Author Topic: Squadrons?  (Read 3800 times)

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I am currently creating a campaign:Icanus took out the Gigas,EA joined GTVA.Terrans and Vasudans are starting attack on the Shivans beyond Fomalhaut system.In Ross 128 they meet the Ancients(which i called Celebrai)that help them with the Shleak(Shivans).They make an alliance and start joint ops attacks on the Shivans.

That's the beginning,i have other ideas for later use.

Since player is based on the GTCa Independence i would like to ask if there are any known squadrons on the Independence and if there are,can i use them.

 

Offline Nyctaeus

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Hummm... Really?

I mean, it's not a bad idea but Inferno is just insanely old, models are low poly, ugly and probably buggy as hell. I think you should make a modpack from newer, prettier and bug-free assets.
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Well,my PC is to old to run high poly ships,so i must use INFR1.

Its too old to even install SCP without freezing.

I personally like those low poly models,and i haven't found any bug yet.

 
Hummm... Really?

I mean, it's not a bad idea but Inferno is just insanely old, models are low poly, ugly and probably buggy as hell. I think you should make a modpack from newer, prettier and bug-free assets.

When i complete that campaign it will be on FSMods and HLP...if you are interested.

Hard to finish over hundred missions by myself,will take some time.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2014, 05:05:23 am by wardog300 »

 

Offline Nyctaeus

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We may port it on INFR1U when it's done. Everything is here, except the SOC models from INFR1.

Hundred of missions? Nobody ever made a campaign that long. The longest so far are Aftermath [54 missions], Derelict [46] and my own product - Shadow Genesis with 47 missions. All three are way too long and takes too much time to beat each one. Believe me, freding, testing and bugfixing of campaign that long are hell to pay.

If this is your first project, may I suggest something? Young modders are often overambitious with their first projects. Me and my Shadow Genesis are a good example... And probably one of not many finished and released examples of this :P. I strongly advice You to make something like 10-15 missions long smaller campaign, or even shorter, but focused on quality of missions. Nobody wants to play a campaign with dozens of boring missions with originality of brazilian soap opera. Aftermath is exactly like that.
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Offline The E

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Yeah, a hundred missions is a lot. I think that the optimum size for a campaign is somewhere between 25 and 35 missions; that's enough to tell a good story arc, while offering enough room to do varied gameplay without getting too repetitive.
Let there be light
Let there be moon
Let there be stars and let there be you
Let there be monsters and let there be pain
Let us begin to feel again
--Devin Townsend, Genesis

 
My plan is to create long campaign which has similarities to other ones.Like Main one,INFR1,homesick...
Its not my first campaign,i have created:Homesick copy for FS2,Reconstruction for FS1,and failed 9th fleet for FS1.

This is first one i plan on releasing,demo with 20-30 missions will be on FSmods ones i finish them.

I remember seeing one campaign that has 88 missions here on HLP,but it cant be downloaded.

I create 10 mission quite quickly in 9 steps:

1.Imagination
2.Base:Ships,Beam-free events and initial orders
3.Testing
4.Upgrade 1:changing what needs to be changed,adding objectives,renaming events.
5.Testing 2
6.Upgrading 2:Messages,additional events,directives,escort list
7.Testing 3
8.Balancing everything
9.Testing

 

Offline Nyctaeus

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http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php/9th_Fleet

Is [or rather was] this yours? Well, if you have some modding experiance, go ahead.
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Offline CT27

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We may port it on INFR1U when it's done. Everything is here, except the SOC models from INFR1.

Hundred of missions? Nobody ever made a campaign that long. The longest so far are Aftermath [54 missions], Derelict [46] and my own product - Shadow Genesis with 47 missions. All three are way too long and takes too much time to beat each one. Believe me, freding, testing and bugfixing of campaign that long are hell to pay.

If this is your first project, may I suggest something? Young modders are often overambitious with their first projects. Me and my Shadow Genesis are a good example... And probably one of not many finished and released examples of this :P. I strongly advice You to make something like 10-15 missions long smaller campaign, or even shorter, but focused on quality of missions. Nobody wants to play a campaign with dozens of boring missions with originality of brazilian soap opera. Aftermath is exactly like that.

Would it be okay with you if I try to stick up for Aftermath a little bit (it's hardly perfect but I found some good things there...though I will admit it could have had the # of missions on it cut down)?

