Author Topic: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)  (Read 93795 times)

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Offline Trivial Psychic

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Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
wait... is that a captured shinden?
or perhaps an ascender prototype?
the shinden was supposed to be jet powered, I think... only the prototype mounted a piston engine.
There were plans for a jet-powered version, but the initial plans were solely for the piston-powered arrangement.  The J7W1 was in fact capable of reaching 469 mph, so it was no slouch, though reported plans for the turbojet version would have had it powered by a Japanese copy of a German jet engine, the Ne-130.  I don't think that it could have competed as well just one engine... not enough to warrant the poorer fuel consumption.
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Offline Thaeris

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Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
Do not forget that the Shinden was not fully tested, so its estimated performance figures should be taken with a grain of salt only. In fact, if my memory is accurate in this regard, its flight test program was minimal at best before the end of hostilities.

As for the Curtiss Ascender (whose name was actually a bad company joke, a little known fact which is a bit fun to point out), I'd not waste time even considering that one. The design of the aircraft was flawed in so many regards... it only makes it into WWII alt-history games as it looks cool. With this knowledge in mind, please go for something better like the Northrop XP-79B or the McDonnell XP-67 - you know, aircraft that with a bit more development time could have been of some value in service.
"trolls are clearly social rejects and therefore should be isolated from society, or perhaps impaled."

-Nuke



"Look on the bright side, how many release dates have been given for Doomsday, and it still isn't out yet.

It's the Duke Nukem Forever of prophecies..."


"Jesus saves.

Everyone else takes normal damage.
"

-Flipside

"pirating software is a lesser evil than stealing but its still evil. but since i pride myself for being evil, almost anything is fair game."


"i never understood why women get the creeps so ****ing easily. i mean most serial killers act perfectly normal, until they kill you."


-Nuke

 

Offline Commander Zane

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Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)


Now that's a good find.

Even though the turret layout is insane. Seriously, where do they store the Ammo for those guns?
ZeroSpace ordinance cells.

 
Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
ZeroSpace ordinance cells.

That would involve going ein Stein further from history than just having the Flugstein.
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Offline StarSlayer

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Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
A pair of fighters

Mixed up some P-51 and Recon Spitfire:



Blended one of my favorite aircraft the FW-190D-9 with elements of the FW-190C test plane.  Plus I slapped on the Iron Cross and Prussian Eagle:

“Think lightly of yourself and deeply of the world”

 
Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
Those are some nice sketches.

Yet another site for ideas: http://www.warbirds.jp/. This page in particular has some unorthodox designs, but I can only seem to view it in the Japanese language version of the site (the characters aren't correctly displayed on my computer though).

EDIT: The Dreadnought Project looks quite useful too. It has copies of historic ship plans. Granted, they look like old parchments but they're probably worth a look.

EDIT 2: And another: http://www.bigbadbattleships.com/.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2010, 12:48:35 pm by lostllama »

 

Offline Vardar

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Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
hey mates, sorry for the long wait, i had some busy days.

made something, first im gonna try and make a normal warship like ship and then ill try to figure out a way to add some flying to it, ideas are welcome






« Last Edit: November 26, 2010, 01:51:08 pm by The E »

 

Offline The E

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Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
Okay, first of all, instead of img, use lvlshot. This will resize the pic to the browser window size.

Second, that looks pretty cool already, but I would suggest to lengthen it a bit. It might just be the perspective (in which case a 3-view render might be a good idea), but it sort of looks rather short.
Third, I think the second turret should be a bit higher.

This is definitely an awesome start.

EDIT: While surfing the web for pics, I came across this:


I think this might be awesome. Even if I would probably think long and hard about keeping the #3 and #4 turrets......
« Last Edit: November 26, 2010, 02:06:14 pm by The E »
Let there be light
Let there be moon
Let there be stars and let there be you
Let there be monsters and let there be pain
Let us begin to feel again
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Offline Vardar

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Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
hmm nice picture.. i could really use that.

and i've done some quick changes to the model and used a 3d rendering program, take a look

working on a command hub, ill finish it up later


 

Offline The E

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Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
Actually, that does look quite good. I'd say you should start on the superstructure soon.

