[General Battuta]

It's just not a very interesting explanation.

[Fury]

I don't know what happens after TNG, but I'm curious about some tidbits in this topic.
- How did the Romulans gain access to Borg technology? What of Federation?
- What happened to the Borgs?
- What is Android B-4 and how can Data still be alive after what happened in Nemesis? The "evil copy" did not have Data's memories or personality.
- How the hell is Spock even still alive? How old do Vulcans live?

[Dark Knight]

I don't know what happens after TNG, but I'm curious about some tidbits in this topic.
- How did the Romulans gain access to Borg technology? What of Federation?

By now everyone has a little bit of Borg tech. The Fed has Seven of Nine working in the Daystrum institute. How the Romulans got it too isn't explained but I'd guess through a mixture of spying and salvaging battle sights.

- What happened to the Borgs?

At the end of Voyager they were cut off from Federation Space when the Voy destroyed their transit system. They're probably still rebuilding it.

- What is Android B-4 and how can Data still be alive after what happened in Nemesis? The "evil copy" did not have Data's memories or personality.

B4 is the droid from Nemesis. During the film, Data transfers a copy of his memory into the machine in order for b4 to learn how to be a "person." It doesn't work at first. But in the final scene of Nem, Data's memories begin to surface and b4 begins humming the song Data sung at the wedding. Sometime later, La Forge upgrades B4's positronic brain to the same level as Data's, causing the Data personality to surface and be reborn. This info comes from the Star Trek Online history entries which according to CBS is canon, and since CBS own Star Trek this is the way it is.

- How the hell is Spock even still alive? How old do Vulcans live?

A few hundred years. Hell both him and his dad appeared in Next Generation... even humans get a sweet health care package in star trek. Doctor McCoy lived long enough to appear in the TNG pilot, and Archer from Enterprise was an Admiral in Star Trek 09. But yeah, Vulcans live a damn long time, so do Klingons for that matter.

[NGTM-1R]

DS9 showed that humans can live active lives well past 100 with Federation technology. Sisko's dad was running a restaurant at 120something IIRC.

[Fury]

By now everyone has a little bit of Borg tech. The Fed has Seven of Nine working in the Daystrum institute. How the Romulans got it too isn't explained but I'd guess through a mixture of spying and salvaging battle sights.

What kind of ships the Feds have at this time? Was the Narada a borg-hybrid from the get-go or did it become one after Nero salvaged one of their secret bases to equip Narada?

[Mikes]

A slow death definitely looks better than the flashy kind.

Well technically there is no reason why you can't have it both ways...   dismantle it bit by bit, but with a big bang at the end as containment of Antimatter or whateveer other dangerous materials (TM) fails

[Dark Knight]

The Narada was a simple mining ship and actually quite a small one. Nero didn't salvage the tech, after rescuing then threatening the Romulan Ruling council for information before spacing them he discovered the location of the secret romulan base. The base had no ships and an equally vengeance driven sub-commander outfitted his ship with the experimental borg tech, it then grew to its final size over several months, i'm guessing as it consumed and assimilated the wreckage of several federation and klingon fleets.

[karajorma]

This just gets worse the more I hear about it.

It's not that hard to believe that a post TNG Romulan warship could beat even a fleet of Fed warship from the TOS era. Hell we've basically seen that sort of thing in the episode In a Mirror, Darkly. So why the writers felt the need to wank off a borg tech equipped mining vessel is beyond me.

[Rhymes]

Maybe to explain the look?  Romulan ship design is sleek, but the Narada's a gigantic mass of spikes.  That seems a bit more Borg-like than Romulan-like.

[Fenrir]

It looked Shivan-like to me. 

[Ford Prefect]

Any real attempt at incorporating what happens in this movie into the rest of the Star Trek canon offends my sensibilities. This movie was so much better than anything else produced under the name "Star Trek," my face almost melted in the theater. (I've seen it twice already and I would probably see it a third time.) J. J. Abrams achieved this masterpiece of entertainment by looking at the jumbled mess of nerd fodder that the Star Trek universe had become, and digging out the seed of a good idea. And as a result, I found myself loving this movie solely for its own sheer awesomeness, and not for how it references a stale, outdated canon.

[butter_pat_head]

Any real attempt at incorporating what happens in this movie into the rest of the Star Trek canon offends my sensibilities. This movie was so much better than anything else produced under the name "Star Trek,"

Surely you aren't suggesting it's better than The Wrath of Khan?  'Cause that be some rather dangerous territory you be steppin' into.

[Ford Prefect]

Yes. Yes, I am. Star Trek was dated and moldy, and the previous films all insisted on tip-toeing around an outdated attitude instead of allowing the concept to evolve. It took someone who wasn't burdened by reverence for the canon to make it relevant and exciting again. Don't get me wrong; I was raised on TNG and I enjoy some of the movies, but this was the only Star Trek movie that kicked ass just as a movie, and not as a Star Trek museum piece. It's so far out of the league of everything before it, I personally don't see how there's even any contest.

