[aldo_14]

Originally posted by daveb
On the .50 :

While I agree its odd, I can see the reason they designate it as not-for-use-against-infantry.

The reasoning is the same as follows : This isn't a well known fact, but standard NATO ammo is _specifically_ designed to wound and not to kill. That is, the rounds are full-metal-jacketed - designed to pierce completely _without_ expending all the energy on its target. Hence creating a wounded soldier almost as inert as a dead one.  This is in contrast to say, cheapo hunting ammo, which is specifically designed to mushroom on impact with a target to expend the maximum amount of energy on the target (stopping inside) and making the biggest hole.  (I always get kindof amused when people say - oOOoOOooo eeeeevil "military" ammo.  If I had a choice, I'd rather get hit with one of those evil military rounds rather than the somewhat PC hunting ammo).

Anyway, that gives you the flavor. The idea is to take out the enemy, not butcher him.  Granted this kind of flies in the face of the reality of artillery, grenade, etc, etc.  But no one has ever claimed that war makes sense.

 

Of course, if you shoot someone's leg off, or cripple them, it's win-win in war.  The guy is out of action (depending on the injury), it fills up the enmeys medical centres, his teammates have to carry him to safety or rescue him, making them targets*, and there's the dual burden of caring for the crippled soldier (in most countries) and also training and recruiting a replacement.  And, of course, you can capture, interrogate and 'trade' injured PoW's, but not bodybags.


*in fact, my grand-uncle died in Belgium during WW2 whilst on voluntary stretcher duty

[CODEDOG ND]

yea but that .308 doesnt have the velocity of the .223/5.56.  

M-1 sucks!  We don't need no teenage queen, we just want our M-14!  I found a good M-14 for sale the other day for 800.  Came with 2 stocks(wood and camoflauge Fiberglass) 2 30 round clips and 3 10 round clips, a sling, and a bipod.  The gunwas in pretty good shape, but I just spent all my money on another computer.    Put now I get to play FS2 and GR with a frame rate of about 200!

And on the full metal jacket.  The bullet WILL slide right on through without doing much damage UNLESS you hit a bone.  Then the steel jacket peels off and the aluminum alloy core flies right through you leaving the jacket somewhere in your body.  Either way, I don't really want to get shot by anything.

[daveb]

Either way, I don't really want to get shot by anything.

Indeed.

[Carl]

you know what's cool? now the tables have turned, and I can moderate Dave!


whee!

[Sandwich]

Originally posted by CODEDOG ND
I've heard that Vulcan before, that thing looked sweet.  I read somewhere IF you could hold down the trigger until it emptied out its ammo box without the barrels melting it would last only 18 seconds.

I wouldn't know - the only Vulcans I saw were on the bridge of the Enterprise..oops, sorry - wrong reference! They were mounted on an M113 APC, with a freaking huge barrel (think oil barrel size, not gun barrel) of ammo inside the APC. I think it held something like 1,500 rounds or so.

Originally posted by Warlock
And yea you could slap a mag from a 16 into it...and ? it's 30 rounds of .556 ammo ?

Get the decimal right! It's a 5.56mm round! The .50 cal is a half-inch round, which is where the confusion came in.

Originally posted by Warlock
heh no worries ,...sorry I should have stated on impact .....and actually...it's a .556 round ....the .223 is the "legal" civilian version of the m16,...the AR 15 or something like that.

Actually, the bullet doesn't tumble through the body - it spins. This spinnig, which stabilizes the bullet during flight, also makes it drastically swerve off "course" when it travels through anything more solid than air. Have you ever shot an M-16 through an ammo box full of water? You'll see that once the bullet penetrates into the water, it starts to go crazy. But it still travels with its nose pointing in the direction of movement - otherwise it would never make it all the way through a body - which it (usually) does.

Originally posted by Carl
you know what's cool? now the tables have turned, and I can moderate Dave!


whee!

[CP5670]

I'll just stick with my hydrogen bombs.

[killadonuts]

Originally posted by ^Graff
What I want to know is why they killed the gunman.  He was disarmed, and they had him pinned to the ground, and the security guard shot him twice in cold blood.   What the hell was he thinking?  What happened to Human Rights and a trial?  There was no reason why that man should have been shot.  They could at least have questioned him.

Nowadays, the US constitution is only a suggestion for the government.

