[Mongoose]

With all due respect to the users who have had trouble installing the SCP, or even finding out where they had to go to do so, I feel that some responsibility should still lie with the end-user in terms of understanding what they're getting themselves into.  Or, to put it in somewhat more of the vernacular: lurk moar.

Now, if you'll allow me a sentence or two of tangent before you jump all over me, maybe I can explain my position.  Back when I started regularly visiting my first forum, I was too socially awkward and frightened to do so much as create an account, much less start posting there myself.  In retrospect, I'm infinitely glad that I was, since it created the habits that I've successfully employed since then when visiting any new online community.  I don't jump right into things.  I poke around first, getting the lay of the land.  I skim through any FAQs or stickied posts/threads that may exist.  It's only after I feel like I have a handle on how things work that I enter into the community.  The same strategy applies when using any new program or modification, including the SCP.  Anyone who goes rushing headlong into a new piece of software without having even the slightest idea of what they're looking for is just asking for trouble.

Back when I first visited HLP, there was no convenient Installer, and I had only the slightest notion of what the SCP was.  Said SCP was in a pretty rough state at the time; the official 3.6.7 build was one of the most crash-happy executables you'd ever see, and it was an utter crap shoot as to what recent build (usually one of taylor's) was stable enough to allow you to play the game for more than one mission in a row.  The whole affair was incredibly intimidating to me as a newbie; I had no real idea of how the builds, the launcher, and these weird "media_vps" interacted, even after reading the current walkthrough at the time (and this isn't even getting into all of the loosely-scattered models and effects floating around at the time).  But did I rush in headlong anyway?  No.  I waited, and I read, and I gradually came to an understanding as to how things worked.  And when I thought I had a good enough handle on things, I went about downloading a build and the current VP set, and I eventually managed to get everything working (at least until said build inevitably crashed).

In this era of instant gratification, I feel like some people have to realize that Apple's advertising slogans are so much hot air.  Not everything computer-related is plug-and-play.  Some tasks take time, fiddling, and a bit of prior knowledge to accomplish correctly.  In the end, the SCP is an entirely fan-created, fan-run endeavor.  You guys aren't professional game developers.  The fact that some sort of user-friendly installer exists in any form is somewhat of a minor miracle.  Could it be better?  Sure; any program can.  Could the website have a somewhat better layout?  Perhaps.  But acting like all of the onus is on the community, and that the user has to do nothing at all but hit "Next" seven times to start playing, will probably wind up producing a bunch of users who will be utterly lost the first time they try to download and set up a newly-released campaign.  There's something to be said for taking your lumps early on; you'll be much better equipped to handle what comes down the line.

That's my two cents, anyway.  Feel free to place as much stock in it as you would in those Apple slogans.

[Hades]

When I joined I already had FS2 installed so I just used the installer and boom. It worked. It was easy. No problems or anything.
But we should make New User Friendliness but not to much.

[Art Kelson]

Didn´t  had problems installing FCP. I got plenty of help from Karajorma and Jr2 aftwerwards, showing me how to actually adjust all the Settings and Flags. But installing it was the most easy process. Just run the Downloader and it will install everything in it´s right place. Ok, i later had to figure out, that the Main FS2 Folder isn´t the Folder were to put the Mediavps and Mods...I think every Question gets answered sooner or later.

I totally support the "new user friendliness". The more easy your Project is to install, the more Users will download it. I´m pretty sure that lots of People didn´t get FCP yet, because of the somehow "complicatet" install process.

[Rian]

I recently installed FSO for the first time, and I found the process to be confusing and frustrating. I spent approximately a day of logged-in time exploring the forums and getting a feel for the place before even attempting to install the game, and it still took me far too long to locate the necessary information to do so. “Lurk more” would certainly not have been a useful or reasonable reply, in my case.

I did eventually locate the FAQs and the installer, but in the end I had General Battuta walk me through the process because I was disinclined to waste more time on fumbling. Not everyone is going to have that option, and I doubt that most people have that much patience, either. Not when there are so many games that don’t make new users jump through hoops first.

