[Akalabeth Angel]

    Is anyone else unsatisfied with a lot of the design choices in the original TBP?

    I mean for the most part, the fighters are fun to play. I think they got that right pretty much, well, except for the plethora of missile weapons everywhere. But I can understand that.

    But the ships?? I don't know, I find a lot of the effects unfulfilling. I'm speculating creating some new models and the like and because I'm unfamiliar with a lot of the ships I threw a few into FRED and had just a "go at it" sort of battle. And the resulting "battle" was so . . pathetic that I wonder why the particular ships are even in the game.

    Take the Vree fleet for example. On the one hand, we have the Xorr which has three guns. On the other hand we have the Xill which has . . 25 turrets? That alone is a bit odd. But the guns themselves are pretty pathetic. The Xorr fires these, white balls for lack of a better word, each of which does 60 damage every 4 seconds. Compare this to the Starfuries 56 damage per shot. One Earth fighter, does more damage than a Vree warship! What the heck?? The Xill' not much better, sure it has lots of turrets but they do even less damage, only 45. And the Antimatter Shredder, or "cannon" in the tables is just a stream of small green pulses. In the show the Xill's ripping apart Shadow fighters, can it do this in the game? I would be very surprised if it does.

    And most of the ships use these same . . .  Earth-style beam weapons when they fire. Couldn't there be more variety??? i'm fairly sure the Drazi ships bombarding Centauri prime didn't fire that style of beam either. . . And even small effects like, the Narn energy mines. Why do they have a trail? Why do they move so slow? Why is the shockwave so slow? If there's some fear that they'd be unbalanced vs fighters then simply script the balance into the FRED mission.

    And some of the weapons don't even seem to have launch effects. Like the Brakiri pulse weapon for example. Throw some sounds in there, make it exciting.  I think a lot of the models look great. Even though some of them are low poly by modern forum standards, they still look nice. But the ship to ship combat itself is . . . meh.
   Also on the one hand you have these, League ships which are pathetic. And on the other there are the Minbari and the like who I think basically rip anyone apart. I haven't thrown the Minbari into a mission yet but I suspect that is the case.


    Does anyone else feel the same way? Or is it just me?

[emi_100]

Yes, I think the same.

New ships models, scripts, and effects are been created now.. you can see more info HERE.
It's a new mod, stand alone.

[The E]

Umm. That's a totally different project, one which is built largely on a fork of FS2_Open.

Now, regarding Akalabeth Angel's points:

Remember that most of the models and effects are rather old. Still, they are very close indeed to the original effects used in the TV show. Whether they are balanced the same way or not, that I can't tell you.

Also remember that, canonically, the Minbari ARE insanely overpowered. Short of some elder race ships, they have the strongest weaponry, the fastest ships, etc. Nerfing them in favor of the League ships (Or buffing the League ships to be on par with Minbari cruisers) would not be true to the universe.

[Akalabeth Angel]

Yes, I think the same.

New ships models, scripts, and effects are been created now.. you can see more info HERE.
It's a new mod, stand alone.

Is this for Freespace? Or is it something else entirely. Cool I didn't know about this. Personally I wouldn't mind going this route as well, it's just that a mod like this would be such a massive undertaking that I wouldn't bother. If I make some models for the TBP you'll be welcome to use them too btw. Though if I do make models I'll concentrate on ships not already in the game.

Remember that most of the models and effects are rather old. Still, they are very close indeed to the original effects used in the TV show. Whether they are balanced the same way or not, that I can't tell you.

Also remember that, canonically, the Minbari ARE insanely overpowered. Short of some elder race ships, they have the strongest weaponry, the fastest ships, etc. Nerfing them in favor of the League ships (Or buffing the League ships to be on par with Minbari cruisers) would not be true to the universe.

I'm not suggesting that anyone be on par with the Minbari. But there's a difference between on-par, and playable. I could make a mission that sends a hundred Xorr saucers against a Sharlin and at the end of the day there'd be 100 dead Vree ships and one slightly damaged Sharlin. That's silly. What I would suggest is that the gap is narrowed, so that yes the league would need superior numbers but in sufficient numbers they could put up a fight. I mean according to B5 the Vree already have FTL ships in this day and age, they should be more advanced.

TBP seems to portray the league as a minor power by giving them inferior technology. But a nation can still have more equivalent technology and be a minor power if their military numbers are few. I just watched Shadow Dancing the other day and the League hurt the shadows and they hurt them a lot. The Minbari are not as powerful as the Shadows, so the League naturally should be able to put up a fight against them too.

As for the effects, yes they're somewhat accurate for the Earth and Minbari but for the rest, eh . . . I don't know. And yes I know they're old, that's why revamping them might be a good idea. They may be somewhat accurate for the show, but the show was exciting to watch, ships fighting in TBP are far less exciting. I'd rather exaggerate the effects a little to get a more intense game myself.

