[S-99]

I rolled my precious 89 dodge dynasty on saturday night going down a steep hill with lots of black ice and no studs. Been doing great with these all terrains on black ice all season until now. Went down a steep grade with a tight turn at 48 made me lose static friction. Going left and right with cars in the other lane with no airbags. It has no airbags. So i steered for the snow filled ditch and got it.

The swerving was chaotic and came out of no where (i was unprepared for the turn i always pull on my normal trip to see my parents i usually do at night either way...the drive down there was slick, but i confidently made it...this was on the way down, my situation was on the way back to where i live). This was different. I hit the ditch finally and rolled into it. That was surprisingly gentle actually. No injuries, the car just slow and smooth rolled onto it's roof. Didn't even bump my head. Doesn't usually happen for people. Got out of the car to people who gave me a ride back to town after i turned everything off and locked the vehicle.

Got the car out of the ditch on monday with a friend to find out all of my fluids drained. Filled those back up and back on the road. The experience didn't quite hit me until i completed the drive back up yesterday late night. Man i was overly careful. Probably take me a while to get my balls back (the roll was so minor in consequence in general, not terribly surprised i got a little scared to complete the drive two days later). I focus on being a safe driver. Been a good first year with my license otherwise.

The only thing that would've helped in the situation was remembering how far along in my trip i was. I do need to take my car to an ice rink (i'm great a keeping a car on the road unless unprepared like i was, i don't know **** about regaining lost control on ice though).

[Grizzly]

Probably take me a while to get my balls back (the roll was so minor in consequence in general, not terribly surprised i got a little scared to complete the drive two days later).

Heheh, don't feel sorry about it. I was blown off a dike with a moped once, and subsequently went airborne due to a ramp (a part of the dike's flank made less steep for cars to get on). I came away without a scratch, the bike broke one of its lights, but everything was fine. Still phoned my dad so that he could get his van to pick me up. I was really shaking, and the hour it took for him to get there gave me all the time to appreacite how lucky I was and how I could have been killed by either crashing into a lamp post (went straight between them) or having the bike landing on top of me instead of behind me, or me and the bike sliding into a ditch and either ruining my neck or my day even more. Scared me good back then.
As a side note: Dikes in Holland are not neccesarely built next to water. They are usually ancient leftovers of succesfull efforts to claim the land from the sea.

Still, I still consider it a pity nobody made a video of it. It would have been great for youtube, and good for a laugh afterwards.

the car just slow and smooth rolled onto it's roof. Didn't even bump my head. Doesn't usually happen for people

I get the feeling that it actually does happen that way a lot of the time, and that people who get killed or seriously injured are just extremely unlucky.

[Pred the Penguin]

Or driving at high speeds.

[MP-Ryan]

Been doing great with these all terrains on black ice all season until now.

All-season (all-terrain) tires are in no way, shape, or form suitable for winter driving.  Even in dry conditions, the rubber compound in an all-season tire is designed to perform at temperatures over 7°C.

There are three types of tires suitable for use in winter:
1.  Winter (in some places called "snow") tires, which carry the severe weather rating symbol.
2.  Studded winter tires, which carry the severe weather rating symbol (but which are not legal in all jurisdictions for use on public roads).
3.  Newer on the market, "all-weather" tires (NOT all-seasons), which carry the severe weather rating symbol.  These aren't very common, but are made by manufacturers such as Nokian (I have a set of their WRG2s on one of my vehicles and love them).

Notice a trend - the severe weather rating symbol.  In Canada, it's a little snowflake inside a mountain, and will be stamped on the sidewall of the tire.

And were it me, I'd be having a shop check the integrity of the frame after rolling (even a gentle roll).  Struts are generally designed to take one roll event and prevent the car from crushing itself - you're putting yourself at risk of the roof collapsing entirely and crushing you if there's ever a next time.