;)



As for the OP:  100 missions, wow.  All I can say is good luck.

 
http://www.hard-light.net/wiki/index.php/9th_Fleet

Is [or rather was] this yours? Well, if you have some modding experiance, go ahead.

No,graphic card on the pc i worked on died,so all fifteen missions are lost.

 
Since i didn't got answer on my question i replaced Independence with GTCa Santa Maria,and added eight squadron i created.

I am however having one problem:Whenever something fires on TSJ Icanus it starts shaking like crazy,damaging or destroying fighters, EACv America(Darkness) and sometimes even damages Santa Maria.

It starts shaking when its hit by primaries of scorpions attacking it,and if GVFr Shai doesn't destroy Sathanas in time it might even destroy Santa Maria,because of shaking.

 

Offline Nyctaeus

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While I dunno your mission design, looks like too small mass or lack of MOI problem.

I fixed both for you. This might help, check this pof:
http://www.mediafire.com/download/cet3xqg5pjtq5mf/icanus.pof
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While I dunno your mission design, looks like too small mass or lack of MOI problem.

I fixed both for you. This might help, check this pof:
http://www.mediafire.com/download/cet3xqg5pjtq5mf/icanus.pof


Icanus.pof goes into models,right?

 

Offline Nyctaeus

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While I dunno your mission design, looks like too small mass or lack of MOI problem.

I fixed both for you. This might help, check this pof:
http://www.mediafire.com/download/cet3xqg5pjtq5mf/icanus.pof


Icanus.pof goes into models,right?
Yup
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Icanus.pof file actually made it worse.It shakes even more,and its main cannon seems to be stronger.Two ships are supposed to jump in front of it the hostile Iblis and unknown Pylos,And while aiming onto Iblis,the beam also goes into Pylos,destroying both ships in a second.

 

Offline Black Wolf

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Yeah, a hundred missions is a lot. I think that the optimum size for a campaign is somewhere between 25 and 35 missions; that's enough to tell a good story arc, while offering enough room to do varied gameplay without getting too repetitive.


I realize that this is entirely subjective, but I'd argue that even those numbers are to high. IMO, if you're aiming at much beyond 20-25 missions, you're starting to get into major campaign territory, and your odds of getting it finished start to drop off precipitously. Not to mention the fact that huge numbers of missions are often more the result of either story bloat or the creator trying to hit some specific target (eg 100 missions). When you look at the most successful recent campaigns, there's a definite preference for shorter, tighter campaigns that focus on quality missions target than quantity. ST:R had 16 missions, as did WiH's first release. VD had nine, of which only six were playable. Even AoA, which I remember as being quite a long campaign, only had 22 missions. Contrast those campaigns with Shadow Genesis, which was a massive campaign with lots of missions, but was received much less positively by the community.

I think that the sixteen mission mark is pretty much the magic number. You get three missions of buildup, ten to play out your plot, and three for a big climax at the end. 16 is also, I think, pretty close to the maximum number that any FREDder can realistically expect to do by themselves and keep the quality and variety up high. Sure, some can do more, some fewer (Darius famously did AoA on his own, while I only managed a half a dozen or so on FL before I had to get help), but it'll be a rare individual who can do twenty five plus within one project.

I recognize that there are some stories that simply can't be told in that number of missions, but I think that really good quality campaigns can be and have been made on relatively small mission budgets. 100 missions is... Unnecessary, if I'm entirely honest. I'd strongly recommend that you aim for something a little more attainable WarDog.
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Yeah, a hundred missions is a lot. I think that the optimum size for a campaign is somewhere between 25 and 35 missions; that's enough to tell a good story arc, while offering enough room to do varied gameplay without getting too repetitive.


I realize that this is entirely subjective, but I'd argue that even those numbers are to high. IMO, if you're aiming at much beyond 20-25 missions, you're starting to get into major campaign territory, and your odds of getting it finished start to drop off precipitously. Not to mention the fact that huge numbers of missions are often more the result of either story bloat or the creator trying to hit some specific target (eg 100 missions). When you look at the most successful recent campaigns, there's a definite preference for shorter, tighter campaigns that focus on quality missions target than quantity. ST:R had 16 missions, as did WiH's first release. VD had nine, of which only six were playable. Even AoA, which I remember as being quite a long campaign, only had 22 missions. Contrast those campaigns with Shadow Genesis, which was a massive campaign with lots of missions, but was received much less positively by the community.

