[ssmit132]

Not to mention they are stealth aircraft and shouldn't come under attack by enemy aircraft anyway. They would be screwed in air-to-air combat no matter how much visibility they have since they don't have the best maneuverability (well, the B-2 at least) and no anti-aircraft capability, as far as I know.

[TrashMan]

Wait, what? The F-16 Viper (pilots are not fond of the 'Fighting Falcon' nickname) is one of the most popular fighters in the world, and far more popular than the F-14.

The Tomcat never sold nearly as many. Nor was it as powerful a platform for force projection; it was a specialized heavy fighter with expensive ordinance. It was very good at its job -- carrier defense and air superiority -- but not particularly versatile.

The early version, yes. Later version become more versitale.

The F-14 was an amazing fighter - incredibly fast (faster then either the F-16, F-15 or F-18) and manuverable.

however, the era of dogfights has ended. Highly manuverable dogfighters are not needed when engagements are decided with missiles and not guns. Furthermore, as much as the Tomcats design was brilliant, it also required a bigger craft (swept wings) and was more complex, thus more expensive.
Coupled with the fact the the original F-14 modls were destroyed due to some error, it continued productions and supply with spare parts became even more expensive and difficult.

The USA army switched to newly designed multi-purpose aircraft and retiredhhte F-14. but, as anyone who flew in it can tell you, it was a legend of the sky, a plane that can still outfight and outdance practicely any fighter alive.

[BengalTiger]

Not to mention they are stealth aircraft and shouldn't come under attack by enemy aircraft anyway. They would be screwed in air-to-air combat no matter how much visibility they have since they don't have the best maneuverability (well, the B-2 at least) and no anti-aircraft capability, as far as I know.

Then there's this one bad@$$ airplane, that is stealthier than an F-117, waaay smaller than the B-2, more agile and faster than both of those, and probably all non-prototype combat aircraft in the world:



It's also the most expensive fighter on Earth, at around 140 000 000 USD a piece.

[blowfish]

Well consider the Myrmidon's visibility.  Even the Ulysses' isn't great

Anyway, I created a version of the Aurora with no cockpit struts (see this photo, it's the one farthest back), but no one seemed to like it...

[StarSlayer]

Is the plane invisible because it's stealthy or because the government is going to cut production?



...or is it Wonder Womans?

[Woolie Wool]

Well consider the Myrmidon's visibility.  Even the Ulysses' isn't great

Anyway, I created a version of the Aurora with no cockpit struts (see this photo, it's the one farthest back), but no one seemed to like it...

You could try keeping the vertical strut that wraps around the top of the canopy like a ring while removing the one that goes backwards from the ring to the main body and obstructs the pilot's view. Or you can say "**** it" and accept that FS is governed by the Rule of Cool.

[General Battuta]

Wait, what? The F-16 Viper (pilots are not fond of the 'Fighting Falcon' nickname) is one of the most popular fighters in the world, and far more popular than the F-14.

The Tomcat never sold nearly as many. Nor was it as powerful a platform for force projection; it was a specialized heavy fighter with expensive ordinance. It was very good at its job -- carrier defense and air superiority -- but not particularly versatile.

The early version, yes. Later version become more versitale.

The F-14 was an amazing fighter - incredibly fast (faster then either the F-16, F-15 or F-18) and manuverable.

however, the era of dogfights has ended. Highly manuverable dogfighters are not needed when engagements are decided with missiles and not guns. Furthermore, as much as the Tomcats design was brilliant, it also required a bigger craft (swept wings) and was more complex, thus more expensive.
Coupled with the fact the the original F-14 modls were destroyed due to some error, it continued productions and supply with spare parts became even more expensive and difficult.

The USA army switched to newly designed multi-purpose aircraft and retiredhhte F-14. but, as anyone who flew in it can tell you, it was a legend of the sky, a plane that can still outfight and outdance practicely any fighter alive.

Heheh, people have been saying 'the era of dogfights has ended' since Korea and Vietnam, and it never does.

Like I said, almost all engagements end up in visual-range ACM where cannon and IR-guided missiles are important.

The F-14 wasn't an awful dogfighter, but it was way too big and clumsy to out-turn nimbler combatants, and it didn't have any real edge in high-alpha engagements near the stall limit.

[BengalTiger]

Let's begin with the fact the F-14 was heavy, with a max T/O mass of 33,720 kg and 19,838 kg empty.

For example the F-15's max is 30,845 kg and 12,700 kg empty, F-16's is 19,200 kg full and 12,000 kg empty, Su-27: 33,000 kg full and 16,380 kg empty, and MiG-29: 21,000 kg and 11,000 kg respectively, and uhhh...


F-22: 38,000 kg max, 19,700 kg empty (yup, it's a heavy @$$ fighter, makes it's 9+ G and supercruise even more impressive)

[ShadowGorrath]

Can you shut up and continue this off-topicness someplace else, please? I want to see pretty FS pictures, not a nerdy discussion on fighter stats.

[General Battuta]

Sounds good.

For the sake of cleanliness maybe we should split those posts.

[Mongoose]

Dammit, people, stop making me do work.  I enjoy being lazy.

[S-99]

Vasudan craft and terran craft with vasudan design have those forward facing cockpits. Vasudan cockpits like this aren't bad, you can actually look down with them. As opposed to terran craft where you can only look forward, up, and side to side.

[blowfish]

Seth? Tauret? Serapis? Horus?

I can only think of a few Vasudan craft where you can actually look down, and even then, the view is limited..

[ssmit132]

Not to mention they are stealth aircraft and shouldn't come under attack by enemy aircraft anyway. They would be screwed in air-to-air combat no matter how much visibility they have since they don't have the best maneuverability (well, the B-2 at least) and no anti-aircraft capability, as far as I know.

Then there's this one bad@$$ airplane, that is stealthier than an F-117, waaay smaller than the B-2, more agile and faster than both of those, and probably all non-prototype combat aircraft in the world:



It's also the most expensive fighter on Earth, at around 140 000 000 USD a piece.

Okay, correction, stealth bombers.

[S-99]

Seth? Tauret? Serapis? Horus?

I can only think of a few Vasudan craft where you can actually look down, and even then, the view is limited..

Yeah not many people understood that too well. The typical vasudan cockpit is forward viewing, but not all of their fighters and bombers are like that. In fact for vasudan ships not having the forward facing cockpit we don't know how the vasudan sits inside.

[Androgeos Exeunt]

Perhaps they fly lying down?

[BengalTiger]

Isn't the Serapis too small (flat) for a Vasudan flying in any other position?

[Androgeos Exeunt]

Which might explain why they tend to die quite a lot flying those things.

[BengalTiger]

Maybe...

What about the Pegasus- that pilot would fit better if he/she/it was laying down on his/her/it's back...

[Snail]

Heheh, people have been saying 'the era of dogfights has ended' since Korea and Vietnam, and it never does.

You can rest assured however that by 2367 the age of dogfights HAS ended, at least for interceptors. Trebuchets down Seraphims better than any Perseus ever could.