[Rhymes]

I think trying to compare them is pointless.  Star Trek '09 is a reimagined, redefined story that takes the original premise and goes in an entirely different direction with it than the rest of Star Trek.  There's just so many differences between regular Trek and this that they really don't even fall into the same category.  It's like trying to compare the original Battlestar Galactica with the new one; they're just so different that any comparison is patently impossible.

[karajorma]

Yes. Yes, I am. Star Trek was dated and moldy, and the previous films all insisted on tip-toeing around an outdated attitude instead of allowing the concept to evolve. It took someone who wasn't burdened by reverence for the canon to make it relevant and exciting again. Don't get me wrong; I was raised on TNG and I enjoy some of the movies, but this was the only Star Trek movie that kicked ass just as a movie, and not as a Star Trek museum piece. It's so far out of the league of everything before it, I personally don't see how there's even any contest.

I'm sorry but I have to disagree with you completely. The movie relies on our familiarity with TOS. If you could actually find someone who had never heard of Trek and knew nothing about it they'd probably find the movie a jumbled mess. Characters are introduced with very little explanation or backstory because we're already supposed to know who they are.

I didn't mind the movie but that's precisely because I knew what came before it.

[Ford Prefect]

I'm sorry but I have to disagree with you completely. The movie relies on our familiarity with TOS. If you could actually find someone who had never heard of Trek and knew nothing about it they'd probably find the movie a jumbled mess. Characters are introduced with very little explanation or backstory because we're already supposed to know who they are.

I didn't mind the movie but that's precisely because I knew what came before it.

I have plenty of friends who've never watched Star Trek in their lives and who thought this was one of the most exciting movies they've seen in ages. The reason it works is because the original Star Trek has become such a deeply ingrained cultural icon that one really only needs not to live under a rock to catch enough of the references. If they attempted the same thing with a more obscure show, familiarity would be more of an issue.

I think trying to compare them is pointless.  Star Trek '09 is a reimagined, redefined story that takes the original premise and goes in an entirely different direction with it than the rest of Star Trek.  There's just so many differences between regular Trek and this that they really don't even fall into the same category.  It's like trying to compare the original Battlestar Galactica with the new one; they're just so different that any comparison is patently impossible.

I can compare the old and new BSGs; the old one was terrible and the new one was one of the greatest television shows of all time. I wouldn't go that far with Star Trek, but I still think J. J. Abrams' take on it is better than the other movies.

[karajorma]

I have plenty of friends who've never watched Star Trek in their lives and who thought this was one of the most exciting movies they've seen in ages. The reason it works is because the original Star Trek has become such a deeply ingrained cultural icon that one really only needs not to live under a rock to catch enough of the references. If they attempted the same thing with a more obscure show, familiarity would be more of an issue.

Which is why I said it would require finding someone who didn't know Trek. They do exist you know.

The same applies to Wrath of Khan though. Sure people who haven't seen the show won't know the backstory with Khan but how much do you need to know that wasn't explained by Khan anyway?

[Ford Prefect]

Which is why I said it would require finding someone who didn't know Trek. They do exist you know.

The same applies to Wrath of Khan though. Sure people who haven't seen the show won't know the backstory with Khan but how much do you need to know that wasn't explained by Khan anyway?

Oh I certainly agree that plot accessibility is not a feature unique to this new movie, but what's changed is that J. J. Abrams didn't pander to the loyal Star Trek fan base that expects every installment to emulate the campiness of the original series, whose polished, pristine aesthetic of the future is really a product of its time. Kahn might be understandable to someone who doesn't know the back story, but I think its stiltedness probably won't be, considering that even some of us who do know Star Trek find it irritating. Just by incorporating the little details of speech and environment that we've come to expect from any compelling universe, futuristic or otherwise, this movie made itself fully accessible to the general public, and to those of us who would like a little maturity in our science fiction.

[karajorma]

Sorry but again I've got to disagree with you there. While the movie might have been a certain kind of brainless fun, as a movie it does hang together rather poorly on a number of elements. I wouldn't call it mature. And I suspect it will age a hell of a lot more quickly than Wrath of Khan did.

[Mikes]

I can compare the old and new BSGs; the old one was terrible and the new one was one of the greatest television shows of all time. I wouldn't go that far with Star Trek, but I still think J. J. Abrams' take on it is better than the other movies.

The reason the new BSG is going so strong and appeals to such a broad audience (and even people who never watched sci-fi before) however is the elaborate drama played out by believable characters.
It delivers a storyline that is both coherent and consistent within the universe they created and which is coincidentially something the new Star Trek movie simply does not have at all.

The new Star Trek movie features a plot with several Starship sized holes in it that largely gets propelled forward by ridiculous coincidences and leaps of faith. How good or bad the previous Star-Trek movies were, really has no relevance either: You don't have to have seen another Star-Trek movie or any other Science Fiction movie to realize that this new movie is cheap action cinema that doesn't even try to make sense and hopes everyone is too distracted by the flashy effects and action sequences to take offense lol.

As far as J.J. Abrams goes... i enjoyed Alias a lot. Lost... not so much. But i would consider either show in a totally different ballpark than this POS new Star Trek movie of his lol.