[Lorric]

I'm just pondering something. The Turn 0 map:



I wonder how things would have gone if the 1st UGCR and 2nd CRF had rushed into Crux and the 1st and 2nd LSF fleets had rushed into Kardoen on the very first turn. I'm sure we could have held them both and bottled up the Hierarchy...

The Zy would of course have eventually come to open up new fronts, but it would have changed everything...

[niffiwan]

Maybe.  Just remember the 1st fleets are 150%, and our reinforcements would have been 1 move further away.  Perhaps if we hadn't attacked at all we may have held them...

[Lorric]

Maybe.  Just remember the 1st fleets are 150%, and our reinforcements would have been 1 move further away.  Perhaps if we hadn't attacked at all we may have held them...

The heaviest damage the Hierarchy could have inflicted going by what they brought in on Turn 1 is as follows:

Aldebaran

1st Cordi Fleet Fighters: 30+9 = 39
1st Cordi Fleet Capital: 18+15 = 33
Fighters at 150% Strength
Capital ships at 150% Strength

2nd Cordi Fleet Fighters: 20+6 = 26
2nd Cordi Fleet Capital: 12+10 = 22
Fighters at 100% Strength
Capital ships at 100% Strength

3rd Cordi Fleet Fighters: 20+6 = 26
3rd Cordi Fleet Capital: 12+10 = 22
Fighters at 100% Strength
Capital ships at 100% Strength

Damage - 91/77

Kardoen

1st Nordera Fleet Fighters: 18+8 = 26
1st Nordera Fleet Capital: 15+9 = 24
Fighters at 150% Strength
Capital ships at 150% Strength

2nd Nordera Fleet Fighters: 12+5 = 17
2nd Nordera Fleet Capital: 10+6 = 16
Fighters at 100% Strength
Capital ships at 100% Strength

4th Cordi Fleet Fighters: 20+6 = 26
4th Cordi Fleet Capital: 12+10 = 22
Fighters at 100% Strength
Capital ships at 100% Strength

Damage - 69/62

That would not be enough. We'd have got our feet well under the table.

[niffiwan]

(oh look, a what-if exercise! )

On our turn 1 so we've got to retreat one fleet in each system (with a resupply each).  No reinforcements arrive on the front line that turn.

On our turn2, both the 2nd fleets needs to retreat but reinforcements will arrive just in time to cover them.  In fact we should have 3 fresh fleets in Crux & Kardoen at the end of the turn, with 2 moderately damaged fleets & 2 fresh fleets behind them.  We've only dealt trivial to the enemy by this point, but it shouldn't matter.  You're right, we would have held them there at the two chokepoints, at least until the Hertak arrived

Of course, it's far easier to make such a call after we know what the enemy stats are & how many reinforcements they got & when.  Hindsight & all

Here's another what-if, assume that due to our aggressive 1st moves, the 1st Zy & 1st Fura'ngle arrived one turn earlier in place of the 3rd/4th Cordi (queue-jumpers!)

[Lorric]

(oh look, a what-if exercise! )

Yes. Fun.

The historians will be picking over the moves we made when this war is over with a fine toothcomb, judging us... but will those historians be Terran or Hertak...

Of course, it's far easier to make such a call after we know what the enemy stats are & how many reinforcements they got & when.  Hindsight & all

Indeed. I have no regrets.

Here's another what-if, assume that due to our aggressive 1st moves, the 1st Zy & 1st Fura'ngle arrived one turn earlier in place of the 3rd/4th Cordi (queue-jumpers!)

Actually, I've just noticed the 1st Fura'ngle up there in Algol on turn 1, I missed them before. So, new max damage potential in Kardoen:

1st Nordera Fleet Fighters: 18+8 = 26
1st Nordera Fleet Capital: 15+9 = 24
Fighters at 150% Strength
Capital ships at 150% Strength

4th Cordi Fleet Fighters: 20+6 = 26
4th Cordi Fleet Capital: 12+10 = 22
Fighters at 100% Strength
Capital ships at 100% Strength

1st Fura'ngle Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 22+15 = 37
Capital attack strength: 28+12 = 40
Fighters at 150% Strength
Capital ships at 150% Strength

Damage - 89/86

I reckon the addition of the 1st Zy could have smashed a fleet without calculating it, but Spoon did pledge not to do the one hit kill at that time, so he'd have probably sent them to Aldebaran instead of Tauri, with the 2nd Zy going to Tauri instead of showing up on the front, I predict.

Let's see anyway:

1st Cordi Fleet Fighters: 30+9 = 39
1st Cordi Fleet Capital: 18+15 = 33
Fighters at 150% Strength
Capital ships at 150% Strength

1st Zy Fleet:
Fighter attack strength: 33+16=49
Capital attack strength: 32+17=49
Fighters at 150% Strength
Capital ships at 150% Strength

3rd Cordi Fleet Fighters: 20+6 = 26
3rd Cordi Fleet Capital: 12+10 = 22
Fighters at 100% Strength
Capital ships at 100% Strength

Damage - 114/104

Yeah I thought so, but it wouldn't have happened.

[niffiwan]

The historians will be picking over the moves we made when this war is over with a fine toothcomb, judging us... but will those historians be Terran or Hertak...

From our history, I think it can be safely said that armchair "Admiral'ing" can & will occur even before the historians get involved 

[Lorric]

The historians will be picking over the moves we made when this war is over with a fine toothcomb, judging us... but will those historians be Terran or Hertak...

From our history, I think it can be safely said that armchair "Admiral'ing" can & will occur even before the historians get involved 

Oh yes. Parasite press and politicians will be in long before the historians unfortunately, such is the burden that you and I share as Fleet Admirals...

