Christianity, and Islam) don't actually worship any gods or stress importance on one pantheon; Daoism, Confucianism, Shinto, and Buddhism are more philosophies than actual religions.
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Offline achtung

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
P:  <- I can lick my eye.
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Offline Taristin

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
Swantz, cut the spam.

Nuclear: Confucianism isnt exactly a faith, but more a series of guidelines to live by...
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Offline Ace

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
So all these other religions accept that their 'opposing' religions are perfectly 100% correct and cannot be in any way wrong?

nuclear1 hit the nail on the head really.

The "Three" are interesting critters. Forceful conversion being heavilly ingrained in the dogma leads directly to their overall success. At the same time Hinduism and Buddhism are exact opposites with success being from effectively using the idea of not-forcing dogma to show their correctness. Of course Hinduism has some nasty stuff in the form of the caste system.
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Offline NGTM-1R

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
TOTALLY foriegn

Indeed. I've certainly never seen that before. I doubt any priest/rabbi/minister/reverand/what-have-you could quote it from memory. I doubt any member of St. Gregory the Great parish is familar with it at all.

In fact, in great measure you've just proved my point. By digging that deep to find a quote that suits your purposes you demonstrate a fundemental difference; you have to dig for it. It's not hard to find at all in Islamic tradition.

I'd also point out that the words of a certain Jesus Christ would contradict you, but hey... For that matter I could probably quote Psalms or other sections of the Bible at you until the cows come how at cross-purposes to your quote.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2006, 02:53:39 am by ngtm1r »
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Offline aldo_14

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
So all these other religions accept that their 'opposing' religions are perfectly 100% correct and cannot be in any way wrong?

I'm not incredibly well-versed on religion, but I believe that Hinduism or Buddhism teach that there are many ways to enlightment/The Ultimate Goal™, but I wouldn't quote me on that.

Bear in mind that plenty of religions outside of the Abrahamic faiths (Judaism, Christianity, and Islam) don't actually worship any gods or stress importance on one pantheon; Daoism, Confucianism, Shinto, and Buddhism are more philosophies than actual religions.

Buddhism did actually spring to my mind, but even that IMO places predominance upon one set of teachings / philosophies as the 'best'.

 

Offline Nuclear1

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
So all these other religions accept that their 'opposing' religions are perfectly 100% correct and cannot be in any way wrong?

I'm not incredibly well-versed on religion, but I believe that Hinduism or Buddhism teach that there are many ways to enlightment/The Ultimate Goal™, but I wouldn't quote me on that.

Bear in mind that plenty of religions outside of the Abrahamic faiths (Judaism, Christianity, and Islam) don't actually worship any gods or stress importance on one pantheon; Daoism, Confucianism, Shinto, and Buddhism are more philosophies than actual religions.

Buddhism did actually spring to my mind, but even that IMO places predominance upon one set of teachings / philosophies as the 'best'.

True, but as Ace said, only the Abrahamic faiths (particularly Christianity and Islam) particularly stress activity on the followers' parts to convert unbelievers.  Other faiths are either exclusive (see: Zoroastrianism) or don't engage in evangelism.
Spoon - I stand in awe by your flawless fredding. Truely, never before have I witnessed such magnificant display of beamz.
Axem -  I don't know what I'll do with my life now. Maybe I'll become a Nun, or take up Macrame. But where ever I go... I will remember you!
Axem - Sorry to post again when I said I was leaving for good, but something was nagging me. I don't want to say it in a way that shames the campaign but I think we can all agree it is actually.. incomplete. It is missing... Voice Acting.
Quanto - I for one would love to lend my beautiful singing voice into this wholesome project.
Nuclear1 - I want a duet.
AndrewofDoom - Make it a trio!

 

Offline aldo_14

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
True, but as Ace said, only the Abrahamic faiths (particularly Christianity and Islam) particularly stress activity on the followers' parts to convert unbelievers.  Other faiths are either exclusive (see: Zoroastrianism) or don't engage in evangelism.