[Warlock]

Originally posted by sandwich





Get the decimal right! It's a 5.56mm round! The .50 cal is a half-inch round, which is where the confusion came in.

Oops
[qoute]
Actually, the bullet doesn't tumble through the body - it spins. This spinnig, which stabilizes the bullet during flight, also makes it drastically swerve off "course" when it travels through anything more solid than air. Have you ever shot an M-16 through an ammo box full of water? You'll see that once the bullet penetrates into the water, it starts to go crazy. But it still travels with its nose pointing in the direction of movement - otherwise it would never make it all the way through a body - which it (usually) does.

[/B][/quote]


Just going off what my entire chain of command taught us while I was on active for 5 years *shrug*

To be technical,..ALL bullets spin. That's the entire concept of a rifled barrel. To cause the bullet to rotate as it passes through.

But since I'm not longer required to possibly kill ppl at a moment's notice ...I'm not too concerned with it anymore. Only thing I'm still fully knowledgable about from my time in was NVG repair

God I miss those toys

[daveb]

Re .223 : There's nothing "civilian" about the .223 as compared to 5.56. In practical terms its just a different designation for the same caliber.  In reality the two are actually very slightly different.  Same goes for 7.62x51 vs. 308.  I had a guy at the range hand me an extra box of surplus 7.62x51 as he was leaving. It shot just fine out of my .308, _but_ due to the thinner brass, the neck would expand much more harshly and I really had to tug the bolt hard to properly eject it. After a few of those, I didn't feel much like grinding my chamber with crapola Portugese surplus FMJ any more.

[CODEDOG ND]

Originally posted by daveb
Heh, SKS. The badge of the true enthusiast  

Actually the true enthusiast would own:

1.  Maxim Machine gun
2.  Colt Patterson Revolver
3.  Colt 1911 .45
4.  Brown Besse Musket
5.  Mausser
6.  Ak-47
7.  M-1
8.  Matchlock Musket
9.  Kentucky Rifle
10.  Browning BAR

And of course a Luger somewhere in the mix.  Unfortunaly, I only have a Kentucky Rifle out of all those. Some you need an FFL before you can have one.  But that Kentucky Rilfe runs circles around its competition.  I also have a Spanish Panther Rifle and it doesn't come clse to that Kentucky Rifle.





Gotta love the History Channel

[Warlock]

Well....does :

Ruger 10/22
Custom made CS Richmond Musket and Matched Carbine
Winchester 12 gauge
Browning buck mark .22  long
Beretta .25 (Forget the model...that tiny ass pistol)
Browning 306
,.........

hmmmm......ummmm.....lemme finish this after I visit my folks this weekend and peek back into the safe k ?

[Blue Lion]

Originally posted by CODEDOG ND






Gotta love the History Channel

[daveb]

What? No Winchester 1897 on that list? For shame.

*sniff*  All these classic piece are making me all weepy.

I'm a :

Rem 700 VS .308
Kimber 1911 Stainless Classic
Savage Mk II LV
Colt Python Elite 6" stainless

kinda guy

*glances at all the HLP members eyeing us with odd looks*

[Blue Lion]

I think we found a favorite subject of Daves

[daveb]

Of my hobbies, computers are only the #2 most expensive. It ain't the guns that cost - its feeding them  

[Stryke 9]

That's why you make your own. Molotov cocktails, anyone? How about a soup can grenade and 6" steel piping?

[Warlock]

Ain't that the truth!

Course I haven't been to the range in well over a year Even had to give up being active in the N-SSA because I just didn't have time to mold and load ammo anymore Least my Veteranship of 13 years stays

[daveb]

Heh. One of the guys at the range makes me give him my empties because he knows I don't reload. You can just see his eyes light up : once fired factory Remington brass? *drool*

'course, he shoots 300 yards with a 4x on an HK91, and I shoot 100 yards with a 14x - I defer to his needs

[Sandwich]

Originally posted by Stryke 9
That's why you make your own. Molotov cocktails, anyone? How about a soup can grenade and 6" steel piping?

Somehow I knew I could trust either you or an0n to bring this up. It's nice to see that you're so reliable.

Just don't try to bring any of that stuff over here - they'd laugh at your primitiveness.

Admins: I think DaveB needs a new title....

[vyper]

Just don't try to bring any of that stuff over here - they'd laugh at your primitiveness.

Don't they sell you Fighter parts?