[Nuke]

i once almost dumped my grandma out of the back of a pickup truck racing my sister out on dirt roads in the middle of nowhere. she pulled a tight corner and i did the same, but i was a little too aggressive on the wheel and hit a large rock in the road. hole truck jumped and grandma, who was sitting on the tailgate had a rather unsettled look on her face. as for who won, that got cut short when one of my sister's tires got blown out, and whe had to pile the entire family into the back of the truck i was driving, it was the most redneck thing ever! ive never had a drivers license, but thats ok there are no cops out where my sister lives, save a couple state troopers who come down during moose season to enforce hunting laws. so you can get away with anything out there.

[S-99]

There are three types of tires suitable for use in winter:
1.  Winter (in some places called "snow") tires, which carry the severe weather rating symbol.
2.  Studded winter tires, which carry the severe weather rating symbol (but which are not legal in all jurisdictions for use on public roads).
3.  Newer on the market, "all-weather" tires (NOT all-seasons), which carry the severe weather rating symbol.  These aren't very common, but are made by manufacturers such as Nokian (I have a set of their WRG2s on one of my vehicles and love them).

Notice a trend - the severe weather rating symbol.  In Canada, it's a little snowflake inside a mountain, and will be stamped on the sidewall of the tire.

And were it me, I'd be having a shop check the integrity of the frame after rolling (even a gentle roll).  Struts are generally designed to take one roll event and prevent the car from crushing itself - you're putting yourself at risk of the roof collapsing entirely and crushing you if there's ever a next time.

I'm not even bothering with studded anymore. Studded slides around just as good as all terrains when you get going. Good for faster take offs with stop and go driving on ice and that's really it. I really didn't notice a single difference not having studded tires for this winter except needing slower take offs from a stop. If i were looking for awesome traction. Blizzaks, or all weather tires like you recommend. I will put all weathers on my list of wants.

And i did at least have a shop check my car. The only thing that happened was my mechanic said my front bumper on the left quadrant did take some kind of an impact which will reduce the efficacy of the bumper if i hit anything with the left quadrant of it. The roof and everything else appears to be fine. He didn't find anything else wrong with it (we went out together to grab my car). The roof caved in like 4 inches. I just used my foot to pop that back out. No broken or cracked windows. It's a sturdy car. I like how it uses thicker and higher quality sheet metal all around the outside of the car compared to others. Aside from the bumper, it's just as much in one piece before i rolled. I got lucky.

[jr2]

I think if you ever were going at a slow velocity up a steep hill you would be extremely thankful you had studs on...   Anyone here ever slide backwards down a hill?

[MP-Ryan]

I think if you ever were going at a slow velocity up a steep hill you would be extremely thankful you had studs on...   Anyone here ever slide backwards down a hill?

I grew up and learned to drive in the mountains of the British Columbia interior.  Sliding backwards down at least one hill was a winter ritual =)

[S-99]

I think if you ever were going at a slow velocity up a steep hill you would be extremely thankful you had studs on...   Anyone here ever slide backwards down a hill?

Studs aren't as helpful as you would like to think. You'd keep sliding backwards like if you didn't even have them. Studs are not very handy.

[Mongoose]

See, those are the days I choose to stay at home and drink hot cocoa.

[S-99]

I just want it to get colder so it's less slick on the roads. It's been a warm december for this time of year in interior alaska.

Most decembers are -20 or -30. And it's been mostly 10 or 20 above zero the whole month. January will get cold, but that'll be great. Checking prices on blizzaks for ****s and giggles.

[Grizzly]

I think if you ever were going at a slow velocity up a steep hill you would be extremely thankful you had studs on...   Anyone here ever slide backwards down a hill?

Studs aren't as helpful as you would like to think. You'd keep sliding backwards like if you didn't even have them. Studs are not very handy.

Could it be one of those things that just reduces the frequency of things happening in a way that you hardly notice it untill you start taking notes?

[FireSpawn]

i once almost dumped my grandma out of the back of a pickup truck racing my sister out on dirt roads in the middle of nowhere. she pulled a tight corner and i did the same, but i was a little too aggressive on the wheel and hit a large rock in the road. hole truck jumped and grandma, who was sitting on the tailgate had a rather unsettled look on her face. as for who won, that got cut short when one of my sister's tires got blown out, and whe had to pile the entire family into the back of the truck i was driving, it was the most redneck thing ever! ive never had a drivers license, but thats ok there are no cops out where my sister lives, save a couple state troopers who come down during moose season to enforce hunting laws. so you can get away with anything out there.

