Author Topic: Dawn of War 2  (Read 9084 times)

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Offline Axem

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Anyone who enjoys turtling and entrenching themselves in DoW1 will hate DoW2. But personally I like the direction they're going. As little research and building as possible, just managing your troops and their actions. More of a World in Conflict sort of deal.

The biggest problem I have with DoW2 is the speed the enemy can cap/uncap your points. If they manage to get one unit past your troops, they can just uncap a point and by time you get there, they've already started uncapping the next. Frustrating to say the least.

 

Offline Stormkeeper

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Dawn of War 2! Mostly because I'm addicted to it. But the gameplay is very fun. No way of turtling (that I've seen yet), and a lot of emphasis on managing your soldiers. The single player campaign and its characters are also very well done, and you tend to get especially attached to your merry band of Blood Ravens. You also find out during the campaign what happend to Captains Boreale and Davian Thule, of Soulstorm and Dark Crusade fame respectively. Oh, and Gabriel Angelos of the original Dawn of War.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2009, 02:21:39 am by Fury »
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Offline General Battuta

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Dawn of War 2! Mostly because I'm addicted to it. But the gameplay is very fun. No way of turtling (that I've seen yet), and a lot of emphasis on managing your soldiers. The single player campaign and its characters are also very well done, and you tend to get especially attached to your merry band of Blood Ravens. You also find out during the campaign what happend to Captains Boreale and Davian Thule, of Soulstorm and Dark Crusade fame respectively. Oh, and Gabriel Angelos of the original Dawn of War.

On the other hand, it's damn repetitive and kind of shallow. I enjoyed the beta a bit, but it was odd that a game called Dawn of War seemed to reward avoiding conflict by sneaking around to grab unguarded control points.

Seems like it's getting mixed reactions.

 

Offline Axem

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Well I'd say its better than "lets see who can build more turrets" :p

But I would say sneaking around is a valid tactic. Though if you're abandoning victory points to go chase off small fry uncapping your points, you're just asking the game to drag out.

However campaign mode is where the game shines with RPG style leveling and equipment, and the requirement to use tactics rather than "I'll send 100 SMs in and win". You only get to commit your Force Commander and 4 units, so you need to play smart.

But the weakest point is the whole Games for Windows Live thing. Takes 10 minutes to matchmake a game for you (which more commonly ranks you with people 3 "levels" higher than you) and requires you to sign in for both steam and live. WTF? Seriously, I don't mind signing into one account to play online, but two?

 
The campaign is your force commander and 3 units, not 4.

It's main problem is that your tactics are extremely limited by how few pieces you have, and ultimate, the activated skills are nearly entirely what determines the battle.  It's pure micromanagement, and there's no AI assistance.

DoW2 essentially trades the issues of RTSes for the issues of real time RPGs.  It's a sidegrade, not an upgrade.

 

Offline Fury

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Having played DoW2 since Monday, I'm having mixed feelings.

+ The gameplay is different from the typical RTS, more tactical and unit-focused.
+ RPG elements.
+ You only have limited number of units at disposal.
+ No base building.
+ Unit customization.

- Fallen units are perhaps too easy to replace on the field as long as one unit remains to revive the rest, then you can reinforce squads again.
- Full micromanagement during pause is not possible. Some commands, like attack move can be set during pause, but grenade throw or assault jump cannot.
- No saving game during missions. Then again, if all units fall you get emergency extract and try again. The only thing you lose is one day, which so far has only meant missing an optional mission or two.
- No squad customization, only leaders can be customized.
- Linear story even if there are optional missions.

I don't think DoW2 is a bad game, it certainly does have a lot of potential. I hope expansions will improve on these shortcomings. However, so far I am enjoying DoW2 as is. Boredom hasn't kicked in while playing yet at least.

 
I'm playing the dow2 campaign and i think it rocks !
My only issue for now with the game is the multiplayer...
I feel, it's too different from the campaign, i'd rather prefer a multiplayer mode where you don't have to build unit on the battleground but have to spend "armu point" before the battle like we use to do with dark omen for exemple.
It would be closer to the campaign and to the tabletop.

A 4 player /8 squads coop campaign would be awesome too.
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Offline NGTM-1R

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I can't get DoW2. Nobody here was stocking it on release day (my friggin' birthday), so I had to settle for Kane's Wrath and RA3 instead.
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Offline Stormkeeper

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I finished it's (DoW 2) single player campaign. Its not bad. It did get a bit tedious towards the end, combating units much, much more powerful than my own. But the loot was worth it. I like how the game actually makes SMs seem like SMs, i.e using a single squad to conquer a world and all that. You really have to learn to use your abilities and cover effectively to play well. And I'm pretty amused by the sight of my Force Commander standing behind heavy cover and belting out heavy bolter rounds.

Some things that really surprised me, but are spoilers...

Spoiler:
That whatever was contained in the relic site on Kronus really seems to alude to the fact that the Blood Ravens are indeed descended from one of the Traitor Legions, most likely the Word Bearers, because of what Eliphas says to Davian Thule if you attack his capital in Dark Crusade. Also, I got somewhat upset that Davian got carved up by the Tyranid Warrior, but was damn happy when he returned as a Dreadnought.

I was also kinda happy that the aristocratic S.O.B Boreale got killed during the Kaurava campaign. Though I wonder who won it. The Blood Ravens won the Kronus crusade, btw.
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I kind of thought the Force Commander was useless.  He's real short on useful abilities.

Now, the dreadnought....that was useful.  And once you get inventory from cloak, the scout becomes evil. 

