[Bobboau]

where is the autopsy report?

[Aardwolf]

@deathfun: the "35 feet" figure comes from http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-28841715

"According to Mr Belmar, there was a distance of 35ft between Mr Wilson and Mr Brown when he was shot."

no car is mentioned not between the car and Brown, but between Wilson and Brown

[deathfun]

@deathfun: the "35 feet" figure comes from http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-28841715

"According to Mr Belmar, there was a distance of 35ft between Mr Wilson and Mr Brown when he was shot."

no car is mentioned not between the car and Brown, but between Wilson and Brown

http://www.vox.com/cards/mike-brown-protests-ferguson-missouri/mike-brown-shooting-facts-details

"4) At least one round was fired from inside Wilson's squad car. Brown died about 35 feet from the car."
Notice how it's the same 35 feet number, only instead of relation to Wilson it was in relation to Wilson's squad car?

However, given that that it was Belmar who said between the two people involved, I'm more inclined to give that report merit


As for the autopsy part with grazed bullets, seems like I confused conflicting bits and for that I was incorrect
Here's that anyhow for you Bobb
http://www.vox.com/2014/8/17/6029685/autopsy-michael-brown-shot-at-least-six-times

"One of the bullets appears to have hit the top of Brown's head. "This one here looks like his head was bent downward," Dr. Michael Baden, who conducted the autopsy on behalf of Brown's family, told the New York Times. "It can be because he's giving up, or because he's charging forward at the officer.""

I had already quoted that earlier

EDIT: Also Bobb, click the link by Aardwolf, it has even more depth to that prelim autopsy

[MP-Ryan]

I'm going to assume MP-Ryan doesn't particularly feel inclined to join in on the discussion, based on his inactivity for the last few pages, and take up the mantle in providing meaningful numbers.  I know for a fact that several times in threads where members participating in this thread were also watching that MP-Ryan has mentioned a very important number: 21.

MP-Ryan has been away on a much needed vacation and avoided the Internet for the past week, so he's getting caught up

But yes, the general training assumption is 21 feet is the average reactionary gap.  And as for the notion that an unarmed person 35 feet away cannot be a lethal threat... I'm sorry to tell you that is inaccurate.  You have slightly MORE reaction time, but not a lot.  What remains to be seen is if the officer had a reasonable belief that Brown had both intent and means at the time to inflict death or grievous bodily harm upon the officer or another person, as that is the required standard for self-defense, even [at least theoretically, this being the US] for police officers.

By the way, a couple pieces of mandatory reading for people interested in the topic of police militarization:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-watch/wp/2014/08/21/dallas-pd-leaders-speak-out-on-police-shootings-militarization-and-protest/
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-watch/wp/2014/08/14/after-ferguson-how-should-police-respond-to-protests/

Twitter users, Balko is worth following.

[MP-Ryan]

I caught hints of it earlier on as I was reading and didn't actually notice who said it, but I'll address it anyway:

The use of force continuum moves in both directions.  If a person's statements and actions at one moment convey intent+means to cause death/grievous bodily harm, but a minute later that same person's actions no longer show that intent, but rather intent to escape, the calculus of what is reasonable force changes.

I.e., if someone breaks my face in a severe assault and I believe he's trying to kill me or maim me, I can kill him.  If I don't kill him, and he stops attacking, turns, and starts sprinting aaway and shows no continuing or resurgence of intent to kill/maim I cannot legally kill him in self-defense.  Where precisely that line of intent appears is up to first, the authorities who choose to prosecute, second, the prosecutor, third, a judge (and/or grand jury), and fourth, a judge and/or selected jury.

[Aardwolf]

That's what I was saying :c

[Mr. Vega]

There's now a report that that the FBI has obtained audio of the shooting from a video chat that was running nearby when the shooting occurred. The audio indicates at least 10 shots were fired: a burst of 6, a pause, and then 4 more shots. The recording has not yet been authenticated.

[karajorma]

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2014/08/senator-wants-all-us-cops-to-wear-video-cameras/

"Everywhere I go, people now have cameras," McCaskill said Tuesday during a question-and-answer session with voters in her home state. "And police officers are now at a disadvantage because someone can tape the last part of an encounter and not tape the first part of the encounter. And it gives the impression that the police officer has overreacted when they haven't."

Now that's exactly what I meant earlier about selling the idea properly.

[karajorma]

Yet again, a ****ing comedy website proves to be better at explaining what's going on than most news websites.

[jr2]

Well  that seems to cast some severe doubt on the officers (and Ferguson PD in general)  's side of things...

:headdesk:

[Mr. Vega]

Company that ran the chat service has confirmed that the time the recording was being streamed matches the time of the shooting.

And that "police report"? The entire department is acting like a criminal who knows it's better to say nothing while in custody.

I'm now starting to believe that this was a murder.

[jr2]

In support of body cams (dash cam doesn't show the reason for officer's takedown)

Video from two angles :

http://www.policeone.com/police-products/body-cameras/articles/7502017-Chief-Assault-of-cop-takedown-of-suspect-proves-utility-of-body-cams

[S-99]

The "paintball marker" takes a while to notice, and it's the only indication they're not the military.

I don't see how this picture was taken out of context since the topic is about militarization of police, and will show off the militarizing of police. Dude with the paintball gun makes me think sadist perhaps since he's the only one with a paintball gun. I'm back btw.

I'd rather get shot with a pepper ball then with the actual bullets the rest of these forces seem to be using.

I'm also thinking someone who was trigger happy wanted the paintball gun just to shoot some people. Soemone hears some pop noises, but no one actually got killed (but someone on the ground anyway) to be discovered later is surely police intending intimidation. I have a rather great dislike for law enforcement, all of it circles abuse of authority.