[Light]

I was wondering, with the new in game model of the Hecate class, why has the class has not had its in game armament brought up to mach what is seen on the ship in the command briefings? The ship is missing 15 weapons emplacements, 12 on the wings, 1 between Turret05 and Turret06, and the 2 uppermost of the 6 that should be mounted on the port and starboard blades. Given this would it be possible to have a fully armed version of the ship at some point in the future, I know the Lucifer received just such an overhaul so that it now matches what was scene in the FS1 and FS2 cutscenes and Command briefs, so why not the same here?














 

[Hades]

There was something similar with the Deimos and Colossus, though I know not why they took all these turrets off.

The four (two on each side) multipart turrets on the deimos, and the numerous turrets on the Colossus.

[The E]

Because adding those turrets would alter the balancing.
While you could set their loadout to empty for the mediavps, what you'd end up with would be a ship where half the turrets don't fire, making the ships look bad.

There was something similar with the Deimos and Colossus, though I know not why they took all these turrets off.

The four (two on each side) multipart turrets on the deimos, and the numerous turrets on the Colossus.

Same principle. Adding the turrets, while possible, would alter balancing OR make the ships look stupid.

[Droid803]

Hmmm, I time for a more sensible Hecate Upgrade than the one I made by slapping silly turrets everywhere, then
This won't go into the MVPs cause having non-functioning turrets that clearly look like turrets is...bad.

I'll be happy to make a pof edit of the hecate to add these turrets for you though, for your own mod or whatever.

[Dragon]

CBs must have been made before the final turret layout was decided.
I don't know why it was changed though.
A version with old layout for mods would be an interesting idea.

[Hades]

Because adding those turrets would alter the balancing.
While you could set their loadout to empty for the mediavps, what you'd end up with would be a ship where half the turrets don't fire, making the ships look bad.

I don't believe he's talking about adding them now, but why weren't they kept on the models in development, where the balance of a mission could be changed around something like this.

[-Norbert-]

Maybe they thought the Hecate was too powerfull in direct confrontations, when they wanted it more as a carrier and supporter, so they removed some of the firepower....
Or more likely, the additional weapon effects were bad for performance.

[asyikarea51]

Hmmm, I time for a more sensible Hecate Upgrade than the one I made by slapping silly turrets everywhere, then

Beam cannons mounted right at the engine wall, with no explanation of how an engineer was going to "wire up" the weapon to the reactor when gigantic exhaust plumes are located directly behind said cannons

[Mongoose]

Y'know, all of those extra turrets would probably throw a real monkey wrench into the GenFS thread that's going on right now.

[Droid803]

Wouldn't actually help that much IMO, they don't add much coverage to its blindspots and its still woefully underequipped to deal with capital ships.

It's just more deadly to fighters from angles that its already deadly againts them.

[Dragon]

Maybe that was the reason for removing them, they wanted to tone down it's AA coverage.

[Light]

Thanks for all of the replies. I myself do not have a mod project but I just thought it would be interesting to have an alternate model available. 

There was something similar with the Deimos and Colossus, though I know not why they took all these turrets off.

The four (two on each side) multipart turrets on the deimos, and the numerous turrets on the Colossus.

I was unaware that the Colossus in game model differed that much from one the CB's and cutscenes. I know that it had some of its turrets disarmed in the weapon.tbl in its original format however.
In the case of the Deimos it is actually 6 turrets 3 on each side that are missing. Two on each side of the upper hull below Turret01 and Turret02 for four there and and 1 one each of the after hull's bulges below the Parana mounts which are Turrets 25 and 26.

CBs must have been made before the final turret layout was decided.
I don't know why it was changed though.
A version with old layout for mods would be an interesting idea.

That would be great if it is not any trouble. Otherwise point me in the direction for instructions on how to do in myself.

[Ulala]

Because adding those turrets would alter the balancing.
While you could set their loadout to empty for the mediavps, what you'd end up with would be a ship where half the turrets don't fire, making the ships look bad.

So make them fire but set to do 0 damage. I have no idea if the code would support something like specific damage output of certain turrets, but it's an idea.

[General Battuta]

Because adding those turrets would alter the balancing.
While you could set their loadout to empty for the mediavps, what you'd end up with would be a ship where half the turrets don't fire, making the ships look bad.

So make them fire but set to do 0 damage. I have no idea if the code would support something like specific damage output of certain turrets, but it's an idea.

This will not work as it will still cause ships to evade. The MediaVPs ships cannot have active (i.e. tabled) additional turrets, though some of them do have 'dead' (untabled) extra turrets, like the Moloch. But a variant model which could be used by mods, but not the campaign itself, would work.

[Hades]

There was something similar with the Deimos and Colossus, though I know not why they took all these turrets off.

The four (two on each side) multipart turrets on the deimos, and the numerous turrets on the Colossus.

I was unaware that the Colossus in game model differed that much from one the CB's and cutscenes. I know that it had some of its turrets disarmed in the weapon.tbl in its original format however.
In the case of the Deimos it is actually 6 turrets 3 on each side that are missing. Two on each side of the upper hull below Turret01 and Turret02 for four there and and 1 one each of the after hull's bulges below the Parana mounts which are Turrets 25 and 26.

Yeah, the Colossus is stated to have over 80 turrets in its introduction cutscene but in game it only has around 60 total. And I don't believe I ever noticed that extra turret on the Deimos, looks as if I learned something new today.

[Droid803]

Huh? The Moloch has dead turrets? Not to my knowledge. The "eye" turret has always been there if you're referring to that one, and its always been a blob.

The Deimos has side-mounter multiparts in the box art...

[General Battuta]

Huh? The Moloch has dead turrets? Not to my knowledge. The "eye" turret has always been there if you're referring to that one, and its always been a blob.

oh 

whoops!

[Hades]

The Deimos has side-mounter multiparts in the box art...

Yes. That was said. Days ago. I just said that I didn't know there were any turrets behind the piranhas that aren't present in game.
lern 2 reed

Also I think Battuta meant the Lucifer, which has those two bombardment beam turrets in the model, but not tabled.

[Mongoose]

Also I think Battuta meant the Lucifer, which has those two bombardment beam turrets in the model, but not tabled.

Interestingly enough, the Lucifer was listed as having three "flux cannons" in the FS1 techroom, despite it only using the two SSLs in-game.  And the FS2 cutscene shows said beam firing from that side "bombardment" beam mount, not its proper place at the front.  sort of has a history of not keeping their armaments straight.

[Hades]

Also I think Battuta meant the Lucifer, which has those two bombardment beam turrets in the model, but not tabled.

Interestingly enough, the Lucifer was listed as having three "flux cannons" in the FS1 techroom, despite it only using the two SSLs in-game.  And the FS2 cutscene shows said beam firing from that side "bombardment" beam mount, not its proper place at the front.  sort of has a history of not keeping their armaments straight.

There was supposed to be a third flux which fired from the nose (the Liliths/Cains were also meant to fire beams from their arms ala Lucifer IIRC) and the FS2 cutscenes weren't made by Volition, explaining their inconsistency to the actual game and very low visual quality in comparison to FreeSpace 1 cutscenes.