Author Topic: Female characters done both wrong and right.  (Read 6453 times)

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Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
What gamers really need is the lead character undressing herself in front of the audience 2 minutes after starting a new game.

  

Offline Spoon

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Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
@Lorric, cheers.
But you vastly overestimate any kind of influence and prominence that I might have. I'm just some guy who has strong opinions about nudity in games and who gets annoyed at people writing poor preachy articles.

also think Spoon above is completely off-base.
Nah, I'm pretty on-base.

What gamers really need is the lead character undressing herself in front of the audience 2 minutes after starting a new game.

He says, mockingly.
But I unsarcastically agree that it's a nice option to have.
Urutorahappī!!

[02:42] <@Axem> spoon somethings wrong
[02:42] <@Axem> critically wrong
[02:42] <@Axem> im happy with these missions now
[02:44] <@Axem> well
[02:44] <@Axem> with 2 of them

 
Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
Yes, that is obvious :P

 

Offline Spoon

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Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
Yes, that is obvious :P
I mean, this kind of passive-aggressive style of posting I've come to expect from you, it's very Joshua-esque. I already figured what you were trying to get at, but I don't really get what kind of point you were trying to get across? So I'd just like you to be direct here, what were you trying to say exactly? Were you just being passive-aggressive for the heck of it? Were you trying to make some kind of point or?
Urutorahappī!!

[02:42] <@Axem> spoon somethings wrong
[02:42] <@Axem> critically wrong
[02:42] <@Axem> im happy with these missions now
[02:44] <@Axem> well
[02:44] <@Axem> with 2 of them

 
Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
If you want to look at porn, then go look at porn. Don't act like it should be in games. A lot of people don't want to see that. And sexual objectification is a real issue that impacts people negatively in the real world.
Shivans view most other species the way we view infectious diseases. They think they are doing good by curing the universe of them. After all, no one mourns the fate of smallpox.

The Final War For The Multiverse

 

Offline Enioch

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Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
If you want to look at porn, then go look at porn. Don't act like it should be in games. A lot of people don't want to see that.

Then don't buy the game. Games are rated for a reason. A lot of people do want to see that.

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And sexual objectification is a real issue that impacts people negatively in the real world.

Indeed. And when it's unsolicited, it's reprehensible in the real world.

We are discussing games. Fiction.

Also, point of order: I would argue that, for legitimate criticism of sexual objectification to be levied against a character and its creator, it is insufficient for the character's sexual attributes to be highlighted to an above-average degree. A fictional character can be heavily sexualised and still be a compelling, multifaceted character.
'Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent'  -Salvor Hardin, "Foundation"

So don't take a hammer to your computer. ;-)

 

Offline Spoon

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Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
If you want to look at porn, then go look at porn. Don't act like it should be in games. A lot of people don't want to see that. And sexual objectification is a real issue that impacts people negatively in the real world.
Don't act like it shouldn't be in games. Who the heck are you to decide that for everyone else? You're not my mom.
Also:
A lot of people do want to see that.

Also +1 to the rest of what Enioch said.
Urutorahappī!!

[02:42] <@Axem> spoon somethings wrong
[02:42] <@Axem> critically wrong
[02:42] <@Axem> im happy with these missions now
[02:44] <@Axem> well
[02:44] <@Axem> with 2 of them

 
Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
Like I said, if you want to see that, that's what porn is for. Keep it separate from other media. As an asexual, I find it to be annoying and distracting. I want to play a game with an interesting story, immersive environment, good gameplay, and challenging (but not frustratingly hard) objectives.

If a game is clearly advertised as a porn game, that's one thing. But if you have what looks to be an interesting and fun game it can be ruined by putting that stuff into it.
Shivans view most other species the way we view infectious diseases. They think they are doing good by curing the universe of them. After all, no one mourns the fate of smallpox.

