Author Topic: Vaccinations  (Read 8465 times)

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Offline Kosh

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Quote
Government tells me what to do since "its for my own good".


The government tells you to do many things for your own good. Take for example forced vaccinations, are you saying they shouldn't be mandatory?
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Offline Bobboau

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Offline High Max

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« Last Edit: January 04, 2010, 04:14:16 am by High Max »
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Offline Blue Lion

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Agreed because they can harm you. At least in the past they had mercury as a perservative. Vaccines have been linked to mental disorders, they say, and I believe it. Not only that but vaccines are the virus but modified. It should be a choice whether or not to take the risk of getting vaccine shots. It does worry me.

What mental disorders do vaccines lead to?

 

Offline High Max

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« Last Edit: January 04, 2010, 04:14:27 am by High Max »
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Offline Blue Lion

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Austism and other things. I guess I will look up stuff to back up the story. Anything that heavy metals can do to you. Brain damage.

Edit: http://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/ Of course I have reasons for knowing it can cause problems even if it says there has been no evidence. I don't want to talk about certain things.

Here's more: http://www.shirleys-wellness-cafe.com/vaccines.htm

From the very first link you provided, bolded for easy reading.

MMR Vaccine Safety Research

Many carefully performed scientific studies have found no link between MMR vaccine and autism. These studies include:

    * A September 2008 case-control study published in Public Library of Science (PLoS) was conducted in 2004-2008 to determine whether results from an earlier study that claimed to find measles virus RNA in the intestinal tissue of a specific group of autistic children could be confirmed. The results could not be confirmed, and no link between MMR and autism was found.

    * An April 2006 study conducted by the National Institute of Child Health and Human Development (NICHD) of NIH and the CDC assessed data from 351 children with autism spectrum disorders and 31 typically-developing children. The study did not find a link between MMR vaccination and autism. The results were pubished in the Journal of Autism and Developmental Disorders.

    * A February 2004 case-control study examined the possible relationship between exposure to the MMR vaccine and autism in Atlanta, Georgia. The results were published in Pediatrics.

    * A November 2002 study by CDC and the Danish Medical Research Council that followed more than 500,000 children over 7 years and found no association between MMR vaccination and autism. The results were published in the New England Journal of Medicine.

Because signs of autism may appear around the same time children receive the MMR vaccine, some parents may worry that the vaccine causes autism. Vaccine safety experts, including experts at CDC and the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP), agree that MMR vaccine is not responsible for recent increases in the number of children with autism. In 2004, a report by the Institute of Medicine (IOM) concluded that there is no link between autism and MMR vaccine, and that there is no link between autism and vaccines that contain thimerosal as a preservative.

 

Offline High Max

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« Last Edit: January 04, 2010, 04:14:53 am by High Max »
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Offline Bobboau

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I don't care if someone thinks they lead to a pixy infestation of the liver, the most fundamental tenant of my philosophy is you own yourself. the government has no right to force you to do anything to your body, it has no right to tell you what you an and can not do with your body, what you will and will not put in your body, the government exists to serve the people, the people are not some sort of livestock.
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Offline High Max

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« Last Edit: January 04, 2010, 04:15:19 am by High Max »
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Offline Blue Lion

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I don't care if someone thinks they lead to a pixy infestation of the liver, the most fundamental tenant of my philosophy is you own yourself. the government has no right to force you to do anything to your body, it has no right to tell you what you an and can not do with your body, what you will and will not put in your body, the government exists to serve the people, the people are not some sort of livestock.

I don't think you want to hear MY philosophy!

What about the ramifications if you lose the gamble?

 

Offline Blue Lion

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But sadly they force us to get these shots as young children in order to go to school.

Or there would be massive outbreaks of diseases. They didn't just say "Ah ha! If we force them when they're young, they can't say no! We'll make it a requirement of going to school!

The government doesn't want giant disruptions that this would cause if kids didn't get vaccinated.

I don't like it either and I feel anger towards it. It really worries me. If I had a kid, I would be scared to give him/her a vaccine if they still have mercury and stuff in them.

Do most vaccines even have it in there?

I was under the impression that

A. They weren't in many anymore

and

B. There was still no definitive results that it was the cause of a massive infection/injury.

 

Offline High Max

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« Last Edit: January 04, 2010, 04:16:13 am by High Max »
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Offline Blue Lion

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I hear the flu shot still has it. Of course that shot isn't necessary and I would never get it and it doesn't keep you immune for long. It is common sense that mercury will hurt you since it doesn't go well with humans. What mercury does is when it enters your body, it stays in certain tissues and may never leave them. I guess green tea and other remedies can clean these heavy metals out if you drink enough of it, but that isn't an option if you are so young and kids can't drink that stuff. Actually, mercury doesn't cause brain damage but it sits in tissues like your brain and that can cause neurons to be blocked and electrical signals as well. That can cause diseases and conditions to develop, like Alzheimer’s. I believe that is one cause of Alzheimer’s.

