[Flipside]

It's also about knowing where to look, kind of like music, much of the contents of the charts is regurgitated 'formula' stuff for both media types, but if you look further than that, there's still a lot of good stuff being produced.

[Mongoose]

Consoles simply can't give the same level of freedom and options and graphics.

They can easily do two out of three, and the third is pretty much just wankery at this point.  I can't be alone in thinking that we've hit the point of diminishing returns as far as graphical improvements are concerned.

If they can do 1 out of those 3 right I'll be impressed. But I've yet to see a console game that did that.

GTA Whichever.  Red Dead Redemption.  Hell, pretty much any Rockstar game.  I'm not even particularly interested in most of their titles myself, but there's no denying that they practically invented the idea of "sandbox game."  Hell, you can throw in 's Saints Row and Just Cause 2 into the mix as well.

And as far as the "Where did these sorts of games go?" argument, keep in mind that there are those of us who never played those sorts of games in the first place.  I primarily play games for relaxation and escapism, and as far as I'm concerned, playing a game with extremely complex fundamental mechanics and rulesets seems more like work than entertainment.  Hell, if I wanted that, I'd go pick up an old physics textbook and review some material, since that'd actually do something for me.  My personal strengths as a gamer lie in my hand-eye coordination and spatial awareness, not my grasp of battlefield strategy or empire-building, and so I tend to avoid games like those that NGTM-1R mentioned by default.

[Flipside]

I've always felt there are three main kinds of gamers, you could probably tell them apart by giving them a pack of dominos and seeing what they do, there'd be one group that played Dominos with them, one group that started making Domino chains and be happy watching the chain reaction, and there'd be those who invented their own game using the pieces.

The first group are those who like a nice, straight line diversion, the second group like 'management' games where your actions have far reaching effects, and the third tend towards sandbox-type games, where they are free to explore and interact at their own pace.

Edit: And just to note, NO gamer sits absolutely in one group in my opinion, there's always blurring, it's more about trends than absolutes.

[Kolgena]

Yeah, I reckon that you can still fit a few more buttons onto gamepads, but still, nowhere near as many as a keyboard, obviously.

I just imagined a game controller that looks like a miniature accordion without the bellows.

I think there's also an aspect of selective memory with why people think that there were better games in the past. Nobody remembers the crap games of those times, but most people will remember and talk about the gems like Starcraft, Red Alert 2, Counterstrike, etc, etc.

When new games come out, I'm inclined to believe that quality games are produced at a higher proportion of all games compared to before. However, we also spend a lot more time looking at every title, even if it's just mediocre to just above average.

So, we remember a lot more gems from the past, and also a lot more not-so-gem games from the present.

[Mongoose]

Exactly.  The (relatively) recent prevalence of Internets game reporting has meant that every single shovelware bargain-bin title gains at least some degree of notoriety, whereas they'd pretty much go unnoticed ten or so years ago.

[Dilmah G]

Yeah, I reckon that you can still fit a few more buttons onto gamepads, but still, nowhere near as many as a keyboard, obviously.

I just imagined a game controller that looks like a miniature accordion without the bellows.

I think there's also an aspect of selective memory with why people think that there were better games in the past. Nobody remembers the crap games of those times, but most people will remember and talk about the gems like Starcraft, Red Alert 2, Counterstrike, etc, etc.

When new games come out, I'm inclined to believe that quality games are produced at a higher proportion of all games compared to before. However, we also spend a lot more time looking at every title, even if it's just mediocre to just above average.

So, we remember a lot more gems from the past, and also a lot more not-so-gem games from the present.

Yeah, on the note of the controller, if you think about an Xbox 360 controller, for instance, you've got your thumb and forefinger being used, and the rest of your hands free. You could probably fit in a few more buttons on the underside of the controller (would then have to make the controllers adjustable to accommodate for shorter and longer fingers, I suppose) and get away with it.

And now you've got me remembering all the ****tier games of my childhood.

[Hades]

actually I use my middle finger for the lower front buttons and my index for the upper forward buttons. What now?

[StarSlayer]

there is always this monstrosity:

[Spoon]

I just want a few great games like master of orion and starcontrol to keep me busy for the next few years... 
What happened game industry?

Nothing.

You happened, though. You happened to lose the childlike sense of wonder. You happened to get bored more easily. You could still be out there playing Civ IV and Civ V and the TW games worth a damn and Sins and Space Empires and Galactic Civilizations and even SotS as lolrious as it is. And I'm only listing the ones in vaguely the same genre.

But you won't. You'll just stand around asking where the good games are.

I never quite got into Civ, not my game.
Sins of a solar empire just feels really shallow to me. I played one long skirmish game against the ai and one 1 on 1 game with a classmate. And after that I really felt like I've seen the whole game. (Poor a.i. does not help enjoyment)
SotS, I've played the original, I modded it. But after a while I discovered that the developers are retarded and after a while I just got bored with the game.
Galactic Civilizations, same story as Sins. I played one long game and after that felt I had seen it all. (again, poor a.i. does not help enjoyment)

So tell me, where are the good games that will keep me busy for more than a month? 
I can only list Starcraft 2. A game with depth, an 'old school' rts with excellent multiplayer.

[Kolgena]

Dragon Age?
Mass Effect?
BFBC2?

Really now?