Nuke, I love you and your family.

[S-99]

I took notes from last winter season with studs. The help those gave were very negligible. Having studs was pretty much like driving without them. I just didn't opt for the expense of studs for my new car because of this.

I would rather spend the money on something that makes a very big difference as opposed to 5% difference.

[FireSpawn]

I took notes from last winter season with studs. The help those gave were very negligible. Having studs was pretty much like driving without them. I just didn't opt for the expense of studs for my new car because of this.

I would rather spend the money on something that makes a very big difference as opposed to 5% difference.

I take it that you haven't seen James Bond: Die Another Day, or you'd know that studs allow your car to drive up ice walls and cling to them. 

[S-99]

We need to raid the props for that movie because obviously logic dictates not all of them are fake

[Davros]

Glad your o.k
On the bright side you wont need to worry if youve made the car look uglier

[jr2]

I think if you ever were going at a slow velocity up a steep hill you would be extremely thankful you had studs on...   Anyone here ever slide backwards down a hill?

Studs aren't as helpful as you would like to think. You'd keep sliding backwards like if you didn't even have them. Studs are not very handy.

Well, they do make some difference... sort of like 4 wheel drive does.  The problem comes when inexperienced (or reckless) idiots think that just because their car has any combination of 4WD/AWD/Traction Control/ABS/Snow Tires/Studs, that it makes them impervious to the combination of the law of conservation of momentum and the lack of traction available on the ice.  Studs help, but not that much... so if you are already taking precautions, they can be the difference between sliding into the opposing lane or not, however, if you are already doing well over the reasonable top speed for the conditions, I'm sorry, but nothing will help you.

And, of course, at other times, the conditions / circumstances are simply so horrendous that nothing (at least with current tech) will help you and an accident is inevitable if you are on the road.

[LordMelvin]

snip... Anyone here ever slide backwards down a hill?

Three times since Hallowe'en. Boo-yah, go New England.

[S-99]

Well, they do make some difference... sort of like 4 wheel drive does.  The problem comes when inexperienced (or reckless) idiots think that just because their car has any combination of 4WD/AWD/Traction Control/ABS/Snow Tires/Studs, that it makes them impervious to the combination of the law of conservation of momentum and the lack of traction available on the ice.  Studs help, but not that much... so if you are already taking precautions, they can be the difference between sliding into the opposing lane or not, however, if you are already doing well over the reasonable top speed for the conditions, I'm sorry, but nothing will help you.

And, of course, at other times, the conditions / circumstances are simply so horrendous that nothing (at least with current tech) will help you and an accident is inevitable if you are on the road.

Driving is pretty easy, i picked it up pretty fast. Even on ice with all terrains. For my first year and i react accordingly with cars in the other lane and not having air bags with lost control. That's pretty good. I do need to work on regaining control when i lose it on ice (i haven't had time for taking my car to an ice rink). Otherwise i would have stayed on the road.

I have given myself the aspiration of wanting to be a good and proper driver. One of those things means being able drive without studded or blizzak tires during winter. For my first year of driving i was pretty good at it until last saturday. I wasn't even speeding, just going 48. Of which case i'll still say i'm pretty good at it, however not the best (i know exactly what i need to work on).

I understand what you mean with the studded tire thing. But, i'll explain it again. Upgrading to something that helps so little isn't worth the money. Studded tires help so little, that i'm better off sticking with the tires i already have for winter. I'd be an idiot to buy studded tires as opposed to something way better such as blizzaks.

Idk why you want to go for something that helps marginally where as you could be going for something that helps tremendously. I'm going to keep working on my skill on ice with the tires that i already have like many other alaskans do. It'll make me a better driver with increased experience and skill rahter than instead of just depending on technology to compensate. Studded tires are still what studded tires are, a poor excuse for a winter tire.