Author Topic: OT - Right up your alley, CP!  (Read 5523 times)

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Offline Styxx

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OT - Right up your alley, CP!
Quote
Originally posted by CP5670
Aren't they both polynomial operators in the algebraic sense though? ( 4(x+1) and x³ )

Err, actually, I made a little mistake there. It's not "Processing time = ([input size] ^ 3)", it's "Processing time = (3 ^[input size])". My bad. :p

Quote
Originally posted by CP5670
Actually, the practical uses all occur in quantum theory, but seriously who cares about that? :D The important thing will be that the solution of the RH will reveal why the prime numbers are distributed the way they are, and thus solve many other fundamental problems in number theory.

Bah, my problem is much cooler, and actually has practical applications in everyday's life. It 0wnZ your problem. :D

Quote
Originally posted by CP5670
Eh...you are going to prove it through semantics (study of meanings in a linguistic sense) instead of symbolic logic? :wtf: :p Read that book I mentioned earlier; it has been proven that this task cannot be done and that mathematics is not an independently self-consistent system. (Gödel's incompleteness theorem)

Argh, I won't go into specifics of formal semantics, but yes - you can prove it through symbolic logic applied to semantic constructs. Mathematical constructs are nothing but a very simple and objective language, and you can analyse it's semanthics as well (or even better, due to it's inherent simplicity) as any other language. And in the end, 1+1 will equal 2, whatever symbols you define for each of the elements.

The proof that you mentioned (that I didn't really look into) must have been tried using only mathematical constructs, and that indeed will not be possible. You need a higher level logic to analyse semanthics.


(note: I'm not even checking the equations on this thread, so don't point me to any of those things :D :p )
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Offline aldo_14

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OT - Right up your alley, CP!
An NP problem means that the validity of a possible solution can be performed in polynomial time.  The actual, solution cannot be found in polynomial time.... it's improtant in making suppossably 'unbreakable' codes which can actually be verified, like in encryption.

 

Offline Zeronet

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OT - Right up your alley, CP!
If you cant solve a problem, nuke it!
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Offline aldo_14

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OT - Right up your alley, CP!
Quote
Originally posted by Zeronet
If you cant solve a problem, nuke it!


So.... if you can't figure out how to get into your house when you've locked yerself out, blow the whole house up?

I thik I'll try that.... :devilidea

 

Offline Sandwich

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OT - Right up your alley, CP!
Gosh - this has stayed on-topic! *stunned look on face*
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"...The quintessential quality of our age is that of dreams coming true. Just think of it. For centuries we have dreamt of flying; recently we made that come true: we have always hankered for speed; now we have speeds greater than we can stand: we wanted to speak to far parts of the Earth; we can: we wanted to explore the sea bottom; we have: and so  on, and so on: and, too, we wanted the power to smash our enemies utterly; we have it. If we had truly wanted peace, we should have had that as well. But true peace has never been one of the genuine dreams - we have got little further than preaching against war in order to appease our consciences. The truly wishful dreams, the many-minded dreams are now irresistible - they become facts." - 'The Outward Urge' by John Wyndham

"The very essence of tolerance rests on the fact that we have to be intolerant of intolerance. Stretching right back to Kant, through the Frankfurt School and up to today, liberalism means that we can do anything we like as long as we don't hurt others. This means that if we are tolerant of others' intolerance - especially when that intolerance is a call for genocide - then all we are doing is allowing that intolerance to flourish, and allowing the violence that will spring from that intolerance to continue unabated." - Bren Carlill

 

Offline Styxx

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OT - Right up your alley, CP!
Quote
Originally posted by sandwich
Gosh - this has stayed on-topic! *stunned look on face*


Now, tell us the truth - what you really wanted was to have us all buggin' CP again, right? :D
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Offline Zeronet

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Quote
Originally posted by aldo_14


So.... if you can't figure out how to get into your house when you've locked yerself out, blow the whole house up?

I thik I'll try that.... :devilidea


Exactly!
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Offline CP5670

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OT - Right up your alley, CP!
Quote
Err, actually, I made a little mistake there. It's not "Processing time = ([input size] ^ 3)", it's "Processing time = (3 ^[input size])". My bad.  


I thought it might be something like that. ;)

Quote
Bah, my problem is much cooler, and actually has practical applications in everyday's life. It 0wnZ your problem. :D


Who gives a crap about practical applications? :p Hardy, the guy I mentioned earlier, once said that if the math is useful, then it is not worth learning - only useless math is good math - and I have some sympathy for this. :D Some of these mathematicians are on the brink of insanity due to a lack of knowledge on how the prime number distribution works. :D

Quote
Argh, I won't go into specifics of formal semantics, but yes - you can prove it through symbolic logic applied to semantic constructs. Mathematical constructs are nothing but a very simple and objective language, and you can analyse it's semanthics as well (or even better, due to it's inherent simplicity) as any other language. And in the end, 1+1 will equal 2,
whatever symbols you define for each of the elements.