That is what poison does and how it hurt you. It blocks blood flow, electrical signals, or the flow of other necessary things in your body that are vital to keeping you alive, as far as I know. Poisons might do more than that; I'm not sure.

http://www.fda.gov/cber/vaccine/thimerosal.htm

Selections. Again, bolded for quick points.

Over the past several years, because of an increasing awareness of the theoretical potential for neurotoxicity of even low levels of organomercurials and because of the increased number of thimerosal containing vaccines that had been added to the infant immunization schedule, concerns about the use of thimerosal in vaccines and other products have been raised. Indeed, because of these concerns, the Food and Drug Administration has worked with, and continues to work with, vaccine manufacturers to reduce or eliminate thimerosal from vaccines.

Thimerosal has been removed from or reduced to trace amounts in all vaccines routinely recommended for children 6 years of age and younger, with the exception of inactivated influenza vaccine (see Table 1). A preservative-free version of the inactivated influenza vaccine (contains trace amounts of thimerosal) is available in limited supply at this time for use in infants, children and pregnant women. Some vaccines such as Td, which is indicated for older children (≥ 7 years of age) and adults, are also now available in formulations that are free of thimerosal or contain only trace amounts. Vaccines with trace amounts of thimerosal contain 1 microgram or less of mercury per dose.

Guidelines on Exposure to Organomercurials

Mercury is an element that is dispersed widely around the earth. Most of the mercury in the water, soil, plants and animals is found as inorganic mercury salts. Mercury accumulates in the aquatic food chain, primarily in the form of the methylmercury, an organomercurial. Organic forms of mercury are more easily absorbed when ingested and are less readily eliminated from the body than are inorganic forms of mercury. Humans are exposed to methylmercury primarily from the consumption of seafood (Mahaffey et al. 1997).

Basic sum up

1. The concern is theoretical. I assume there is no definitive study that shows direct causation of what you're talking about.

2. Even because of theoretical concerns, it is no longer on vaccines required for children under 6.

3. The compounds in these vaccines are found in nature and are at least tolerable at low levels. Exposure to these compounds will not kill you outright. it would require a large amount it. If vaccines carried the amount large enough to kill kids, they'd be dying of mercury poisoning left and right. They aren't.

 

Offline Bobboau

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I don't think you want to hear MY philosophy!

What about the ramifications if you lose the gamble?

then you and everyone you convinced to go along with you will become sick and incur the risks and expenses associated with that.
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DEUTERONOMY 22:11
Thou shalt not wear a garment of diverse sorts, [as] of woollen and linen together

 

Offline Blue Lion

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I don't think you want to hear MY philosophy!

What about the ramifications if you lose the gamble?

then you and everyone you convinced to go along with you will become sick and incur the risks and expenses associated with that.

And then society incurs the risks and expenses associated with those people being sick.

 

Offline karajorma

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then you and everyone you convinced to go along with you will become sick and incur the risks and expenses associated with that.

Not just you though. Once the vaccination rate goes below a certain amount you start getting outbreaks which do affect those who have been vaccinated against the disease.

Not vaccinating yourself does create a risk to people who have been vaccinated. It's not quite as simple as you make out.


As for the autism from MMR nonsense, the paper that claimed that been widely discredited and the doctor who wrote it struck off. It's also worth pointing out that he owned a significant number of shares in the company who made a rival vaccination, sales of which rocketed after the paper came out.
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Offline Bobboau

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isn't the point of a vaccine to make you immune? if so then even if there is an outbreak then the people vacinated should be at least in a considerably better shape then those who are not. but the fact that there is not a huge outcry against this suggests most people would take the vaccination even without government forcing it. if a few people want to be different why must they be crushed by the almighty all correct government?

it only becomes an issue if you have a socialized health care system, which is why I am opposed to that in my country.
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DEUTERONOMY 22:11
Thou shalt not wear a garment of diverse sorts, [as] of woollen and linen together

 

Offline Blue Lion

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isn't the point of a vaccine to make you immune? if so then even if there is an outbreak then the people vacinated should be at least in a considerably better shape then those who are not. but the fact that there is not a huge outcry against this suggests most people would take the vaccination even without government forcing it. if a few people want to be different why must they be crushed by the almighty all correct government?

it only becomes an issue if you have a socialized health care system, which is why I am opposed to that in my country.

Because the health care system (socialized or not) has to spend time and resources on it, and society as a whole has to pick up the slack when these people get whatever they skipped in vaccines.


 

Offline Bobboau

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in private health care you pay for you treatment. you reimburse the heathcare providers for there time and effort with money you produced with your time and effort. you buy treatment, or not if you don't want to (risk dieing).
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DEUTERONOMY 22:11
Thou shalt not wear a garment of diverse sorts, [as] of woollen and linen together

 

Offline karajorma

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Yeah but if that's the way you want to run with it you could sue anyone who is unvaccinated if you caught the disease off them. After all it was their recklessness that resulted in you getting sick after all.
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