The Final War For The Multiverse

 

Offline Spoon

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Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
Again, you don't get to decide that for me. I don't care what you want to see specifically in games, my dude. I also don't care what sexuality you have or what you find annoying and distracting. You don't get the right to force your likes and dislikes upon me or the rest of us. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ The sooner you come to terms with this fact of reality, the easier it will be for you.

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But if you have what looks to be an interesting and fun game it can be ruined by putting that stuff into it.
Or enhance the fun and interesting game even more. That's a matter of opinion and perspective.

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And sexual objectification is a real issue that impacts people negatively in the real world.
So is violence, but I guess that's fine in games.
Urutorahappī!!

[02:42] <@Axem> spoon somethings wrong
[02:42] <@Axem> critically wrong
[02:42] <@Axem> im happy with these missions now
[02:44] <@Axem> well
[02:44] <@Axem> with 2 of them

 

Offline Enioch

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Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
As an asexual, I find it to be annoying and distracting.

That is a more than valid complaint. From your perspective.

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I want to play a game with an interesting story, immersive environment, good gameplay, and challenging (but not frustratingly hard) objectives.

That is also a very valid set of preferences, and props to you for knowing exactly what you want as a consumer.

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If a game is clearly advertised as a porn game, that's one thing. But if you have what looks to be an interesting and fun game it can be ruined by putting that stuff into it.

(As above) - yes, I imagine it could ruin a game for you.

But for me, and a lot of other people, it would not. It might even enhance the game, if done carefully. Also:

Like I said, if you want to see that, that's what porn is for. Keep it separate from other media.

Porn serves one purpose. The presence of a sexually titillating character in a fictional context, whether game, book, film or other medium serves a range of other functions.

Ultimately:

 
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I want to play a game [...]

Make it, pay people to make it, or reward people who make it by buying it.

I'd love to play a game like that too, but I (and many other people) do not object at all to the presence of sexual content in our fiction. Not even our interactive fiction.
'Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent'  -Salvor Hardin, "Foundation"

So don't take a hammer to your computer. ;-)

 
Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
As an asexual, I find it to be annoying and distracting.

That is a more than valid complaint. From your perspective.

Quote
I want to play a game with an interesting story, immersive environment, good gameplay, and challenging (but not frustratingly hard) objectives.

That is also a very valid set of preferences, and props to you for knowing exactly what you want as a consumer.

Quote
If a game is clearly advertised as a porn game, that's one thing. But if you have what looks to be an interesting and fun game it can be ruined by putting that stuff into it.

(As above) - yes, I imagine it could ruin a game for you.

But for me, and a lot of other people, it would not. It might even enhance the game, if done carefully. Also:

Like I said, if you want to see that, that's what porn is for. Keep it separate from other media.

Porn serves one purpose. The presence of a sexually titillating character in a fictional context, whether game, book, film or other medium serves a range of other functions.

Ultimately:

 
Quote
I want to play a game [...]

Make it, pay people to make it, or reward people who make it by buying it.

I'd love to play a game like that too, but I (and many other people) do not object at all to the presence of sexual content in our fiction. Not even our interactive fiction.

But do you have to put it in everything, even where it has no place being? (i.e. medieval armor bikinis)

Shivans view most other species the way we view infectious diseases. They think they are doing good by curing the universe of them. After all, no one mourns the fate of smallpox.

The Final War For The Multiverse

 

Offline Enioch

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Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.

But do you have to put it in everything, even where it has no place being? (i.e. medieval armor bikinis)


Have to? No. Should be able to? Yes.
'Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent'  -Salvor Hardin, "Foundation"

So don't take a hammer to your computer. ;-)

 
Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.

But do you have to put it in everything, even where it has no place being? (i.e. medieval armor bikinis)


Have to? No. Should be able to? Yes.

What about my right to play a game without such content?