The proof that you mentioned (that I didn't really look into) must have been tried using only mathematical constructs, and that indeed will not be possible. You need a higher level logic to analyse semanthics.


:wtf: Are you saying that human language is "higher level" than mathematical logic for analyzing such problems? :D Also, unlike some other topics out there (such as that of the cardinality of the real numbers), that proof I mentioned earlier is indeed globally accepted. Somewhere in the proof you probably assumed that addition works without knowing it; that has been the case with all such proofs out there. ;)

Incidentally, have you heard of Hilbert's famous 23 problems? The 8th one (the RH one) is really cool, but the 19th and 23rd ones are even better IMO. :D
« Last Edit: July 11, 2002, 05:38:10 pm by 296 »

 
OT - Right up your alley, CP!
There are two current claims to the proof of the Riemann hypothesis. They're

here

and

here

And another big conjecture solved recently other than Fermat's last theorem is Catalan's conjecture that if you create a large table of numbers which are the powers of two (ie 4,8,16,32,64...etc), three (9,27,81, etc), four, five, etc, none of the numbers have a difference of exactly 1 apart from 8 and 9 (2^3 and 3^2).
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Offline CP5670

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OT - Right up your alley, CP!
Those articles are both by the same guy; I looked through them and saw some rather strange assumptions and a few parts that were not really done right. (since when does Li(x) equal the integral of 1/x? :p) Thing is, with all of these types of problems, there have been (and still are) thousands of cranks out there that have claimed to prove it. :p :D

I have heard of the Catalan's cojecture as well; another interesting problem that was solved very recently, only about two months ago. Although this one is related more to classical number theory rather than analytic number theory, which is what I am into. :D

 

Offline Kellan

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OT - Right up your alley, CP!
OH, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD!!! :eek: :eek2:

I go away for 2 weeks, come back and find that MENSA have taken over the HLPBB. What's up with that? :wtf: :p

 

Offline an0n

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OT - Right up your alley, CP!
See, now did anyone listen when I said MENSA were trying to take over the world? No. See what happens when you don't listen?
"I.....don't.....CARE!!!!!" ---- an0n
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Offline Stryke 9

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OT - Right up your alley, CP!
I always thought it was the Freemasons...

That or the UN. Keep your story straight.:D

 

Offline Kellan

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OT - Right up your alley, CP!
Quote
Originally posted by Stryke 9
I always thought it was the Freemasons...

That or the UN. Keep your story straight.:D


But that's the problem! MENSA or the UN or the Freemasons have been twisting world events so expertly that we just can't tell what's going on anymore! :nervous: Who is the real enemy? To be honest, I just don't know. :shaking:

Beafraid. Trustnoone.

 

Offline an0n

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OT - Right up your alley, CP!
*grabs flame-thrower*
Viva la revelution!
*goes to burn down MENSA*
"I.....don't.....CARE!!!!!" ---- an0n
"an0n's right. He's crazy, an asshole, not to be trusted, rarely to be taken seriously, and never to be allowed near your mother. But, he's got a knack for being right. In the worst possible way he can find." ---- Yuppygoat
~-=~!@!~=-~ : Nodewar.com

 

Offline Sandwich

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OT - Right up your alley, CP!
Quote
Originally posted by Stryke 9
I always thought it was the Freemasons...


Now, in all seriousness, that is a society that's truly frightening... :nervous:
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"...The quintessential quality of our age is that of dreams coming true. Just think of it. For centuries we have dreamt of flying; recently we made that come true: we have always hankered for speed; now we have speeds greater than we can stand: we wanted to speak to far parts of the Earth; we can: we wanted to explore the sea bottom; we have: and so  on, and so on: and, too, we wanted the power to smash our enemies utterly; we have it. If we had truly wanted peace, we should have had that as well. But true peace has never been one of the genuine dreams - we have got little further than preaching against war in order to appease our consciences. The truly wishful dreams, the many-minded dreams are now irresistible - they become facts." - 'The Outward Urge' by John Wyndham

"The very essence of tolerance rests on the fact that we have to be intolerant of intolerance. Stretching right back to Kant, through the Frankfurt School and up to today, liberalism means that we can do anything we like as long as we don't hurt others. This means that if we are tolerant of others' intolerance - especially when that intolerance is a call for genocide - then all we are doing is allowing that intolerance to flourish, and allowing the violence that will spring from that intolerance to continue unabated." - Bren Carlill