Still, at least they didn't try to pass you off as a Cordi Shapeshifter!

[Droid803]

Dragon's doing a double-resupply at the front lines.
Welp, lets hope that doesn't draw the DoomStack™'s attention.

Also, bottling at Crux is irrelevant. Containing them at Aldebaran serves the same interests, really.
The Karoden scenario, however, is more interesting to explore.

[niffiwan]

it may offer an interesting choice to the Hierarchy, reinforce/support the Zy trapped behind enemy lines, or take out the 2nd LSF while they are vulnerable... lets just hope the ?? Hertak fleets doesn't let them do both...

[Lorric]

Also, bottling at Crux is irrelevant. Containing them at Aldebaran serves the same interests, really.
The Karoden scenario, however, is more interesting to explore.

It does offer a fall back though if you're in Crux to end up in the same position.

But in the end, things probably wouldn't be much different to what they are now. The Zy would open up the top with their jumps, and then probably open the bottom up as well. I bet we could have contained the Hertak in Kardoen you know, but the Zy can open up more fronts.

it may offer an interesting choice to the Hierarchy, reinforce/support the Zy trapped behind enemy lines, or take out the 2nd LSF while they are vulnerable... lets just hope the ?? Hertak fleets doesn't let them do both...

Indeed. I advised Dragon about the situation shortly after he made his move via PM, but who knows, it could pay off, I think the Hierarchy want to go up to the Zy, not to Hydra. They might kill Dragon, but then they won't be where they want to be. Any fleet in Hydra can't attack into Vega for 2 turns. That's two turns for us to (hopefully) maul them.

Rather him than me though. I'd be pulling back.

It's all about the ? Hertak fleet. They might be able to kill two of our fleets if they're powerful enough.

[Veers]

I still reckon that if they hit Hydra, it will put the pressure onto us to abandon Draco. Which helps break the stalemate that we've held them up with here in the Southern Sector. As it becomes a lot harder for us to reinforce that position through Vega (assuming Hydra is contested), and if Hydra does become contested, then Draco has to flee through 2 systems to get to a friendly location.

However, it's just speculation I'm going to help kill the 3rd Nordera first.

EDIT:

As for being able to have held or holding Crux and Karden. Interesting but you have no idea what would come knocking on your doorstep next turn, and they would attack immediately.

But if Karoden was held, it would give back Algol (+3), same with Draco and Hydra (+1 & +3). But hey, we're doing pretty well so far, and we'll just keep at it. Chipping away at the boulder

[Lorric]

2nd Zy, Crux -> Aldebaran -> Slipstream Vega ETA Turn 8
3rd Zy, Unknown -> Crux -> Slipstream Vega ETA Turn 9

Sneaky Zy. I didn't notice this before. This is just cheeky. Especially the 2nd Zy coming into Aldebaran and then "Slipstreaming" out, that system was empty of Hierarchy fleets and we couldn't even deal them retreat damage. I hope there's a cooldown/one time deal on that ability, because it's even more potent if the Zy can just backdoor out of systems without the retreat penalty. Since it only takes one action they could do nasty things like attack, then slipstream somewhere else, getting a guaranteed first strike when they arrive. If there's no limit on the move, they could just slipstream back and forth always getting the first strike and never being able to be pinned down. I imagine there must be some sort of limit on it though, or they'd be doing that already.

[Droid803]

Well, the question is, why the hell did they go to Aldebaran in the first place?
The other zy fleet slipstreamed from Crux just fine. Apparently it cut down a turn of slipstream travel or something, because it's "closer"?

Also, there was a Hierarchy fleet in Aldebaran : the 5th Cordi were there and ate it on the retreat. Presumably that covered the Zy?
I don't know if it quite works like that know.

[Lorric]

Well, the question is, why the hell did they go to Aldebaran in the first place?
The other zy fleet slipstreamed from Crux just fine. Apparently it cut down a turn of slipstream travel or something, because it's "closer"?

Also, there was a Hierarchy fleet in Aldebaran : the 5th Cordi were there and ate it on the retreat. Presumably that covered the Zy?
I don't know if it quite works like that know.

I'm sure it cut down the distance to the system, you can see it on the map.

If two fleets retreat, they both take damage, you can see it when the 1st Zy hit me and Jellyfish when we exited Tauri. I suppose it's possible the Cordi might have managed to cover the retreat of the 2nd Zy, but I think they were there to cover the retreat of the 1st Zy.

[X3N0-Life-Form]

Alright, I just posted my move, however, due to me not being able to get a steady connection until the deadline, I authorize other Sol Force admirals to override those orders if necessary.

[Lorric]

Alright, I just posted my move, however, due to me not being able to get a steady connection until the deadline, I authorize other Sol Force admirals to override those orders if necessary.

Hi. Your move should be the correct one. We need someone there to hold the Zy in check, and that someone is you.

Hopefully Enioch and someone else will be able to join you next turn.

[Spoon]

Right now I'm on antibiotics (for a possible lyme disease infection), and I'm feeling really sleepy because of it. I'm still on these meds for 7 more days so I'm gonna put the game onhold for a <undefined> period until I'm feeling yay and woohoo again. I'm not really suffering from any symptoms right now (aside from an occasional headache) but I just can't really concentrate on typing proper words or doing math.

So I'm not dying or anything (no need to panic, lorric) and we'll probably be back in business in a week from here.

[Lorric]

(no need to panic, lorric)

Oh well, in that case I won't need to be sending those nice anime nurses to go and take care of you...

Good luck with that Spoon.

[Flak]

That aside, any idea how the DD ships are going to look like?

[Lorric]

It's AndrewofDoom's birthday. Happy birthday!

How about a birthday present, Spoon? Another promotion? Some shiny new 4th Generation fighters?