 

Offline Stormkeeper

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I kind of thought the Force Commander was useless.  He's real short on useful abilities.
S'why I tossed him a heavy bolter. Previously I used him to 'hold' enemy commanders while my other forces blasted away, but that's kinda impossible now .......

Although; when you build up his melee/ranged tree, he has a chance to OHKO any regular unit.
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I've been trying a second run through, and made my force commander use a heavy bolter.  Unfortunately, he seems even less useful there - slow to start firing, guns really don't do that much damage - and he lacks focus fire, which is the main reason Tarkus is effective at pinning enemies down.  It's practically instant suppression.

I'm holding on to the hope that a flamethrower will at least make him useful against swarms - those did seem to make the little 'nids die pretty fast, but I haven't found one yet.


Wish I had a baneblade though.




 

Offline Stormkeeper

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I wished I had a Baneblade too. But I got
Spoiler:
Davian Thule with an assault cannon
, which was the next best thing, especially when you strafe the 'nids.
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Offline Fury

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I don't know why you think FC sucks at melee, I made mine a melee specialist and he works very well along with Thaddeus' squad. I always equipped my FC with a battle standard, the rally ability is invaluable because it heals nearby units and breaks suppression. The healing especially was too good to replace.

I completed the campaign today. It was good enough but there weren't that many different level layouts, so it got a wee bit repetitive in the end when you went and defended that damn shrine for tenth time.

Spoiler:
I didn't use Thule dreadnought at all unless he was scripted in. In the end I have three squads of terminators and force commander wreaking havoc. In the Last Stand mission he kinda felt useless even though he was properly equipped and was only a few levels behind. Termies ftw. I wonder if there was fourth terminator armor somewhere, my FC felt kinda left out...

 

Offline Stormkeeper

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Spoiler:
No, there isn't. And Termie armour kinda destroys the cover so ... And I think if you max out Thule's ranged discipline, he's quite useful for strafing the hordes of Tyranids in the last mission, as long as you pair it with a good assault cannon.

It felt real good seeing Gabriel Angelos; the last boss battle was a breeze thanks to him. And I kinda went wtf at his company of Space Marines. I mean; level 30? 17000+ health? And the level cap is 20, btw.

=edit=
By 'strafe' I meant the ranged ability that he gets once you up his discipline enough, and if he has an A/C equipped. I think Avitus is useless as a Termie, cause you essentially lose three heavy bolters for a single assault cannon, which Thule can substitute for in a pinch and do just as well if not better.
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Offline Fury

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Spoiler:
Why would termies need cover in the first place? :D Also, it was so easy to replace fallen units at the next reinforcement point that using cover felt like it was slowing down progress...

But I agree with you that Avitus' squad needs a weapons upgrade, they're supposed to be the heavy weapons squad after all. Currently Tarkus' and Avitus' squads are identical except for their leaders.

It would seem that end-game non-terminator weapons and armor are far superior to their terminator counterparts. What terminator armor gives, is for ranged units better melee ability as well as suppression and knockdown immunity. Those aren't that big deal IMHO, so unless terminator armors gets some improvements in a future patch, I probably won't use termies the next time I play the campaign.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2009, 01:48:29 am by Fury »

 

Offline Stormkeeper

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Spoiler:
Right about that, the Termies. On all counts. :D

I know what you mean about the gear; the Armour of the Patriach, which my FC was using, was frigging powerful. Not to mention it looked really cool. All golden finishes and stuff. And it was ridiculous that the weapons my FC was using at the end was a regular master-crafted chainsword and bolt pistol. And his damage was off the charts. I just wished I'd found a master-crafter powersword. Having an FC with non-shining weapons seems weird ....
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Offline NGTM-1R

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Spoiler:
It felt real good seeing Gabriel Angelos; the last boss battle was a breeze thanks to him. And I kinda went wtf at his company of Space Marines. I mean; level 30? 17000+ health? And the level cap is 20, btw.

Spoiler:
Well, if it was First Company, they're sort of like that.

One of my big reservations, having even only played a few levels, was that there's one glaring problem with this. You don't win campaigns against Tyranids on the ground. You don't. All the fluff indicates you have to beat them in space first before you can stop them on the ground. So unless somewhere in the background the Litany of Fury is putting in some serious overtime this whole thing smells a little funny.

Also, I have to ask: Land Raiders? Anywhere? It's not the same without a Super Jackhammer Carrier Tank. :p
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Offline Fury

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Spoiler:
I'm not all to familiar with Warhammer fluff (odd word btw), but I think it was well enough explained why the Hive was a bit on the weak side. It was only in a passing, so it is easy to miss if you don't pay attention to what Cyrus (I think it was Cyrus... maybe) says.

Spoiler:
If you used Dreadnought, what were the other two squads you took with you to the missions? And did you equip the dread with ranged weaponry?

Because my experience with W40k is pretty much restricted to the Dawn of War series, would it be feasible to create a TC based on W40k universe?
« Last Edit: March 01, 2009, 06:35:56 am by Fury »

 

Offline NGTM-1R

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Because my experience with W40k is pretty much restricted to the Dawn of War series, would it be feasible to create a TC based on W40k universe?

Maybe.

I'm familar with the 40k fleet-based game, Battlefleet Gothic. (Familar, he says, when he has most of the rulebooks.) The problem is that Gothic is two things that the FS engine is not going to like. It's overgreebled to the point your graphics card will beg for mercy loading a small capital ship. And it's focused in the exact opposite direction. Gothic centers on capital ship combat, and engaging, much less destroying, even an Escort-class ship in Gothic with a single fighter or bomber is simply not possible. It takes whole squadrons.

Nonetheless, there is scope for a fighter-based game, but it would be better in an engine designed for atmospheric flight where the behemoths of Gothic can't come down to play.
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