Author Topic: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)  (Read 53380 times)

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Offline Turambar

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)

Fair enough.
But person B has no say in the matter, no ill intent and no control over the situation whatsoever.

person B cannot think.
10:55:48   TurambarBlade: i've been selecting my generals based on how much i like their hats
10:55:55   HerraTohtori: me too!
10:56:01   HerraTohtori: :D

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
That's also a fair point, and a reason why contraception is so important.

I really do keep thinking about the fact that so many human pregnancies abort naturally as a justification of sorts. I'm not sure it really is, but somehow it makes me more comfortable with early abortions.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2009, 03:39:22 pm by General Battuta »

 

Offline iamzack

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
It's not most, it's more like 25%.

Anyway, I wasn't talking about intent, Trashman. Just the barest facts of the circumstance.
WE ARE HARD LIGHT PRODUCTIONS. YOU WILL LOWER YOUR FIREWALLS AND SURRENDER YOUR KEYBOARDS. WE WILL ADD YOUR INTELLECTUAL AND VERNACULAR DISTINCTIVENESS TO OUR OWN. YOUR FORUMS WILL ADAPT TO SERVICE US. RESISTANCE IS FUTILE.

 

Offline Turambar

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
oh, my bad.  I thought "person B" was the fetus

whatever, guys make more sperm, the world goes on.
10:55:48   TurambarBlade: i've been selecting my generals based on how much i like their hats
10:55:55   HerraTohtori: me too!
10:56:01   HerraTohtori: :D

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
It's not most, it's more like 25%.

Anyway, I wasn't talking about intent, Trashman. Just the barest facts of the circumstance.

Not the figure I've heard...but I may be misremembering.

  

Offline iamzack

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
25% is the figure I hear all the time, of pregnancies that end in miscarriage.

Wikipedia says 25% of pregnancies miscarry by the 6 week mark, so maybe that's it.

Person B is the fetus, fluffy.
WE ARE HARD LIGHT PRODUCTIONS. YOU WILL LOWER YOUR FIREWALLS AND SURRENDER YOUR KEYBOARDS. WE WILL ADD YOUR INTELLECTUAL AND VERNACULAR DISTINCTIVENESS TO OUR OWN. YOUR FORUMS WILL ADAPT TO SERVICE US. RESISTANCE IS FUTILE.

 

Offline Spicious

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
When did the fetus become a person?

 

Offline Scotty

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
*headdesk*

congrats on opening that particular can of worms.

Now that I'm here, I think it begins early.

 

Offline Mongoose

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
COMPLETELY agreed. Sex is icky. But it's so much fun, the ickiness can be disregarded. Ain't nothing fun about pregnancy.
I think many mothers would disagree with that, or at least disagree that the end result isn't fun.  But that's a topic better suited for a Hallmark card or something. :p

 

Offline Turambar

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
Now that I'm here, I think it begins early.

And I think it begins when it can think, at around age 2 or 3
10:55:48   TurambarBlade: i've been selecting my generals based on how much i like their hats
10:55:55   HerraTohtori: me too!
10:56:01   HerraTohtori: :D

 

Offline NGTM-1R

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
So you condone the murder of 1-year-olds? Fat chance that'll ever get accepted.
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Offline Turambar

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
So you condone the murder of 1-year-olds? Fat chance that'll ever get accepted.

thats why we compromise :-)
10:55:48   TurambarBlade: i've been selecting my generals based on how much i like their hats
10:55:55   HerraTohtori: me too!
10:56:01   HerraTohtori: :D

 

Offline blackhole

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
Quote from: Wikipedia
Humans tend to fail the mirror test until they are about 18 months old

 

Offline High Max

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
So?
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Offline Turambar

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
So?

We kill animals all the time, usually with little or no remorse.  What distinguishes us from other animals?  We think.  When a kid thinks, it becomes a valuable human.  Until then, it's a lower animal.
10:55:48   TurambarBlade: i've been selecting my generals based on how much i like their hats
10:55:55   HerraTohtori: me too!
10:56:01   HerraTohtori: :D

 

Offline Colonol Dekker

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
It's not legally independant til 18. depending on country of residence or location if not homed.
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Offline Scotty

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
Ah.  So where do we define thought, now?

Besides, the mirror test has a flawed premise when applied to infants.  It assumes enough experience to know what oneself looks like.  See the reference on the wiki article about how someone who is blind from birth doesn't immediately pass the test.

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
Turambar, you're kind of turning into the left-wing Liberator.

Look, let's face it, any boundary we set between 'life' and 'non life' is arbitrary. We can't even decide why a human being is alive but a rock isn't - all the lines are blurred. Birth provides a nice, convenient boundary - or, alternatively, the current third-trimester viability thing enshrined in law.

 

Offline TESLA

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
So?

We kill animals all the time, usually with little or no remorse.  What distinguishes us from other animals?  We think.  When a kid thinks, it becomes a valuable human.  Until then, it's a lower animal.

We kill animals for food, the species will do what it can to survive. Some hunt for pleasure, although this is a small minority of the population. Like most animals hunt for food, not for mere sport.
Nearly all creatures, like humans, take care of their young, it is a natural process, almost a 'natural law'.
All animals think to some degree. Otherwise they would not be able to survive or adapt to their environment throughout the ages. The differece lies with a sentient animal. Aware of its existence, but able to also ponder its future, question everything around it, build, learn grow, expand, survive another way.


Saying that a human is a lower animal until it thinks is a very dangerous philosophy. Once you set that bar, it would slowly rise. Your idea of a 'valuable human' has similar structures and educational thoughts of the infamous doctors working for Hitler's Germany. Once we start to demean a person, we demean all of us.
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Offline General Battuta

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Re: Overpopulation(or lack thereof)
GODWIN.

Please.

This was almost turning into a level-headed debate on common ground!