Also, you might want to consider adding stabilizers in the front and rear, as well as start thinking about the engines. My original concept was to use giant ducted fans in engine pods there (Reasoning being that they could be used underwater in a pinch, and that the ducting would shield the props from at least some battle damage).
Let there be light
Let there be moon
Let there be stars and let there be you
Let there be monsters and let there be pain
Let us begin to feel again
--Devin Townsend, Genesis

 

Offline StarSlayer

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Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
It's actually a conversion of two of their BBs, Ise and Hyuga if I'm not mistaken, after the they had the cream of their carrier crop sunk at Midway.  They were never actually used as such before they where destroyed themselves though. 

The Kingdom of Gryphon in my 'verse' actually uses a similar idea for their carriers, both the Undine class light cruisers and the Warspite class carrier dreadnoughts both use the rear flight deck setup.
“Think lightly of yourself and deeply of the world”

 

Offline Thaeris

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Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
The triangles! Do not model in them! You can already see the horrid situation it causes for lighting on the model!

Instead, make use of proper edge loops and model in quads where necessary. If you're splitting a quad into two triangles to make sure the model is properly smoothed, what that should be telling you instead is that you should make use of another edge loop to smooth out the surface. I'm not trying to be overly critical, instead I'd just like to see you forming better quality models.

Also, if I might make a design critique, I'd look into working on those gun barrels. They do look a bit like toothpicks.
"trolls are clearly social rejects and therefore should be isolated from society, or perhaps impaled."

-Nuke



"Look on the bright side, how many release dates have been given for Doomsday, and it still isn't out yet.

It's the Duke Nukem Forever of prophecies..."


"Jesus saves.

Everyone else takes normal damage.
"

-Flipside

"pirating software is a lesser evil than stealing but its still evil. but since i pride myself for being evil, almost anything is fair game."


"i never understood why women get the creeps so ****ing easily. i mean most serial killers act perfectly normal, until they kill you."


-Nuke

 

Offline General Battuta

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Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
The triangles! Do not model in them! You can already see the horrid situation it causes for lighting on the model!

Instead, make use of proper edge loops and model in quads where necessary. If you're splitting a quad into two triangles to make sure the model is properly smoothed, what that should be telling you instead is that you should make use of another edge loop to smooth out the surface. I'm not trying to be overly critical, instead I'd just like to see you forming better quality models.

This may be wildly stupid of me, but given that the engine automatically triangulates everything, is there any point to working with anything but triangles? Or is there a benefit to using quads and such at the pre-conversion stage?

 

Offline Angelus

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Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
The triangles! Do not model in them! You can already see the horrid situation it causes for lighting on the model!

Instead, make use of proper edge loops and model in quads where necessary. If you're splitting a quad into two triangles to make sure the model is properly smoothed, what that should be telling you instead is that you should make use of another edge loop to smooth out the surface. I'm not trying to be overly critical, instead I'd just like to see you forming better quality models.

This may be wildly stupid of me, but given that the engine automatically triangulates everything, is there any point to working with anything but triangles? Or is there a benefit to using quads and such at the pre-conversion stage?

apart from the stuff Thaeris mentioned, it's far easier to edit the mesh, when working with quads. There are situations where you need to extrude a part from the hull, and it requires more work when the mesh is already trinagulated.
while ( !asleep)     |     Building a Warmachine for FreeSpace: Chronicles of a dark Age        |       My WIP's                                 
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Offline Hades

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Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
[22:29] <sigtau> Hello, #hard-light?  I'm trying to tell a girl she looks really good for someone who doesn't exercise.  How do I word that non-offensively?
[22:29] <RangerKarl|AtWork> "you look like a big tasty muffin"
----
<batwota> wouldn’t that mean that it’s prepared to kiss your ass if you flank it :p
<batwota> wow
<batwota> KILL

  

Offline Thaeris

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Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
I make an issue of this as I used to model in a similar fashion to Vardar. After working with and learning from people like Quanto who are professionally trained in modeling, I can tell you why it's important to model in quads. I will also understand why you might opt for triangles in certain instances as well, though.