[captain-custard]

As for the effects, yes they're somewhat accurate for the Earth and Minbari but for the rest, eh . . . I don't know. And yes I know they're old, that's why revamping them might be a good idea. They may be somewhat accurate for the show, but the show was exciting to watch, ships fighting in TBP are far less exciting. I'd rather exaggerate the effects a little to get a more intense game myself.
Posted on: October 08, 2009, 0

i dont want to seem rude but i disagree there, fighting in TBP is exciting as you know if you mess up then you die.

and as for making new ships etc , the would have to go into a mod package etc , but other than that good luck

[Akalabeth Angel]

As for the effects, yes they're somewhat accurate for the Earth and Minbari but for the rest, eh . . . I don't know. And yes I know they're old, that's why revamping them might be a good idea. They may be somewhat accurate for the show, but the show was exciting to watch, ships fighting in TBP are far less exciting. I'd rather exaggerate the effects a little to get a more intense game myself.
Posted on: October 08, 2009, 0

i dont want to seem rude but i disagree there, fighting in TBP is exciting as you know if you mess up then you die.

and as for making new ships etc , the would have to go into a mod package etc , but other than that good luck

Don't you die if you mess up in any game?
As I said the fighter to fighter combat is pretty good, but the ship to ship not so much.

I know it would have to go in a mod package and would not in any way be official, hence why this is put in public development.

[Vidmaster]

as always, the fans are free to develop whatever mods they want for TBP.
Even non TBP stuff like the OSS is cool, as long as no assets of TBP are used in non TBP related projects.

I also really like the way TBP plays obviously. A "fast" mod with increased thruster power for all ships would certainly be interesting but I won't do it. 

[carbine7]

Agreed. Cap ships should be much, much faster.
Also new effects and subsystem placements for League ships would be great. Specifically the Avoki's engine and the Drazi Fire/Sunhawk engine glows.

[Akalabeth Angel]

Agreed. Cap ships should be much, much faster.
Also new effects and subsystem placements for League ships would be great. Specifically the Avoki's engine and the Drazi Fire/Sunhawk engine glows.

Yeah does anyone else have problems targetting the Avioki's engine? There's a FH 2259 mission where you attack an Avioki and I don't think I ever really got the square bracket saying that I had los to the engine. I always got the diamond one. So I just fired and hoped I hit the thing, I can't remember if my attacks worked better from above or below.

[FUBAR-BDHR]

The Avioki engine targeting problem was fixed in Zathras.

[emi_100]

Yes, I think the same.

New ships models, scripts, and effects are been created now.. you can see more info HERE.
It's a new mod, stand alone.

Is this for Freespace? Or is it something else entirely. Cool I didn't know about this. Personally I wouldn't mind going this route as well, it's just that a mod like this would be such a massive undertaking that I wouldn't bother.

Yes, is a tactical space combat simulator, built on the FS2OpenOSE II game engine. The OSS (Open Space Softworks) team are working on this project (has nothing to do with TBP, TBP team or his/theirs materials)
The FS2Open game engine was heavily modified, featuring:
-new physics model (also known as Newtonian Physics),
-new AI models of behavior,
-some new visual effects render,
-new navigation system,
-several simulation features,
-new HUD,
-new docking sequnces,
-new hyperspace environment (unbelievable!)
-new afterburner control,
-seperate control modes for ship (combat mode/NAV mode),
-new principle of targeting system functioning,
-updated principle of the "Warp in/out" effects (including new warp for Shadows);
-added "tachyon beam" between global beacons in the hyperspace
-new ships models (using normal mapping)
-much more!

For example, you can see here new models for the MIMBARI FLEET, and the EA FLEET.
And here is their FORUM.

If I make some models for the TBP you'll be welcome to use them too btw. Though if I do make models I'll concentrate on ships not already in the game.

The OSS Team are searching for some additional modeler, of course, you are welcome


Thanks to HLP for the space to explain this

[Vidmaster]

For me, I am just glad that the original concept for this game was dropped. You know what I am talking about. 

[Akalabeth Angel]

For me, I am just glad that the original concept for this game was dropped. You know what I am talking about. 

Actually I do not, is this in reference to TBP. Can you care to enlighten us? Or are you talking about Into the Fire??? Or are you referring to OSS's Minbari Project detailing the 1000 yo shadow war??

Just curious.

[FUBAR-BDHR]

The original trailer they released.  It was pure propaganda. 

[Akalabeth Angel]

The original trailer they released.  It was pure propaganda. 

Who's "they"? TBP? OSS? ITF?

[The E]

OSS.

[General Battuta]

Yeah, that was...pretty ugly.

[Akalabeth Angel]

Is this trailer still around? Out of curiosity's sake.

[General Battuta]

A cursory search didn't turn it up, but I'm sure it's around. It was a very odd retelling of the recent Russian-Georgian war in the Babylon 5 universe, with a very pro-Russian perspective.

[den5]

For me, I am just glad that the original concept for this game was dropped. You know what I am talking about.  

It's very bad.

The original trailer they released.  It was pure propaganda.  

It was a very odd retelling of the recent Russian-Georgian war in the Babylon 5 universe, with a very pro-Russian perspective.

Where there propaganda? There are military games with the antiRussian propaganda, probably you play them with pleasure. You should not speak about what you don't know. Or you have the full script of this campaign? And what about that Georgia tried to involve two superstates in the nuclear conflict? I am very glad that Georgia got a kick in ass.