Granted, yes, but my point was - or that I was trying to make - that every and any religion (and, I guess, aetheism; which isn't a religion as such) relies on an explicit assumption that it's the correct one to follow.  To me, that assumption is the important bit here; whilst other religions might not actively evangelise, certainly anyone who asks isn't going to be dissuaded, and I think the consequence of that is an implicit aim that said belief should be universal.  It just so happens that said belief aims to encourage people to come to it rather than force itself upon another, which is something I actually like (free will etc etc).

 

Offline vyper

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
Could you sum it up for us, Sarno? Don't have the available time to watch it.

Here goes. In five sentences, is that condensed enough?


1. There is a lot of hate-mongering against western world and specifically against Jewish people and USA going on in many islamic nations.

2. This is a wide-spread phenomenon induced by both religious authorities and even heads of states, and it is spread by non-independent media, which also explains why the people often buy it - they have never actually had independent media telling stuff to them, so they have weak skills in telling the fact from fiction.

3. Western world media has not yet revealed the extent of the hate-mongering going on there, but now Glenn Beck, who is NOT a journalist, has come forth to tell all the people his opinions on what is really going on in Middle East.

4. Luckily, there are also muslims who condemn the hate-mongering, terrorist actions and stuff like that.

5. The Western world needs to understand the extent of hate-mongering and act accordingly to prevent a genocide and the rise of Islamic World Order, and the most important thing to do right now would seem to be to prevent Iran from aquiring nuclear weapons technology.

This is news how?
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Offline brozozo

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
Thing is, it's easy to feel benevolent when you are well off, and easy to justify atrocities if you think it will make you better off. That's where the Second crusades came from (The first were partly defensive and partly deliberate misinterpretation of the Pope's decree).

The crusades were generally not lumped into groups. They were singular, sequential and usually spaced out by a few years, but there are a few exceptions. During the First Crusade, three smaller crusades, the People's, the German, and the Princes', took place and have been been put under the umbrella of the First Crusade.

How do you figure that the Urban II's decree was misinterpreted? I've done quite a lot of research into the Crusades, and I've never seen anyone else mention a misinterpretation of the intentions of a crusade.

 

Offline Mefustae

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
This is news how?
Indeed. If you're surprised that there are Islamic extremists over yonder in the middle-east, then you should also be ready to hear some bad news about the Titanic. :rolleyes:

 

Offline Herra Tohtori

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
What, you mean the Titanic has already left the docks?

Bummer, nobody bothered to tell me! So how did it fare? :lol:

EDIT: To unspam this message, I want to say that I was also more than little amused by this Glenn Beck's behaviour. It was like this was a whole new matter to him.

Then again, perhaps it was new to him, but I think that was nat because of lack of information available but rather lack of interest in finding out what's going on, using different sources and so on. I have no actual first-hand experience considering US media, or it's quality or lack thereof. If this matter is really as unfamiliar to US citizens as Beck seems to think, I guess it's good that this program was aired.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2006, 09:37:20 am by Herra Tohtori »
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Offline Flipside

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck

Quote
How do you figure that the Urban II's decree was misinterpreted? I've done quite a lot of research into the Crusades, and I've never seen anyone else mention a misinterpretation of the intentions of a crusade.

Because the inital decree was, iirc, to recapture Jerusalem from the Muslims, not to start a massive war of expansionism. It was an appeal to the French knightly order that rapidly turned into a exodus of a massive rabble of Knights and Peasants to 'Holy War' in the promised land.

 

Offline Gank

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Re: "Exposed", by Glenn Beck
iirc Sandwich you're an israeli settler whos living in a region taken by force from said muslims 40 years ago by a nation which believes that god has given said land to them regardless of who actually owns it. The words pot and kettle spring to mind.

Anyways programs like this but of far better quality get shown all the time of Brit TV, Channel 4 does some of the best ones:
http://www.channel4.com/culture/microsites/C/can_you_believe_it/debates/index.html