[Scourge of Ages]

I wanted to try my hand at modding, and thought I'd start off with a little table editing.

The trouble is, I had absolutely no idea how to even get at the tables. Some scouring later, I found the Descent Manager VPVIEW32 and was able to successfully extract and edit a table. Now, however, I don't know how to get that table back into a .vp so I can run it.

My point is, I think there should be a stickied thread in the FreeSpace Modding board with a basic list of things needed to start modding, and maybe a barebones tutorial. Obviously there's too much to put in a single topic, but a little starting point in an easy-to-find place would be great.

(If I'm not the first to ask this, I apologize. Forum searches suck.)

[Rodo]

but there is a special portal where you can get that kind of info.

http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php/Portal:Modding

specially usefull for you:

http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php/FS2_Data_Structure

It's a good idea to create a mod folder to put your stuff in it and test, just to keep your FS2 directory as clean as possible, anyways... all of what you need can be found there, regardless if you have any more questions then come here again.

[Topgun]

I wanted to try my hand at modding, and thought I'd start off with a little table editing.

The trouble is, I had absolutely no idea how to even get at the tables. Some scouring later, I found the Descent Manager VPVIEW32 and was able to successfully extract and edit a table. Now, however, I don't know how to get that table back into a .vp so I can run it.

you don't need, or want to.
pop the table in data/tables

[The E]

Okay, first up, you don't need to put the altered tbl back into the vp for the game to read it. Putting it into <mod directory>\data\tables does the job as well
(First lesson: Stuff in the data\ folder structure overrides stuff in vps).

Second: When modding, remember these rules: NEVER, EVER TOUCH THE <FreeSpace directory>\data FOLDER. DO NOT PUT ALTERED TBLS THERE, NO MATTER HOW MUCH YOU WANT TO. Unless you really, absolutely know what you are doing, you WILL break things and make life harder for the people who will try to help you.
Always use a mod folder and a mod.ini for your own modding.

WHEN YOU HAVE A PROBLEM, USE A DEBUG BUILD. If the warnings and errors it spits out do not help you, post the error messages and the fs2_open.log from the main data folder here.

[Scourge of Ages]

but there is a special portal where you can get that kind of info.

http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php/Portal:Modding

Ha ha! Success! Thanks for the quick answer, I got it working.
(Ever wondered what would happen if you gave the tracking capabilities of a harpoon to an infyrno? It's just as cheap as you'd expect.)

Okay, first up, you don't need to put the altered tbl back into the vp for the game to read it. Putting it into <mod directory>\data\tables does the job as well
(First lesson: Stuff in the data\ folder structure overrides stuff in vps).

Second: When modding, remember these rules: NEVER, EVER TOUCH THE <FreeSpace directory>\data FOLDER. DO NOT PUT ALTERED TBLS THERE, NO MATTER HOW MUCH YOU WANT TO. Unless you really, absolutely know what you are doing, you WILL break things and make life harder for the people who will try to help you.
Always use a mod folder and a mod.ini for your own modding.

So, the file path would be: FreeSpace2Open/mymod/data/tables/my .tbl files

I think all these things should be in one big sticky thread, so people like me don't make you use the red text. 

[Stormkeeper]

Yep. That path is about right.

[Retsof]

(Ever wondered what would happen if you gave the tracking capabilities of a harpoon to an infyrno? It's just as cheap as you'd expect.)

heh, now make a missile that spawns one of itself, with heat seeking and a 360* view cone.  (if you make it spawn two of itself they will multuply untill the game crashes.  )

[Stormkeeper]

I once made a missile with aspect lock, 270 fov, insane turn speed, and the ability to detonate a produce children missiles which inherited the lock. It was imba.

Then I up-scaled it, and made it into a capital use anti-fighter torpedo. It was a fearsome weapon.

[Scourge of Ages]

Thanks all. I figured out most of it, and am having great fun so far.