[Nuke]

Exactly.  The (relatively) recent prevalence of Internets game reporting has meant that every single shovelware bargain-bin title gains at least some degree of notoriety, whereas they'd pretty much go unnoticed ten or so years ago.

i think some of the best games in my inventory came from a bargain bin.

[mxlm]

And I'm only listing the ones in vaguely the same genre.

And not even all of them.

I'm not sure there's anything that annoys me more than good-old-days nostalgia, and gamer nostalgia from people who are probably mid-twenties or maybe mid-thirties is the most irritating variation thereof. "Where did all the good games go" indeed.

[TrashMan]

I just want a few great games like master of orion and starcontrol to keep me busy for the next few years... 
What happened game industry?

Nothing.

You happened, though. You happened to lose the childlike sense of wonder. You happened to get bored more easily. You could still be out there playing Civ IV and Civ V and the TW games worth a damn and Sins and Space Empires and Galactic Civilizations and even SotS as lolrious as it is. And I'm only listing the ones in vaguely the same genre.

But you won't. You'll just stand around asking where the good games are.

Played all the games you listed

SINS is a bit bland and I got bored very quickly.
SE and Gal Civ and ..ok SE gets too much micro and GC has completely uninteresting combat.

Good Lord who cares?  Seriously if the idea that "My PC is the most dominant thing ever!" is so important to their sense of self worth just let em have it.  Who cares?  You think other folk's opinion affects my enjoyment of a platform one iota?  Hardly.  It should be obvious by now  they're buried deep as ticks and no amount of convincing is going to dig them out.

whatchutalkingaboutman?
Self-worth? Opinnion? You think anyone cares about that s***? Well, ok, some do.

I say what I say because it's self-evident. Like moon not being made out of cheese.

SotS, I've played the original, I modded it. But after a while I discovered that the developers are retarded and after a while I just got bored with the game.

Wait...are you that obnoxious guy that eventually got banned for constantly trying to argue with the devs?

[Hades]

Just because what you say is self-evident to you does not mean it's self evident or even true otherwise.

[Mongoose]

Exactly.  The (relatively) recent prevalence of Internets game reporting has meant that every single shovelware bargain-bin title gains at least some degree of notoriety, whereas they'd pretty much go unnoticed ten or so years ago.

i think some of the best games in my inventory came from a bargain bin.

I mean the sorts of games that start in a bargain bin, not those you find there several years after they were released.

[Spoon]

Wait...are you that obnoxious guy that eventually got banned for constantly trying to argue with the devs?

I dont recall ever getting banned, I do recall that those sots devs couldn't take critism of any kind and even deleted negative threads on release day because they heavily applied censors. Kinda like putting their fingers into their ears and going "LALALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU."
Not to mention like saying stupid **** like "Sots was totally ready for release in spring" even though they needed a patch like a day after release to address a wide array of bugs and to add features. And openly talking **** about Gal civ's tech tree "In sots you don't research pen and after that ball pen". Oh really? Even though your tech tree goes from red laser to green laser and after that violet laser? They also had this semi-hostile attitude toward mods, because some mods were 'going to improve on their perfect game', which was not possible and quite insulting apparantly.
Now I know its no real use talking to you about this, cause I already know you are a tremendous fanboy but hey 

Dragon Age?
Mass Effect?
BFBC2?

Really now?

Dragon age was wonderful but I completed it in like 2 weeks and haven't touched it since then.
Mass effect I got bored half way with.
BFBC2 is a fps, I'm not really into those anymore.
But hey, I know reading comprehension is hard and its so darn easy to ignore everything a person says when you are trying to hate on him for:

I'm not sure there's anything that annoys me more than good-old-days nostalgia, and gamer nostalgia from people who are probably mid-twenties or maybe mid-thirties is the most irritating variation thereof. "Where did all the good games go" indeed.

Important part bolded.

So tell me, where are the good games that will keep me busy for more than a month?

There are quite a lot of good games these days, sure. But most of them are like Black ops: a 5-10 hour thrill ride.
After playing them once, I don't feel any desire to play them again. I have a large pile of 360 games here but I hardly ever boot up the 360 these days because none of these games offer me anything to continue playing them.
And its definitely a change in the game industry. A lot of games are being designed these days to be this really cinematic experience that everyone can pick up and enjoy. But that's not usually what I look for in a game.

[T-LoW]

Assassin's Creed 2 has a almost 25hour story-line. Really a great game.

But for games that last for months?

Well multiplayer like Diablo 2, Warcraft 3, League of Legends (especially this ), and so on.

(no World of Warcraft here)

[Spoon]

I played and completed AC1, it was fun but it was also really repetetive. If you just do the main missions and fight all the templars you have the most fun parts of the game and aren't missing out on anything else. An other case of play once, never touch again, ever.
I haven't really heard anything about AC2 that tells me it will be an other experience 

Well I guess games like those are great for people like mongoose though 

there is always this monstrosity:

*steel battalion pic*

  Ye gods, I've always wanted to try that thing 

[TrashMan]

Just because what you say is self-evident to you does not mean it's self evident or even true otherwise.

Oh, it is the truth. Some people just don't want to accept it

[Scotty]

Just because what you say is self-evident to you does not mean it's self evident or even true otherwise.

Oh, it is the truth. Some people just don't want to accept it

No, it's not and I counter that you're the one not accepting that consoles can actually do ****.

Avoided thread so far, but posting your opinion as undeniable truth, hell, the only truth on the matter irritated me enough to say something.