With FAQs and such scattered all over, it’s unclear which are the official or most up-to-date versions. Also, I don’t think people are used to looking for important site navigation buttons above the title banner. My suggestion would be to put all the relevant information in one clearly visible place, and preferably not tucked away in a forum thread. I don’t think you could call that coddling or hand-holding, and it would vastly increase user-friendliness.

[WMCoolmon]

What tutorial would you recommend? I need a little more content for the interim SCP site. An install guide would be perfect.

[Art Kelson]

With FAQs and such scattered all over, it’s unclear which are the official or most up-to-date versions.

Ok, I agree with that. It ´s really scattered and lots of Threads are not up to date. That´s why i usually follow the Links, in some of the Users Signatures...I guess it´s Colecampell, that had all the usefull Links inside his Signature ?

If nothings helping, try to PM one of the Cracks. I´m sure they do help out.

Look...http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=5928...scroll down a little and you got the most resent Version of FCP.

[Jeff Vader]

I guess it´s Colecampell, that had all the usefull Links inside his Signature ?

Hey hey hey. Me and colecampbell have an unspoken agreement with that issue. Both of us have useful links in our signatures but only a fraction of them are the same.

[Colonol Dekker]

In line with a current line of conversation. I just tend to go for the latest "official" exe release. It's the media.vps which threw me off. The faqs are fine in setting up a good whole, but the little fixes are the nuggets of gold which i had to trawl for.

[Blue Lion]

I've been here a while, I've watched the forums and seen the releases. I just decided to get the SCP to see and I found it confusing.

If you're not a coder, or even familiar with coding, figuring out what to do can be very tough.

I know a little bit of technobabble (I use that term with love ) is ok for keeping people out of the mod and coding forums with no knowledge, but just getting the game? I dunno.

For all I know I'm the dumbest person here (now everyone will know why my campaigns have no mods)

[jr2]

I spy a Goobler!!  Whatz he say?  xD  ("jr2, Goober5000 and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.")

[Polpolion]

With FAQs and such scattered all over, it’s unclear which are the official or most up-to-date versions.

The only manual install walk through that I know of is the one I typed up, which is stickied on the FS support board. We should probably move the installer threads there as well and make the board "FS support and install", because apparently "support" does not include installation help.

But yeah, generally stickied threads contain the most reputable information. It doesn't matter which one you go off of if they give redundant information, they wouldn't be stickied if they didn't work.

I really can't see how people can't find those stickied walk throughs and things. Do they not read or something?

[jr2]

Make a board called "Installation Support"?  lol  I suppose just inserting "Installation and" before "Support" would work.

[Jeff Vader]

I suppose just inserting "Installation and" before "Support" would work.

It might. It does seem that the majority of installation problem threads appear on General FreeSpace (or occasionally on Source Code Project), hmm.

[Fury]

Errr, yet another board? Installation support should belong to FreeSpace & FreeSpace Open Support if anywhere.

[Jeff Vader]

Errr, yet another board? Installation support should belong to FreeSpace & FreeSpace Open Support if anywhere.

Yah, I meant that. Expressed in a bit unclear way, I guess. Pardon.

[Polpolion]

Yeah, all I ever meant was just change the names. Sorry if I didn't make that clear.

[Fury]

I altered description of FreeSpace & FreeSpace Open Support slightly. Should do fine as long as people pause to read descriptions too.

[tinfoil]

I only started with fso about a month ago and it was confusing as hell. i got to the point where i just installed the thing by pure trial and error
also someonr should let Turey know that most noobs who knoe thier way around a computer will see the word's Open AL pop up in the installer text and assume they don't need to install it themselves. they then proceed to wonder what the **** they did wrong.

[General Battuta]

I really can't see how people can't find those stickied walk throughs and things. Do they not read or something?

It's hard for us to judge 'how people can't find [whatever's in question]' because we already know where it is. The experiences of those entering the community and trying to install FSOpen suggest that they can't find these things. It's clearly not because they're all stupid.

Perhaps it's because they have certain expectations from installing other software, even open-source software. It really does seem like it's up to us to add that extra layer of clarity and polish to the installation process.

[Polpolion]

They're stickied. They're always at the top. They're like big, permanent announcements.

I mean, where exactly do these people look for instructions? Everyone's said that they couldn't find them at all, but no one's said where they were looking. And we can't exactly put the things where the newbs look if we don't know where they look.