First, as mentioned, lighting issues. If I was fluent with a full-function modeling program like Blender, putting a fix on the "triangle mess" which is clearly visible in those renders might be less of an issue, but it would still be one more thing I'd need to do. A modeling program automatically triangulates any surface created, and thus automatically adjusts the lighting applied to that surface. Hand-triangulating, which I used to do a lot of, might correct some shape issues (like "dented-in" surfaces which shouldn't be dented in). If you're on a polygon budget, or need to ensure a particular part of the model is not left to chance when it comes to a program's automatic triangulation, that might be something to consider. However, that is probably NOT the case with regards to this model. That said, let me prove my point: anywhere a section has been triangulated, you see a triangle, not a smooth surface. Modeling in quads would most likely clear up this lighting problem.

Next, there's modeling in general. It's a heck of a lot easier to split a square than a triangle. Given that it's not 1996 anymore, polycount isn't too much of an issue, though that doesn't mean you need to be irresponsible with it, either. If there's an area where more curvature is needed, it probably means you need to insert another edge loop. Furthermore, using proper edge loops will allow you to get those nice, flowing shapes which are essential to aerodynamic or hydrodynamic vessels. If you don't know what I'm talking about, here's a wireframe and filled view of a turret modeled in quads - it will be pretty hard to find any triangles in this model.





Just to clarify terminology, an "edge loop" is a linked string of quads which runs over the expanse of a given model. In some parts of a model, it might indeed be hard to pull that off - making sure it can be pulled it off also should encourage a modeler to tactfully place and position every quad and vertex. Doing that in turn should help to ensure a properly and efficiently made model. Vardar, if I was to go back and fix a ship model I was working on for the longest time, the UXV, with a hull modeled in quads and proper edge loops, I can guarantee you that it would look much cleaner and much more realistic. If at all possible, leave triangulation as an automatic issue for PCS2 to fix.

Next, there's UV mapping. If you model in triangles, those edges are a new evil to deal with. That split edge will quite likely cause distortion and unnecessary hair pulling on your end getting that UV into shape. Modeling in quads, you're far less likely to suffer that fate.

Lastly, and this is outside the scope of FS2, modeling in quads is necessary for proper subdivision modeling. Triangles don't split all that easily, but quads do. Thus, when sbdividing a model, you want the outcome to be smooth and fluid. The best way to ensure that is to model in quads.

I hope this helps.  ;)
"trolls are clearly social rejects and therefore should be isolated from society, or perhaps impaled."

-Nuke



"Look on the bright side, how many release dates have been given for Doomsday, and it still isn't out yet.

It's the Duke Nukem Forever of prophecies..."


"Jesus saves.

Everyone else takes normal damage.
"

-Flipside

"pirating software is a lesser evil than stealing but its still evil. but since i pride myself for being evil, almost anything is fair game."


"i never understood why women get the creeps so ****ing easily. i mean most serial killers act perfectly normal, until they kill you."


-Nuke

 
Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
Dunno 'bout anyone else, but I for one found this quite informative. Thank ya much  :yes:


One thing, though; "If I was fluent with a full-function modeling program like Blender...."

So what prog do ya use?
Vegetables aren't food....vegetables are what food eats.

 

Offline Thaeris

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Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
I use a program called AC3D, which is a dedicated modeling and UV mapping program. Thus, I can't do advanced lighting features as in 3DS Max or animations. I mention Blender as it is capable of doing many of the same things Max can do - also, it's free.
"trolls are clearly social rejects and therefore should be isolated from society, or perhaps impaled."

-Nuke



"Look on the bright side, how many release dates have been given for Doomsday, and it still isn't out yet.

It's the Duke Nukem Forever of prophecies..."


"Jesus saves.

Everyone else takes normal damage.
"

-Flipside

"pirating software is a lesser evil than stealing but its still evil. but since i pride myself for being evil, almost anything is fair game."


"i never understood why women get the creeps so ****ing easily. i mean most serial killers act perfectly normal, until they kill you."


-Nuke

 
Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
From deviantART :D












 

Offline Vardar

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Re: Free Skies (The mod formerly known as Crimson Skies-ish)
*snip*

hmm ok.. so you mean i shouldnt use triangles while moddeling? cause then i really need to change the normal way i model, but that's not that big of a problem.. but would you suggest moving away from sketchup as a modeling tool? cause what i like about that is that its quite easy to use.


~vardar