I think that the sixteen mission mark is pretty much the magic number. You get three missions of buildup, ten to play out your plot, and three for a big climax at the end. 16 is also, I think, pretty close to the maximum number that any FREDder can realistically expect to do by themselves and keep the quality and variety up high. Sure, some can do more, some fewer (Darius famously did AoA on his own, while I only managed a half a dozen or so on FL before I had to get help), but it'll be a rare individual who can do twenty five plus within one project.

I recognize that there are some stories that simply can't be told in that number of missions, but I think that really good quality campaigns can be and have been made on relatively small mission budgets. 100 missions is... Unnecessary, if I'm entirely honest. I'd strongly recommend that you aim for something a little more attainable WarDog.

Main reason for 100 missions is that story needs a lot of missions with Shivan ambushes,nebula exploration,retreating,etc...

All that could not fit inside a 15 mission campaign.

I am aiming at about 50-70 missions,rest will be branches,i.e for different objectives in previous missions,and i am probably going to do some SOC,so yeah,Revenge:Final conflict is still going to be the one with most missions,sadly it cannot be downloaded.

 
Yeah, a campaign in the 10-16 range is big enough for today's standards. 25-35 seems huge to me; my own campaign had something like 27 missions planned, which seemed reasonable at first, given that rate which missions were getting created back then during the initial push, but it's become significantly harder to manage past the 15 missions mark.

 

Offline The E

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Main reason for 100 missions is that story needs a lot of missions with Shivan ambushes,nebula exploration,retreating,etc...

All that could not fit inside a 15 mission campaign.

I am aiming at about 50-70 missions,rest will be branches,i.e for different objectives in previous missions,and i am probably going to do some SOC,so yeah,Revenge:Final conflict is still going to be the one with most missions,sadly it cannot be downloaded.

Does it really?

Here's what I'm thinking about this. Yes, you could make a game showing every single minor and major engagement that, for example, US naval forces took part in in WW2's pacific theatre. But that's not a story. That's a series of events that are happening. Just like FS2 retail concentrates on one corner of the second shivan incursion (namely, the corner that the Aquitaine and Psamtik are in) but makes it very clear that that's not the only thing that is happening, so should you take a long hard look at all the events that you have planned out and ask yourself if the player has to be present for each and every one of them.

The campaign you've planned is massively ambitious, and while ambition is a good thing to have, it can also blind you towards evaluating your own work critically. The question you should ask yourself is, am I telling an engaging and coherent story here? Am I able to make the pieces of the puzzle engaging enough so that people will be willing to see this story through?
Let there be light
Let there be moon
Let there be stars and let there be you
Let there be monsters and let there be pain
Let us begin to feel again
--Devin Townsend, Genesis

 
Main reason for 100 missions is that story needs a lot of missions with Shivan ambushes,nebula exploration,retreating,etc...

All that could not fit inside a 15 mission campaign.

I am aiming at about 50-70 missions,rest will be branches,i.e for different objectives in previous missions,and i am probably going to do some SOC,so yeah,Revenge:Final conflict is still going to be the one with most missions,sadly it cannot be downloaded.

Does it really?

Here's what I'm thinking about this. Yes, you could make a game showing every single minor and major engagement that, for example, US naval forces took part in in WW2's pacific theatre. But that's not a story. That's a series of events that are happening. Just like FS2 retail concentrates on one corner of the second shivan incursion (namely, the corner that the Aquitaine and Psamtik are in) but makes it very clear that that's not the only thing that is happening, so should you take a long hard look at all the events that you have planned out and ask yourself if the player has to be present for each and every one of them.

The campaign you've planned is massively ambitious, and while ambition is a good thing to have, it can also blind you towards evaluating your own work critically. The question you should ask yourself is, am I telling an engaging and coherent story here? Am I able to make the pieces of the puzzle engaging enough so that people will be willing to see this story through?

Know about new planet discovered near sun?Idea is that planet is the only gate to the Shivan birthplace,and only way to get back is by Gigas.So they try bringing one into Sol,and GTVA thinks they are trying to detonate the Sun.That's only idea of near the end.Till then Shivans will attack from Fomalhaut and Capella.And GTVA must hold off.Entire campaign will be beyond Ross 128,and Fomalhaut,at the begining,then Shivans will have GTVA cornered insade the Sol.While they control Vega,Beta Aquilae and Delta Serpentis only attacks are for defence,they will not attack stations and planets.