I'm assuming that you are a heterosexual male (correct me if I'm wrong). How would you feel if you had difficulty finding a game that didn't have gratuitous male fanservice, and everyone insisted that you had no right to object to it?
Shivans view most other species the way we view infectious diseases. They think they are doing good by curing the universe of them. After all, no one mourns the fate of smallpox.

The Final War For The Multiverse

 
Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
Most if not all games are made for 1 purpose. And no, that's not spiritually enlightening. Not even to be fun. It's to make money, plain and simple. So as long as you don't earn incredible amounts of money, you'll have to take what's being given to you.

 

Offline Colonol Dekker

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Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
Mass effect allowed male on male or male on female *if you chose a female lead*.    It didn't bother me.

 
Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
Mass effect allowed male on male or male on female *if you chose a female lead*.    It didn't bother me.

But were all of the male characters overly sexualized all of the time in every situation, regardless of what choices you made in the game?

Shivans view most other species the way we view infectious diseases. They think they are doing good by curing the universe of them. After all, no one mourns the fate of smallpox.

The Final War For The Multiverse

 
Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
Yes, that is obvious :P
I mean, this kind of passive-aggressive style of posting I've come to expect from you, it's very Joshua-esque. I already figured what you were trying to get at, but I don't really get what kind of point you were trying to get across? So I'd just like you to be direct here, what were you trying to say exactly? Were you just being passive-aggressive for the heck of it? Were you trying to make some kind of point or?

It's not intended to be passive aggressive, sorry! I was just making a tongue-in-cheek allusion to Wings of Dawn, which I do not hold in contempt in any way (although I haven't gotten to the much maligned combat simulator missions yet :P ). If anything, I got the notion from it that it's not intended to be taken seriously?

But do you have to put it in everything, even where it has no place being? (i.e. medieval armor bikinis)
Have to? No. Should be able to? Yes.

The argument I always heard in favour of the medieval armour bikinis is that sex sells. And since we have this system that more or less forces big companies to strive towards, well, selling their stuff, they kinda do have to.

Or did have to, since there have been rather big shifts in the perception of what does and doesn't sell lately.

« Last Edit: January 09, 2019, 12:37:02 pm by -Joshua- »

 

Offline Enioch

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Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
I'm assuming that you are a heterosexual male (correct me if I'm wrong). How would you feel if you had difficulty finding a game that didn't have gratuitous male fanservice, and everyone insisted that you had no right to object to it?

You are not wrong.

I obviously cannot state with any absolute certainty what I would feel in your hypothetical scenario, as my personal development in such a universe would probably have been different, but as I am right now, I believe that in such a case I truly wouldn't have a right to demand that such games not be produced.

I would have the right to express my displeasure and to encourage / reward the creation of games along my own preferences.
'Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent'  -Salvor Hardin, "Foundation"

So don't take a hammer to your computer. ;-)

 
Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
I'm assuming that you are a heterosexual male (correct me if I'm wrong). How would you feel if you had difficulty finding a game that didn't have gratuitous male fanservice, and everyone insisted that you had no right to object to it?

You are not wrong.

I obviously cannot state with any absolute certainty what I would feel in your hypothetical scenario, as my personal development in such a universe would probably have been different, but as I am right now, I believe that in such a case I truly wouldn't have a right to demand that such games not be produced.

I would have the right to express my displeasure and to encourage / reward the creation of games along my own preferences.

How is that any different from what I'm doing?
Shivans view most other species the way we view infectious diseases. They think they are doing good by curing the universe of them. After all, no one mourns the fate of smallpox.

The Final War For The Multiverse

 

Offline Enioch

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Re: Female characters done both wrong and right.
How is that any different from what I'm doing?

You are not limiting yourself to expressing your displeasure or to voting with your wallet.

You are actively demanding that such games not be produced:

Like I said, if you want to see that, that's what porn is for. Keep it separate from other media.

'Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent'  -Salvor Hardin, "Foundation"

So don't take a hammer to your computer. ;-)