[Topgun]

Second: When modding, remember these rules: NEVER, EVER TOUCH THE <FreeSpace directory>\data FOLDER. DO NOT PUT ALTERED TBLS THERE, NO MATTER HOW MUCH YOU WANT TO. Unless you really, absolutely know what you are doing, you WILL break things and make life harder for the people who will try to help you.
Always use a mod folder and a mod.ini for your own modding.

I disagree. do it and you will learn how the game works, just don't ask us what's wrong if something breaks.

IF something DOES break, just delete the various folders in the data dir and things should go back to normal.

[The E]

Okay. You do that.

However, I do prefer it if I can actually help people. Keeping your experimental stuff separate from the stuff that is known to be correct is one of the best things you can do to ensure that finding and fixing errors is as painless as possible.

Besides, the -mod system is there FOR A REASON. It's so that you don't have to do STUPID **** like what you are recommending.

I am (not very) sorry if that offends you, but new guys putting files in bad places is one of the most common causes for errors.

[Grizzly]

Second: When modding, remember these rules: NEVER, EVER TOUCH THE <FreeSpace directory>\data FOLDER. DO NOT PUT ALTERED TBLS THERE, NO MATTER HOW MUCH YOU WANT TO. Unless you really, absolutely know what you are doing, you WILL break things and make life harder for the people who will try to help you.
Always use a mod folder and a mod.ini for your own modding.

I disagree. do it and you will learn how the game works, just don't ask us what's wrong if something breaks.

IF something DOES break, just delete the various folders in the data dir and things should go back to normal.

The problem is, when you simply want to do something else, having your own mod in its seperate mod folder is much more convenient then having to cut-paste the whole thing.

[Topgun]

I am not saying he should, but I don't think its a cardinal sin like The E was saying.
making mistakes is how we learn.

[The E]

Oh, yeah, but you are not dealing that much with new guys who mess up their installs because of making those mistakes.

I am trying to make my life easier here, I'd appreciate it if you would refrain from undoing my efforts.

[General Battuta]

The_E's right. It's a huge support problem.

[Dragon]

It should be used only for modding retail. (does anybody still do it?)

[Colonol Dekker]

Once in a blue moon.... My netbook for example... The thing chugs like helll.. But it can run it.

[Getter Robo G]

What is this Retail you speak of?   

(I kid)


At one time having several projects myself, I can testify that the -MOD system is critical for experimentation and fixing of various issues, knowing that you won't screw up your install so bad you have to delete everything and install FSO from scratch!

That was the whole purpose of the -mod called TEST.
I would drop a ship and table in there and in 3 mins or less I was viewing it in the tech room and then in game blowing it up to see if it crashed or not... Or viewed a weapon texture in use or a skybox ect...

Things that worked in TEST mod eventually would be finished off and go into relevant other mod folders. Things that failed... Went to a "GET FIXED!" folder or simply got round filed for the trouble...

I learned early on you DON'T screw with critical things that make the game work. At least until you know what you are doing. It saves you a lot of hassle and makes it easier for others to help you out when you got a question.  (USUALLY, not always)...

[Scourge of Ages]

Hi! So far so good, but I'm back with a couple of questions:

1) In ships.tbl under $Rotation time, I understand that the three values are x, y, and z. I'm unclear as to what those are though, which is pitch, yaw, and roll? I found this link: http://www.gamedev.net/community/forums/topic.asp?topic_id=202717&whichpage=1&#1289132 Is that accurate?
2) Looking through the wiki page on ships.tbl, I found $Warpin Type and have been itching to use it. Do I need all the other warpin tags to make it work right? I'm especially interested in "Homeworld" and "Hyperspace" types. Assuming I need a warpin animation, where would I find it?

Thanks again.

[Spoon]

Hi! So far so good, but I'm back with a couple of questions:

1) In ships.tbl under $Rotation time, I understand that the three values are x, y, and z. I'm unclear as to what those are though, which is pitch, yaw, and roll? I found this link: http://www.gamedev.net/community/forums/topic.asp?topic_id=202717&whichpage=1&#1289132 Is that accurate?

x = left and right
y = up and down
z = roll around your axis